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Super Revisions Bros (Proposing new Powers, Abilities, and Tiers)

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Telepathy's for/with Cappy, not in base.
Yeah, that seems fine.

So, seeing as how everyone is pretty skeptical with 4-A stats (unless it's via Creation), what's say we propose something like "likely/possibly/up to 4-C/High 4-C" physicals via these threads instead? I mean, we could use Kamek's baseline 4-C feat and Yoshi turning Raphael into a star.

Seem more reasonable? Admins don't seem to have a problem with that based upon the history in the threads.
 
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It is true that after looking at the Japanese text of Mario 64, some of the translators concluded that they merely created portals to the realms rather than actually create them. That being said, I do think there are other creation feats that are legit. With some being neglected in the past for faulty reasons, but the Mario 64 ones I'm talking about right now came to that conclusion it was simply portal creation.
Where's the translations exactly
 
So, seeing as how everyone is pretty skeptical with 4-A stats (unless it's via Creation), what's say we propose something like "likely/possibly/up to 4-C/High 4-C" physicals via these threads instead? I mean, we could use Kamek's baseline 4-C feat and Yoshi turning Raphael into a star.

Seem more reasonable? Admins don't seem to have a problem with that based upon the history in the threads.
Okay, are we fine with this or not?
 
Raven turning into a constellation via a smack ( Kamek inducing them to get bigger via magic) seemed to be contentious before actually; as Armorchompy had mentioned in the prior downgrade thread. You see him flash a lot before spiralling away and it can be labelled as a chain reaction upon death; toonforce; transmutation; just as likely since its mechanics are not logically explained.

Also Luma amp stuff those threads talk about could apply anyway.
 
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Automatic Translation​

Looking at the context of all of these, we already know that Mario should learn the Yoshi language since he's spent his entire life with Yoshis, considering nothing suggests they tried to teach it to him or anything.
Wasn’t that the entire point of riding Yoshi in Super Mario RPG? Because he had to translate due to being the only Yoshi who could speak Mario’s language?
 
Raven turning into a constellation via a smack ( Kamek inducing them to get bigger via magic) seemed to be contentious before actually; as Armorchompy had mentioned in the prior downgrade thread. You see him flash a lot before spiralling away and it can be labelled as a chain reaction upon death; toonforce; transmutation; just as likely since its mechanics are not logically explained.

Also Luma amp stuff those threads talk about could apply anyway.
Pretty sure Kamek's magic was the ultimate reason for the event. Not arguing further for scaling, just that the spell he casted on Raphael is what makes the most sense for that event to ultimately happen.
 
The Shroobs have only ever fought him, yet he could understand a complex dead language after only hearing a few phrases of it during combat with Shroobs over a few days' worth of time.
This was a game mechanic only unlocked after completing the story.
 
Raven turning into a constellation via a smack ( Kamek inducing them to get bigger via magic) seemed to be contentious before actually; as Armorchompy had mentioned in the prior downgrade thread. You see him flash a lot before spiralling away and it can be labelled as a chain reaction upon death; toonforce; transmutation; just as likely since its mechanics are not logically explained.

Also Luma amp stuff those threads talk about could apply anyway.
This does make me think 3-C with power stars is fine. The Japanese text link is broken though. I wouldn't use the BJ scan also, doesn't really imply much imo.
This is fine. For the people that are actually doing Creation feats, which I don't think Paper Mario and Rosalina are (I don't know SMRPG well enough to understand Mephistus' point about Exor but that might also not be valid), but yeah a separate rating for Creation abilities is ok.
Well, just as long as we can keep the 4-A and 3-C stats via Creation and Power Stars I'm fine with it. To me, I really don't see the point in giving Mario a Power Star without telling how powerful they can be.
 
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I think with proof that Mario's amped by the Stars in SM64 the Power Star stuff is fine to separate completely from the scaling.

One thing I noticed, though (and I promise this is not something I'm doing on purpose, I just really looked at the page now), is that I'm not actually sure about the 3-C rating for the power stars being valid. The galaxy creation feat is done by Lumas as they're fully fed, it's not something they can exactly do on a whim, I wouldn't assume the amp passively and constantly granted by a Power Star to be comparable to it. (If the energy that goes into creating a power star = the energy that goes into creating a galaxy, then the power passively granted by a power star every second that you're amped by it cannot be = to the power that goes into creating a galaxy/power star).

There's still the Stars' own creation feats, though, so at worst they'd scale to that.
 
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I think with proof that Mario's amped by the Stars in SM64 the Power Star stuff is fine to separate completely from the scaling.

One thing I noticed, though (and I promise this is not something I'm doing on purpose, I just really looked at the page now), is that I'm not actually sure about the 3-C rating for the power stars being valid. The galaxy creation feat is done by Lumas as they're fully fed, it's not something they can exactly do on a whim, I wouldn't assume the amp passively and constantly granted by a Power Star to be comparable to it. (If the energy that goes into creating a power star = the energy that goes into creating a galaxy, then the power passively granted by a power star every second that you're amped by it cannot be = to the power that's goes into creating a galaxy).

There's still the Stars' own creation feats, though, so at worst they'd scale to that.
Yeah, that's fine; just as long as Mario and everyone else can have their Power Star keys back and be placed at a higher tier.
There was an entire thread dedicated to how Power Stars actually don't create the worlds in Mario 64. Nothing posted here has debunked that, so everything you've posted is, as it stands now, irrelevant.
...The issue is that the Power Stars don't create those realms. Armor and I both posted links to the thread where that scaling was debunked.
Guides are extremely shakey at best. Also no, Bowser did not create them, this has been rejected.
Also rejected.
Just asking... If that's the case, then why do the Power Stars have Pocket Reality Manipulation which says "(Bowser was planning to use the Power Stars to create his own world in the castle paintings and walls[6])"? Shouldn't that be removed as well? No offense.
 
Is there a reason why we don't use game guides, btw? Wouldn't they give more context or evidence to a character's powers and abilities?
 
No, I meant what specifically is wrong in the Prima Guides?
Inconsistencies like wario and waluigi being brothers, i donr recall any other inconsistencies besides that one. Unless someone wants to specify every single one so then i can take prima being an invalid source more serious
 
I remember they get something wrong on like every page in the gen 1 pokemon guides. But really it's not specifically a Prima guides issue, it's just that they're not really looked at by Nintendo (or whoever's publishing them) that closely, it's just giving them some data on the game and the go ahead to write them. There are exceptions of guides that are either written in-house or written with close input from the devs and those I would consider 100% acceptable, but AFAIK Nintendo doesn't really ever do those.

If it helps a verse I'm working on has a MHS+ statement in a Prima Guide that I'm gonna have to ignore, and rate them as like Subsonic+ so I suffer from this too

EDIT: This is a side note but one thing I personally consider guides acceptable to use for is describing gameplay mechanics that are maybe never openly described in the game proper, sort of providing a semi-official statement of how they work alongside, preferably a scan of the actual game
 
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I remember they get something wrong on like every page in the gen 1 pokemon guides. But really it's not specifically a Prima guides issue, it's just that they're not really looked at by Nintendo (or whoever's publishing them) that closely, it's just giving them some data on the game and the go ahead to write them. There are exceptions of guides that are either written in-house or written with close input from the devs and those I would consider 100% acceptable, but AFAIK Nintendo doesn't really ever do those.
What kinds of game guides for Super Mario would be acceptable, then, if not the ones I posted? Can you list some examples?
 
No, I in fact cannot, I don't have in-depth knowledge of every single Mario guide ever published.
 
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It's a shame we can't even get a "possibly 3-A" rating for the Power Stars, and that was the lowest value I thought could be appropriate. Maybe for another CRT I'll try and find out what exactly created the realms.
 
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When it comes to Mario guides things like the official SPM guide is probably fine, but things like the prims guides should be left off the table.
 
the official SPM guide is probably fine, but things like the prims guides should be left off the table.
It should get due process as a tertiary source if we go by the canon page, we only discredit the source if it actually contradicts the og. Its official in name, even if the author(s) didn't oversee it.

Also we use prima of the SPM one and similar guides of other games on the mario pages currently since like a year back for that reason, as far as I care.

Also statistics reduction section on Mario's page links to a page of the Smg prima guide.
 
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Would this even work fully? Mario can still fight King Bob-omb with no stars when he wields one at the very beginning of the game and all.
You know, that's a good thought. Maybe we could keep Mario at 6-C and give him something like a "likely/possibly 3-C", provided nobody has a problem with it.
 
You know, that's a good thought. Maybe we could keep Mario at 6-C and give him something like a "likely/possibly 3-C", provided nobody has a problem with it.
There was a whole ass thread where I provided a long long list of "problems with it". No chance.
 
There was a whole ass thread where I provided a long long list of "problems with it". No chance.
Okay, then we could just bring the Power Star key back... I dunno why we couldn't give Mario a "possibly/likely 3-C"...
 
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The Grand Star scan 404s for me. You should add sources for the intelligence scans. Finally the LS calc I did for throwing Metal Bowser is only for with Power Stars

For the AP stuff though, there is what kirbonic brought up. Personally I think it's fine because King Bob-Omb doesn't actually seem to be hurt by Mario's attacks and more just sorta loses a contest, and if you break the rules it gets mad and starts the fight over.


I think with proof that Mario's amped by the Stars in SM64 the Power Star stuff is fine to separate completely from the scaling.

One thing I noticed, though (and I promise this is not something I'm doing on purpose, I just really looked at the page now), is that I'm not actually sure about the 3-C rating for the power stars being valid. The galaxy creation feat is done by Lumas as they're fully fed, it's not something they can exactly do on a whim, I wouldn't assume the amp passively and constantly granted by a Power Star to be comparable to it. (If the energy that goes into creating a power star = the energy that goes into creating a galaxy, then the power passively granted by a power star every second that you're amped by it cannot be = to the power that goes into creating a galaxy/power star).

There's still the Stars' own creation feats, though, so at worst they'd scale to that.
There is this though
 
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