ShakeResounding
He/Him- 8,587
- 7,289
It's the NuScholars getting too cocky...
-
This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.
For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here. -
We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.
Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.
Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page. -
Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.
Sonic General Discussion Zone Act 1: New Frontiers
- Thread starter Maverick_Zero_X
- Start date
- 5,798
- 1,686
I’ve always been a fan of gliding my d**k over the proverbial sonic chainsaw
- 320
- 477
Well that’s certainly a way to put it
- 2,395
- 1,312
Also, I'll have to do research on brane cosmologies in order to make my case since string theory by itself doesn't grant higher dimensionality in the wiki unless it's specifically a brane cosmology. Thread 'String Theory' https://vsbattles.com/threads/string-theory.167572/
Zones in Archie do look like branes if I recall correctly, but I don't know if that's enough.
- 1,018
- 446
- 6,022
- 8,695
Erm... weird flex but ok...? Nah! WTF!?!
- 3,182
- 2,954
Windii is already working on translations of the new game in Japanese, if there are any differences you can check it on Windii's releases.
- 6,367
- 8,434
So those moments where Black Doom is ******* around with space and time are a "world" of his which he created himself. The English dub simply referred to it as his creation, so that's a clarification for what Big Doom created.
- 2,395
- 1,312
Power-scalers outside of here all say that Japanese scripts are irrelevant when it comes to Ian Flynn re-writes. How do I explain to them that the Japanese and english versions are both canon? It is admittedly confusing
- 3,182
- 2,954
If one wants something direct, Ian himself told so during Bumblekasts. In general, it's just to look at what gets made from it. The Japanese-only material uses the Japanese scripts and makes references to them, and the Japanese-only material are canon even without translation as stated by Ian himself, so of course the Japanese scripts are canon.
The way Ian explains is more like the content being multi-layered, stuff that isn't contradictory between the translations are still valid, there's just a lot of thing that can be represented with dialogue.
If anything, the general fandom just has a very distorted concept of canon that basically only fits with the concepts of one person that worked with Sonic before, Ken Penders.
- 6,367
- 8,434
Question, if you don't mind me asking: how is it that handled when the Japanese and English scripts are equally canon? Because IIRC, Ian Flynn was the one who wrote the story of Frontiers, which got adapted by Morio Kishimoto into the Japanese language, so wouldn't the English dub take precedence?
- 8,465
- 5,076
Going to be honest those who think that are simply fools. Japanese script has always been the priority and Ian answer to Sonic Team, not the contrary.
- 1,018
- 446
Fighting an uphill battle I see
- 3,182
- 2,954
It would depend on having a "canon priority" to begin with, something that has never been stated by anyone working on Sonic, and even denied by Ian himself. The two versions of the script coexist, it has no need to follow one singular continuous line of event, just accept everything happened and move on. It's the way that Ian also describes how both endings of Sonic Frontiers are canon, the story will follow from "The End is defeated and Sage is alive", which is true for both endings. The specifics of how it happened do not matter.
- 2,395
- 1,312
I was under the impression that both were in an akward state of being equally canon somehow. Don't remember where I got this from though so...
r/deathbattle is riding the **** out of the "Time Eater got nerfed to universal+ LMAO" train.
- 24
- 17
For anyone who's played the game what does Shadow Generations do for Black Doom in terms of scaling?
- 1,018
- 446
Oh I've seen it alright
- 6,367
- 8,434
So in layman's terms: both the Japanese and English scripts are equally canon to one another and that everything that happened in both are important to each other without one being above the other? Gotcha.
It makes sense, to be honest. And the Japanese scripts for Sonic games, from my personal observations, tend to have more exposition in the writing so I can understand why both the English and Japanese dubs would be equally canon.
- 8,465
- 5,076
- 5,798
- 1,686
Man, Fox just really has it out for this blue rat huh
- 328
- 32
Aren’t the original English script and the Ian Flynn rewrites both canon?
- 6,367
- 8,434
Mind elaborating on this one? Because I'm curious about what this statement entails.
- 5,798
- 1,686
Just read the r/deathbattle post and you’ll see
- 3,182
- 2,954
Yeah, for some reason a lot of people only think of canon as a singular version of a work made by one person and that only, with everything else being non-canon. Such limited view about canon although common if by far not all there's, if anything, Sonic having two coexisting scripts that are basically the same thing using a few different keywords sometimes (At least as of late not counting Frontiers) is really not that impressive.
There are definitely works that are far more "just accept anything" in terms of canon, some that I think are more well known because it's directly connected with the plot (Like the TES franchise), while others not (Since I'm more of a Digimon guy, I need to say that there are a lot more "definitely contradictory stuff" that are just accepted as canon there than just conflict between two translations with Sonic).
Maybe one day people will move on from this Western based almost monotheistic understanding of canon.
- 2,395
- 1,312
You mean the original Japanese script? Yeah, that's what we're saying, including Ian himself.
- 328
- 32
English Script. That would include the original scenes that were edited as well.
- 6,367
- 8,434
Eh, I'm not one to read those type of posts since I know that the user's going to have power scaling takes that are different from you and I'd power scaling takes.
So even if I disagree with them, I'm not going to be bothered by them because it ultimately doesn't affect me.
It doesn't help that there are some people on the internet who hold the Japanese scripts for Sonic games in high regard and essentially disregard the English scripts.
It's hard to explain what I mean by that, to be honest, but I've noticed a lot of these so called "purits" who look down on the westernized Sonic and treat the Japanese variation as the true form of the franchise or some bullshit like that.
- 5,798
- 1,686
Dude is basically in every single reply continuously saying that Time Eater was nerfed and that Sonic is fodder now, he wants him dead.
- 2,395
- 1,312
- 5,798
- 1,686
Honestly though with current reasoning, most I can see is a drop to 5-D cuz of no more hypertimeline.
- 2,395
- 1,312
How would this even remove the hypertimeline?
- 6,367
- 8,434
How was the Time Eater even nerfed in the rewrites? The rewrites gave us a pretty blatant immeasurable speed statement for the Time Eater, and even the whole singular timeline thing doesn't matter much when Eggman states that the Time Eater would give him control over ALL of time and allow him and his past self to reshape everything after erasing it with the Time Eater.
Even then: I'd actually argue that Shadow Generations retroactively bumps up the Time Eater simply under the basis that it brought back Mephiles after he was snuffed out of existence when 06 was retconned. Meaning that the Time Eater can quite arguably affect events as powerful as 06.
- 5,798
- 1,686
I guess cuz dimension of time implying that time is the same across every dimension, meaning there isn’t two layers of time.
- 3,182
- 2,954
Do people actually think Hypertimeline is a real usable term by most media and a media not using it is "proof it isn't"? I'll never understand how people got this view that the terminology on the Wiki and VsBoards should be the measure stick of terms in the works themselves, instead of understanding the works as individual things that get a translation when put into the Vs context.
Of course almost no work will make use of the term hypertimeline, that is a made-up term to describe something that before already existed, but since people either didn't know specifics or wanted to see it beyond the constraints of previous understanding, ended up starting to use the term.
The truth is, most people won't really know the meaning of that or why it's used, so it's sadly just as true that most people will have unrealistic expectations about it.
- 2,395
- 1,312
There is more than one dimension of space, but you don't see anyone claiming that a clearly 3D universe is suddenly 1D because of such statements lol
- 5,798
- 1,686
Tbf I think some of the hypertimeline evidence could easily be reworked into the CE restoring time.
- 6,367
- 8,434
So I watched the Japanese dub of Shadow Generations' story and, unlike the English dub, Gerald states that he and Maria were returning to their timeline as opposed to the point in time line from the English dub.
Given that one guidebook's statement of Crisis City from Sonic Generations being a universe, I wonder if Gerald's line gives in universe credence to levels in Sonic and Shadow Generations being their own timelines/universes as opposed to being just points in time of the timeline.
Given that one guidebook's statement of Crisis City from Sonic Generations being a universe, I wonder if Gerald's line gives in universe credence to levels in Sonic and Shadow Generations being their own timelines/universes as opposed to being just points in time of the timeline.
- 2,395
- 1,312
Before Time Eater got full-on cosmology scaling, he was actually 2-C for this exact reason.
Anyway, I'm really stoked for Shake's CRT on the game. Hopefully that allows us to finally move past this Time Eater AP discussion.
- 11,927
- 4,282
.....what are you talking about? nothing on there removes Hypertimeline......it honestly makes it more explicit
- 447
- 340
People on Twitter bitching about the lightning again like Super Sonic hasn't had it longer than most of them have been alive. Brand synergy this, copying the flash that,bla,bla,bla. Base form I could see a valid argument for being against,but saying he should never have it is dumb or that he's never had it before the films is factually incorrect. Personally I like Base=wind,Super=lightning.
Similar threads
