Sonic Forces Speed Battle abilities CRT

[DragonLord]

I suppose if people disagree these will be the pages on the wiki that need changing to remove the speed Battle abilities

-Classic Sonic has Ice Boost listed
-Caliburn has Meteor Charge listed
-Chaos has Ice Wave, Ice Mine and Ice Boost listed

there may be more but I know these already have them listed and should be removed if people believe this shouldn’t be use (I mean I think it’s fine but still)

 

[Theuser789]

That should be easy, but again, you should ask a staff

 

[DragonLord]

I know one staff member was following this thread, didn’t seem like any others were interested or knowledgeable enough to comment, least not yet

 

[JED]

I know one staff member was following this thread, didn’t seem like any others were interested or knowledgeable enough to comment, least not yet

You can ask anyone of them. This is a very straightforward thing that you doesn’t require much knowledge on the verse to answer

 

[DragonLord]

You can ask anyone of them. This is a very straightforward thing that you doesn’t require much knowledge on the verse to answer

I’m not entirely sure many would have knowledge of Sonic canon standards (specially since none of them are actually on the supporters section I believe) but I’ll try

 

[Qawsedf234]

I would link more direct hyperlinks but at a glance its fine to apply them as power up related abilities.

Though all of them would need to be noted as item induced powers and not something that can use solo.

 

[DragonLord]

I would link more direct hyperlinks but at a glance its fine to apply them as power up related abilities.

Though all of them would need to be noted as item induced powers and not something that can use solo.

I See, I was a bit confused on if there actually Items since some of them (Like Whirlwind on Charmy or Blaze with Fire Boost) are just straight up abilities the characters use in there games, but I guess it’s fair to say there items

 

[GyroNutz]

Two questions:

Can you summarise the arguments for and against this game being canon?

Is breaking out of being frozen considered to be Resistance to Ice Manipulation now? I'd have thought that being frozen in the first place would indicate a lack of resistance, but I'm not sure how we treat this generally.

 

[DragonLord]

Can you summarise the arguments for and against this game being canon

My argument is that it’s an official Game made by Sega (who can be strict in how there Characters are portrayed), with the mainline Sonic development team (Iizuka specifically) approving of it, and the game is strictly related to a Mainline product (Sonic Forces) even sharing it’s name, it’s also marketed pretty heavily even getting it’s own moment In the recent Sonic Central livestream

the Argument against is that it’s a Plotless Mobile game that has some Characters and elements from Other Sonic continuities (Movie Sonic, Tangle and Whisper for example)

Is breaking out of being frozen considered to be Resistance to Ice Manipulation now? I'd have thought that being frozen in the first place would indicate a lack of resistance, but I'm not sure how we treat this generally

I’m not entirely sure, but I remember it being listed a few times on other profiles, like the Sonic profile itself lists this

 

[sanicspood]

why does it being created by sega matter :|

 

[DragonLord]

why does it being created by sega matter :|

I mean, a Sonic Game would need to be made by Sega to be canon in the first place lol

more specifically, I was told by a Mod that “anything published by Sega” would be considered and this game certainly is, in fact it’s not really even made by a company Sega hired like BioWare or BigRedButton it’s made by a branch of Sega called Sega Hardlight

 

[sanicspood]

oh

 

[GyroNutz]

The marketing isn't really relevant, though the only potential issue I see is the crossover stuff with movie sonic etc. How heavily does that feature in the game?

 

[JED]

The marketing isn't really relevant, though the only potential issue I see is the crossover stuff with movie sonic etc. How heavily does that feature in the game?

He was an unlockable character for a couple weeks when the movie first came out. But that was almost a year and a half ago.

 

[DragonLord]

The marketing isn't really relevant, though the only potential issue I see is the crossover stuff with movie sonic etc. How heavily does that feature in the game?

1 limited time event for the movie characters, the IDW characters are normal unlocks and a stage has the Movie Badniks in there (technically speaking though the Other characters are illusions made by the phantom Ruby)
Other then that the game is pretty much focused on being Mainline Sonic themed, being named after Sonic Forces and all

 

[GyroNutz]

Idk, that seems like a fair amount of crossover content. I take it the game isn't mentioned/referenced by any other canon games?

 

[DragonLord]

Idk, that seems like a fair amount of crossover content. I take it the game isn't mentioned/referenced by any other canon games?

I guess not, but I don’t particularly see the crossover stuff as bad when Sonic games just have a knack for that in general, hell you can go through the entire game wearing Joker’s mask in Forces, or Nights having there own section in Sonic Adventure, or Sally and the Anarchy Beryl’s having a shoutout in the canon Forces Comic, at least here the Crossover Characters are explicitly illusions when playing as a Game Character

in the end it at worst seems to go under the one sided crossover rules, the Movie stuff isn’t a huge part of the game

 

[GyroNutz]

I mean, stuff like small aesthetic references is fine, it's more the fact that there's several instances of non-canon stuff in this sonic game that are each more significant than, say, an aesthetic nod to Persona. The game doesn't seem to have the most concrete canonicity aside from that anyway. I'd personally lean towards it being non-canon, but I'm open to what others have to say

 

[DragonLord]

I mean, stuff like small aesthetic references is fine, it's more the fact that there's several instances of non-canon stuff in this sonic game that are each more significant than, say, an aesthetic nod to Persona. The game doesn't seem to have the most concrete canonicity aside from that anyway. I'd personally lean towards it being non-canon, but I'm open to what others have to say

I mean, in Sonic Adventure Nights just kinda appears in the Pinball level, and then go through the entire first level of there game, I feel that’s very much more then just a aesthetic nod

 

[Theuser789]

Nights being canon to Sonic is different from IDW and Movie Sonic being canon to the main series, bad analogy

 

[DragonLord]

Nights being canon to Sonic is different from IDW and Movie Sonic being canon to the main series, bad analogy

I don’t really see why, I don’t think ether are canon, it’s just a fun little thing they added because they could just as much as Samus appearing in Kirby or Commander Keen appearing in Doom or Darth Vader in Soul Calibur or having Sonic use Movie Sonic’s Boost style for a special unlockable

 

[SamanPatou]

The powers themselves are fine as Optional Equipment, but I'm not going to argue about canonicity, as I'm not knowledgeable enough about it, so I leave this judgement to Sonic experts.

 

[DragonLord]

Thank you for your input, though what counts as optional on the Sonic page has been kinda confusing to me considering one of the standard equipment listed is just plain “Item Box”, which is how these items are gotten in the game

 

[DragonLord]

Still seems kinda unsure what do to here, though I suppose another thing to add is if Sonic’s Ice Manipulation resistance should be removed considering breaking out of ice doesn’t count apparently?, I’m not sure

 

[Theuser789]

It definitvely counts, I have seen several pages with that listed

 

[GyroNutz]

I've seen several pages where it hasn't. For what reason exactly would ice resistance be given?

 

[DragonLord]

I've seen several pages where it hasn't. For what reason exactly would ice resistance be given?

I think the idea is that they’d have some form of Ice Resistance if they can break out of being frozen through pure strength

 

[Theuser789]

If a page doesn't have it, it's probably because it's outdated, unless you have seen people actualy reject it

Anyways, if someone's ice doesn't immobilize you and you are capable of breaking out of it with your own physical strengh then you resist the ice otherwise you wouldn't be capable of breaking it

 

[GyroNutz]

I mean, you still get frozen in the first place. You're just strong enough to break ice, which anyone above like 9-B should be capable of. Unless the argument is that being put in ice should be cold enough to shut down motor functions, which I don't think it necessarily is?

If it's something the site accepts generally, then I suppose it's fine, but I'd like to understand why first.

 

[Theuser789]

which anyone above like 9-B should be capable of.

Except there's people above 9-B who can't break out of ice sometimes, even in the Sonic series

 

[GlaceonGamez471]

snip

Just saw that all 3 Babylon Rogues have Speed Battle stuff listed on their profiles as well.

 

[DragonLord]

Just saw that all 3 Babylon Rogues have Speed Battle stuff listed on their profiles as well.

Alright good to know

 

[DragonLord]

CRT’s aren’t a popularity contest, but considering it seems the thread hasn’t really reached a proper unanimous opinion I suppose it should be fine to count

Agree (5): JED, fastestthingalive50, Qawsedf234 (Staff), SamanPatou (Staff), Maverick_Hunter X

Neutral (1): TheUser789 (though I assume leaning on Disagree)

Disagree and remove the already added Abilties (3): Gilad_Hyperstar, GyroNutz (Staff), Sonicspood

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

I think adding them is fine

 

[DragonLord]

I think adding them is fine

Wow, Quick turn but thanks

 

[sanicspood]

i disagree with adding these abilities, if there not canon then why add them

 

[Antvasima]

What are the conclusions here so far?

 

[DragonLord]

What are the conclusions here so far?

2 Staff Members and 5 supporters think the changes are fine, GyroNutz and 2 supporters don’t arguing canonicity of the game

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. Please elaborate regarding the arguments for and against.

 

[DragonLord]

Okay. Please elaborate regarding the arguments for and against.

The Argument against was that the Game has no Plot and features crossover content

Argument for is that the Game is an officially licensed product made by Sega that was approved by one of the main heads of the franchise (Iizuka) and that Crossover content isn’t the main focus of the game, at worst I feel it goes under the one sided Crossover category (and the crossover content in the game itself are technically illusions), Plus I feel similar stuff for Sonic has been approved before