Shibai Ōtsutsuki vs 666:Satan - Ōtsutsuki God vs The Champion Among Gods

[Samlex1234]

No actually I very much addressed this. Satan can jump thousands of times into 3-B if left alone for few hours even without sun, if Shibai leaves him near a functional star he'll come back to a dimension filled with hundreds of gajillions of 3-A Satans.

Omnipotence doesn't work on Otsutsuki. Satan can copy genes of people and grow them in place of his.
Giving Satan prep time is literally the single worst thing you can possibly do because he'll copy everything he saw from you and come chase you trillion times stronger.

Looks like you don't understand. Shibai literally is in his dimension before satan even has the chance to read his mind.

 

[DavidTPPM]

NLF
almost like saying ben 10 can copy goku saiyan genes

Once again mis-using NLF. There's nothing that would fulfill NLF in my argument.
Satan can canonically copy genes and attacks restricted to certain genes. Saying he can copy Shibais genes is not saying he can copy literally any genes in fiction.

Also you do realize that simply naming a fallacy is not enough as a counter argument right? You have to actually explain how and why it's that fallacy.

 

[KaydeeX]

I don’t care, stop arguing against the values in the profiles. Go change it if you don't like it

that flimsy justification doesn’t “upscale him”

He couldn't because Orochimaru and Hiruzen are both MHS+

For the bazillionth time the profile are outdated. Hiruzen justifications for mhs is literally keeping up with Edo hiruzen

Then prove it. You asked why you should prove it I'm telling you because you made the claim. I don't care what you think you based it on PROVE IT

holy yap

Because YOU CLAIMED IT. Don't make claims you can't prove. Do I really have to explain basic burden of proof to you?

man what in the steroids are you on? Yes i made the claim based on what’s shown. that’s already enough proof
It’s like asking for proof when i state “the sky isn’t brown” based on logical conclusions.

You didn't even give a reason for why your comparison would be different.

Yes i did literally.

 

[Iabihs]

Yk why stats are an issue? Because simply Satan breathing in Shibais direction is enough to vaporize him. Meaning Satan taking a blow from his attacks will be still much more devastating to Shibai than Satan.

Yeah so why are you saying going into daikokuten is a bad move for Shibai?

Like you said it was a bad move cuz satan would also get stronger but like hes already strong enough to aura flex him

 

[KaydeeX]

Satan can canonically copy genes and attacks restricted to certain genes. Saying he can copy Shibais genes is not saying he can copy literally any genes in fiction.

This is literally NLF applicable. He’s shown to copy genes doesn’t mean he can’t copy ALL genes.
this is you assuming he doesn’t have a limit hence NLF

 

[Iabihs]

This is literally NLF applicable. He’s shown to copy genes doesn’t mean he can’t copy ALL genes.
this is you assuming he doesn’t have a limit hence NLF

Does Shibai have a resistance to gene copy? Im not sure its nlf if he doesnt

 

[DavidTPPM]

Yep, this is a stomp. Shibai literally don't even need to be on the battlefield to win. None of satan attack has the capable range to affect Shibai.

Except Shibai does START on the battlefield and is immediately mind ****** and depowered due to passive fear hax. And even if he were to survive it without falling unconscious, Satan still has every opportunity to copy any abilities he reads out of Shibais mind or sees him use.

So while yes, assuming a NLF that Shibai can reality warp quintillions of clones all trillions of times stronger than himself, he might have a win con, he would need to start in daikokuten to pull it off

Looks like you don't understand. Shibai literally is in his dimension before satan even has the chance to read his mind.

I would love to see an explanation on how Shibai gets over crippling fear, looks into the future to see he needs to run away, and runs through a slowass portal, all before Satan can even think

 

[Samlex1234]

This is literally NLF applicable. He’s shown to copy genes doesn’t mean he can’t copy ALL genes.
this is you assuming he doesn’t have a limit hence NLF

Lol you don't even have to go that far. He can't even copy Shibai's gene because Shibai can enter his dimension instantly.

 

[DavidTPPM]

that flimsy justification doesn’t “upscale him”

It literally OFFICIALLY does. If you don't like it go argue off site but I don't care about your personal opinions here on vsbw.

For the bazillionth time the profile are outdated.

That's what you may think and I don't care. I fully agree with them so all you can do is stop complaining.

Hiruzen justifications for mhs is literally keeping up with Edo hiruzen

I don’t care.

holy yap

If you're not going to prove your claims and keep going against the profiles then please leave the conversation. You're not bringing anything worthwhile and just add unnecessary toxicity to the thread.

man what in the steroids are you on?

Steroids only affect your body, rarely ever mind (and not in ways you'd notice anyway). But at this point I'm not surprised you don't know what steroids are…

Yes i made the claim based on what’s shown

Then prove it or leave the conversation.

that’s already enough proof

You didn't give any proof. This is like the 3rd message of me asking and you refusing.

It’s like asking for proof when i state “the sky isn’t brown” based on logical conclusions.

False equivalence. You're refusing to provide crucial evidence for a major part of your argument.

Yes i did literally.

No you literally just said "a better reference would be". That's literally just nuh uh.

 

[DavidTPPM]

Yeah so why are you saying going into daikokuten is a bad move for Shibai?

I already explained why. It makes the gap even worse and allows Satan to copy whatever he saw or read while preparing quintillions of clones.

Like you said it was a bad move cuz satan would also get stronger but like hes already strong enough to aura flex him

Yeah which is why Shibai loses from the start. I'm saying going to daikokuten just makes matters worse.

 

[DavidTPPM]

This is literally NLF applicable. He’s shown to copy genes doesn’t mean he can’t copy ALL genes.

No I'm not. Shibais genes ≠ ALL genes. There's nothing about Shibais genes that would make copying his genes harder than Odins or Okhwangs. Hell in GoH genetic material is a part of a type 3 concept and type 2 information and yet Satan can copy it so saying he can't copy Shibais genes is completely baseless.

this is you assuming he doesn’t have a limit hence NLF

No, he very much does have a limit. You just didn't provide any evidence Shibai would be somehow beyond that limit.

 

[DavidTPPM]

Lol you don't even have to go that far. He can't even copy Shibai's gene because Shibai can enter his dimension instantly.

1. He can't because he'll start collapsing from Satans fear aura.
2. Prove it's in character
3. Satan doesn't need to read his mind to copy something.

 

[KaydeeX]

It literally OFFICIALLY does. If you don't like it go argue off site but I don't care about your personal opinions here on vsbw

prove this. because it’s the same value he and oro scale to anyways.

That's what you may think and I don't care. I fully agree with them so all you can do is stop complaining.
I don’t care.

wym you don’t care. you don’t reason?
the profiles are simply outdated and are in the works. what you think doesn’t matter honey

Then prove it or leave the conversation.

prove that the omnipotence doesn’t evolve?
simple: it was never stated or shown to do such.
It’s just like how i can comfortably say Sasuke hair isn’t rainbow colored

False equivalence. You're refusing to provide crucial evidence for a major part of your argume

how is it a false equivalence

No you literally just said "a better reference would be". That's literally just nuh uh.

I gave a reason why yours is unusable. The reason being “you assumed the omnipotence evolve just like the sharingan does”. I then gave a more suitable equivalence to further project my thoughts, then you said “nuh uh”.

No I'm not. Shibais genes ≠ ALL genes. There's nothing about Shibais genes that would make copying his genes harder than Odins or Okhwangs. Hell in GoH genetic material is a part of a type 3 concept and type 2 information and yet Satan can copy it so saying he can't copy Shibais genes is completely baseless.

Shibai Genes is literally within all genes.
the nlf page literally says

“This is when someone states that because something has not demonstrated any limits (or only certain limits) then it has none (or only the ones demonstrated).”

 

[First_Witch]

No I'm not. Shibais genes ≠ ALL genes. There's nothing about Shibais genes that would make copying his genes harder than Odins or Okhwangs. Hell in GoH genetic material is a part of a type 3 concept and type 2 information and yet Satan can copy it so saying he can't copy Shibais genes is completely baseless.

Shibai Genes is literally within all genes.
the nlf page literally says

This is literally a knockout argument, how is this even debateable. Satan can, unless an actual argument is presented, copy Shibais powers.

 

[Samlex1234]

Except Shibai does START on the battlefield and is immediately mind ****** and depowered due to passive fear hax. And even if he were to survive it without falling unconscious, Satan still has every opportunity to copy any abilities he reads out of Shibais mind or sees him use.

What am I seeing? Doesn't Shibai straight up resist Fear manipulation, which itself is a subset of Empathic Manipulation? No fear, hax is not working on Shibai.

 

[KaydeeX]

This is literally a knockout argument

no it’s not, Shibai genes are not within the spectrum of what Satan has been shown to copy.

 

[First_Witch]

no it’s not, Shibai genes are not within the spectrum of what Satan has been shown to copy.

What makes Shibais genes special that they superceed being a type 3 concept and type 2 information?

 

[DavidTPPM]

prove this. because it’s the same value he and oro scale to anyways.

It's literally in their profiles?

wym you don’t care. you don’t reason?

I reason. I agree with the profile and the profile are considered factual here. So I have literally 0 reason to take your belief over the wiki and my belief combined.

the profiles are simply outdated and are in the works.

That's what you think. And yk, like you said

what you think doesn’t matter honey

So either go make a CRT to change it or deal with it. Either way stop crying to me about it.

prove that the omnipotence doesn’t evolve?
simple: it was never stated or shown to do such.

Appeal to ignorance. Just because something was not stated (lack of evidence) doesn't mean it's not true. It simply means we don't know.

It’s just like how i can comfortably say Sasuke hair isn’t rainbow colored

Because you have canon evidence showing his hair as non rainbow colored. But if we didn't have that, I'd still ask you to prove that claim.

how is it a false equivalence

Because you're comparing me asking for crucial evidence to asking for evidence of something that we've already seen the evidence for. 2 entirely different incomparable things.

I gave a reason why yours is unusable. The reason being “you assumed the omnipotence evolve just like the sharingan does”.

No that's a strawman. I didn't assume it's just like the sharingan because we don't know. I pointed out that sharingan is a derivation of a higher ability and yet it has its own unique abilities meaning it's possible that omnipotence behaves the same.
I'm not saying it is or isn't true I'm saying it's possible because you're acting like it's not.

I then gave a more suitable equivalence to further project my thoughts, then you said “nuh uh”.

You gave a comparison with 0 actual arguments for why it's superior.

Shibai Genes is literally within all genes.
the nlf page literally says

Wdym it's "within all genes"? You mean he has all genes in the verse? Because that isn't even true as if it was the wiki would accept him having all kekkei genkai type abilities

What am I seeing? Doesn't Shibai straight up resist Fear manipulation, which itself is a subset of Empathic Manipulation? No fear, hax is not working on Shibai.

You weren't paying attention to the thread because Satan has at least 3 accepted layers of fear manipulation and far greater quality of fear manip than Shibai.

 

[DavidTPPM]

no it’s not, Shibai genes are not within the spectrum of what Satan has been shown to copy.

That's another argument from ignorance . That's like saying "Satan isn't within the spectrum of what Shibai has been shown capable of reality warping". Satan doesn't need to specifically copy Shibai to be able to copy him as long as there isn't some argument for why copying Shibai would be more difficult.

 

[KaydeeX]

It's literally in their profiles?

they scale to the same value profile wise
where’s the upscale ?

I agree with the profile and the profile are considered factual here. So I have literally 0 reason to take your belief over the wiki and my belief combined.

the same profile also says Hiruzen can keep up with Tobirama
put 2 and 2 together, slowly.

I didn't assume it's just like the sharingan because we don't know. I pointed out that sharingan is a derivation of a higher ability and yet it has its own unique abilities meaning it's possible that omnipotence behaves the same.

Then i asked you to prove why and how omnipotence behaves the same, since we have no proof of that currently.

You gave a comparison with 0 actual arguments for why it's superior.

I did, A having better control and knowledge over the same ability B has but with no knowledge and control, already denotes A can do anything B can do.

Wdym it's "within all genes"? You mean he has all genes in the verse?

no it’s within “all” in the sense of what Satan can’t copy due to nlf

 

[karo_senpaii]

This stuff is 4 pages in a few hours. Enough points has been said. Please vote and move on. Also please switch my vote to neutral. The reason I think Satan wins comes out as a stomp

 

[Testarossa002]

Satan pretty much stomps
Shibai has 0 accepted fear resistance layers. So he's paralysed in the presence of someone who can one-shot him with the twitch of a muscle
There's no escaping that

 

[Deceived3596]

I'll start counting votes later today.

 

[Samlex1234]

Please leave this open till tomorrow at least i have a few things to address

 

[Wankbreaker]

Satan wins FRA

 

[GodSinBad2280]

I vote for Satan.

 

[Samlex1234]

You weren't paying attention to the thread because Satan has at least 3 accepted layers of fear manipulation and far greater quality of fear manip than Shibai.

Shibai has layered resistance to Fear manipulation scaling of Sasuke who has layered fear manipulation via sharigan. 3 layers of Fear manipulation is not working on Shibai.

 

[GodSinBad2280]

Shibai has layered resistance to Fear manipulation scaling of Sasuke who has layered fear manipulation via sharigan. 3 layers of Fear manipulation is not working on Shibai.

Has it been accepted already? GoH has been accepted now.

 

[GodSinBad2280]

This argument should come to an end now, as Shibai has no way to counter Satan's powerful hax. This is a true stomp.

 

[DavidTPPM]

Shibai has layered resistance to Fear manipulation scaling of Sasuke who has layered fear manipulation via sharigan. 3 layers of Fear manipulation is not working on Shibai.

Can you show me where 3 layers of fear hax resistance have been accepted for Shibai or anyone in the verse? I tried searching it up a bunch of times but to no success

 

[Samlex1234]

Can you show me where 3 layers of fear hax resistance have been accepted for Shibai or anyone in the verse? I tried searching it up a bunch of times but to no success

Naruto: Genjutsu Potency

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[azontr]

Genjutsu is not fear manipulation.

 

[GodSinBad2280]

Naruto: Genjutsu Potency

vsbattles.fandom.com

That's not Fear Hax.

 

[DavidTPPM]

Naruto: Genjutsu Potency

vsbattles.fandom.com

I'm afraid (ha get it?) that genjutsu isn't fear manipulation lmao. Genjustu is mind and illusion manip

 

[Samlex1234]

Genjutsu is not fear manipulation.

 

[Samlex1234]

Stop playing

 

[azontr]

That's not a Genjutsu. That scan is also broken.

 

[Samlex1234]

That's not a Genjutsu. That scan is also broken.

 

[Samlex1234]

All previous sharingan abilities greatly enhanced

 

[azontr]

What is that meant to prove