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Saber Alter Vs Ghost Rider.

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In every single instance I can recall Excalibur comes off as a beam, hits something and then there's a giant blast.

Show it being huge at least twice, a single example isn't gonna override all the others but I'll be generous and accept two.
 
No, I was thinking of the one done by Alter Saber when she's fighting Rider in HF and the one done by her when she's fighting Shielder in Grand Order.
 
I....Hate to say this, but that definitely looks like dramatic effect, the same scenes in the Visual Novel are to a far less extent until they make contact.

Either way, rechanging to Inconclusive, even if it isn't she still has tons of stuff going for her.
 
During Mash's fight it isn't wide because A) she's only targetting one person and B)she isn't even going all out. She just wants to keep the world as it is to stop Flauros, because without Saber Alter, he wins.

Once she sees Ghost Rider sidestepping a thin beam, she will make it wide

Also, that reminds me. Here is the fight between Alter and Rider

https://youtu.be/X5V7wwjltBs?t=41s - sneak attacks don't work

https://youtu.be/X5V7wwjltBs?t=3m29s - tangling her in chains doesn't work. She just prana bursts through and shatters them.

https://youtu.be/X5V7wwjltBs?t=4m59s - the blue light is Bellerphon. Rider on a full sized pegasus. The black is the approaching approaching beam of Excalibur Morgan. It has AoE even before the explosion
 
There's a big difference between Rider's chains and GR's chains, just because theyre chains doesn't mean theyre the same thing. And do you have links to her Excalibur in the VN against the grail?

Also in the sneak attack segment it then goes on to hammer in how far above Alter is to Rider, ya sure that's just not because of how much better she is?
 
Also yeah, she sees him side stepping a thin beam, that still leaves her open untill she can do another and while quick, he can still possibly counter and restrict her vua chains and get in close in the time it takes her to break them, not like he cant attack while dodging the first beam.
 
It shows her superior skill and that her instincts are still enough to stop sneak attacks

Ghost Rider's chains are mountain level.

Alter Saber is at least Mountain Level with her basic physical strikes, seeing as she was able to bypass God hand and severely wound Hercules with normal blows. When she uses Prana burst, she gets stronger. Excalibur Morgan is High 7-A and tears apart space with the magical energy. She can easily bust mountain level chains.

She's no stranger to fighting someone with chains. Plus she could use her Prana Burst aura to attack from multiple angles with tendrils and dragon heads.
 
Exactky, she's far above Medusa already, someone who's more comparable with equal speed is a tad different.

>Mystical Chain Projection: Ghost Rider wields a mystical chain that is capable of growing in length, cutting through almost anything, and transforming into other weapons. He can also spew and project chains from his mouth or chest at will.

Sounds like there's a bit of hax behind these.

Anyone got any feats for these?
 
Ghost Rider has a good resistance to magic:

His satanic powers protect him from a status effect attack: 1

He is inmune to Death-Stalker touch: 1

Doctor Voodo manage to just knock him out with a spell: 1

He can also do a lot of things with his Hellfire:

He can make Hell-Novas with big AoE: 1, 2, 3

He can make a hot air vortex: 1

He can make constructions our of Hellfire: 1

As well with his chains:

He never run out of ammo: 1.

Can spit multiple chains from just his mouth: 1

Can fight multiple enemies with his chains: 1
 
And if she sees him sidestep one, she uses another. Morganblasts are spammable. Or she just lets him get in close combat and proceeds to screw him over with melee uses of Morganblasts. Or attacks with her aura of dragon heads and tendrils.

She's more skilled.

She has higher AP/Dura.

She can ignore durabiliy to a degree with space dislocation

She can atomise him.

She can teleport.

Her attacks have too wide a range and AoE for him to dodge.

She has an aura to autoblock things or attack with.

She is superior to him in every way, and counters 99% of everything he can do with ease. The only reason he might win this is Type 8 immortality. That's it.
 
They're spammable, doesn't mean they're instant, there's still a gap.

>immortality >penance stare >possibly hellfire soul destruction

There's more than that, her being more skilled is debatable.
 
He would die before being able to get close enough to use Penance stare if not for the type 8 immortality

Hellfire is negged by her own dark aura, magic resistance, and being countered by excalibur morgan blasts

And they are practically instant. She's entirely capable of using them repeatedly in each of her sword strikes

Instinct + training and experience since childhood + fighting agaisnt equal or superior opponents in previous grail wars + comparable to other knights of the round table like Lancelot who is so skilled that he can use anything that could be seen as a weapon as though he had trained with it every day of his life = more skilled

@Matt, how long does it take for God to revive him?
 
GR has fought how many comparable or stronger characters? He's probably more experienced.

Magic resistance probably does nothing here honestly.
 
<More skilled.

This dude kept up with ******* Thor, saying more skilled is a very bold claim.

<Higher AP

Not much, she's stronger then Berserker who is baseline, unless you refer to Excaliber Morgan.

<Ignore Durability

Meaningless when he gets revived

<Atomize

Again Revival

<Teleport

You still haven't shown this being used in combat, sounds like something that would have helped her when she was fighting Rider and Shirou

<Her attacks are impossible to dodge

We're still debating this.

┬®Matt, since you're here, perhaps you can help.
 
@Monarch

It literally happened over 3 pages. He died in 1, god revived him in 2 and he was back alive seconds later in 3.
 
Unless Ghost Rider has one of those "sent back in time and worked his way back to the present", that is doubtful. She's trained since birth against the most accomplised sword masters of her time. In terms of skill she's on par with Lancelot. She has instinct telling her the optimal move to make at all times.

It does something against Hellfire. While it won't on its own neg it completely, combined with Saber's aura pushing the attack away, she'll barely be scratched by it.
 
@Matt how often does that happen? Because it seems to me like authors wouldn't pull a stunt like bringing the dead guy back 3 pages later very often unless they wanted to remove a rather large stake in the story.

@Gar, the fact that you are saying "revival" "revival" "revival" only proves my point. Without that he's defeated in seconds.
 
Monarch Laciel said:
@Matt how often does that happen? Because it seems to me like authors wouldn't pull a stunt like bringing the dead guy back 3 pages later very often unless they wanted to remove a rather large stake in the story.
Click to expand...
Remove the stakes? What stakes?
 
Inconclusive. She can't get through revival (unless that 3 pages is an outlier and it normally doesn't happen or takes longer), but he is sure as hell not getting through her excaliblast spams, aura, magic resist, teleportation and superior skill and stats.
 
Monarch Laciel said:
@Gar, the fact that you are saying "revival" "revival" "revival" only proves my point. Without that he's defeated in seconds.
Click to expand...
Revival still perfectly counters both.
 
"@Matt how often does that happen? Because it seems to me like authors wouldn't pull a stunt like bringing the dead guy back 3 pages later very often unless they wanted to remove a rather large stake in the story."

More like he rarely has ever actually died for good, but God directly or indirectly interfering with Ghost Rider is something very common..
 
@Gar The stakes that make the audience actually think "oh no, maybe there is some actual threat here and ghost rider is in danger" rather than "why does this fight even matter if he has a 3-A guy reviving him seconds after he dies"
 
If you want to get into that semantics, there is no stakes to begin with because the Spirit of Vengeance is directly a part of God's power and he cannot die permanently unless God dies. The likes of Mephisto and Zadkiel have said that.

And the Spirit of Vengeance isn't Zarathos, Zarathos is just a demon lord who made a deal with Johnny Blaze.
 
Should we even be including a type 8 immortaltiy like this?

I mean, we get rid of Reinhards reliance on 1-A because no one who fights him would win otherwise. We get rid of SCP-1770's resurrection from Brothers Death and Kharn's resurrection from Khorne, because otherwise there is no way their opponent could ever kill them.

Just because Yahweh isn't a higher dimensional being doesnt change the fact that Saber could never do anything to even inconvenience him.

And as for "directly or indirectly interfering" I assume you are not saying he's going to actually get involved in this fight to twist the odds in GR's favour are you?
 
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