Reinhard Van Astrea vs Hajime Nagumo

[Robo432343]

Reinhard van Astrea

Reinhard van Astrea is the current Sword Saint and a member of the Royal Guard, currently acting as Felt's knight. Reinhard became the Sword Saint at the age of 5, after which he immediately defeated his father, Heinkel Astrea, in a duel. He is extraordinarily powerful and stated to be the...

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vs

Hajime Nagumo

Now where have I heard that before? Never thought someone who’s supposed to be me would take that shit so seriously. If that’s what the definition of human is, then yeah, I guess I’m not human anymore. Maybe I really am a monster who was born in the abyss. A monster, huh? But— Sure, I might be...

vsbattles.fandom.com

Both 5-C
Speed =
SBA otherwise

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Why there are two Hajimes in the title?

 

[Noneless21]

At one point Reinhard gonna need to gain a shitton of blessing just to dodge Hajime's onslaught of bullets

so there's that

 

[Fezzih_007]

What Hajime can do?

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

At one point Reinhard gonna need to gain a shitton of blessing just to dodge Hajime's onslaught of bullets

so there's that

no not really, he gets faster each time he dodges something and projectiles automatically change directions if aimed at him

Also he can run in a thunderstorm with a letter in hand and not let a single drop fall on him or the letter

 

[Fezzih_007]

Oh, this is kinda complicated.

Greater Homing Attack and Danmaku (His Living Bullets can move millimeters in their trajectory[59] to hit the enemy. Agni Orkan launch thirty missiles, one large missile and three hundred micro-missiles[59] per second and they are enchanced to seek heat, biosignatures and soul signatures to make sure they always hit their target, they are also like Living Bullets but they can maneuver through tight spaces and do great turns)

Reinhard have a Power that make projectiles change directions when they about to hit him, not sure How they would interact.

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

Oh, this is kinda complicated.



Reinhard have a Power that make projectiles change directions when they about to hit him, not sure How they would interact.

Thats not from the key we are using btw

Also Reinhard can easily dodge them himself since they dont straight up follow him but instead move a couple of milimeters

 

[Robo432343]

Thats not from the key we are using btw

what key are we using

 

[Fezzih_007]

Thats not from the key we are using btw

But they are.
End of main story Key.

 

[Robo432343]

But they are.
End of main story Key.

bruh end of main story key was when he was country level
not 6-C

 

[Noneless21]

if it's Post Schnee key then Hajime automatically get bloodlusted and go lol 12 times speed amps and EE bullet

 

[Fezzih_007]

bruh end of main story key was when he was country level
not 6-C

Oh okay, looks like a read wrong then.

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

if it's Post Schnee key then Hajime automatically get bloodlusted and go lol 12 times speed amps and EE bullet

The bullets would change directions and Reinhaŕd should be able to get faster through AD but i dont think it would be enough to cover 12 times the speed diff

Unless you want to bring up a certain feat

Actually wasn't garfiel 5x faster than Kurgan when he fought him? I suppose that could be a feat but that would need to be added to their profile

 

[Robo432343]

if it's Post Schnee key then Hajime automatically get bloodlusted and go lol 12 times speed amps and EE bullet

yeah the post schnee key is being used

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

As a note, Hajime base 12x speed amp is one that he use easily/quickly and that on top of the 12x movement amp he gets an perception amp that let him see comparable people at slow motion (almost frozen) with far greater detail than normal, but besides that amp he have another 3x and 5x amps that he can use if he consider it's necessary, so in total he can amp up to 60x times his base speed if needed. Additionally he himself have accelerated development, literally this key begins listing how he in just minutes of fighting grew enough to overwhelm a perfect copy of himself, and that was even before he faced the god tier of the verse and essentially gained unlimited growing potential from willpower alone.

• Accelerated Development (During his battle with his copy he was able to perfect his fighting style even more, along with getting faster and stronger[49]. His theoretical maximum is far higher than any human is capable of, and given time, his strength can surpass the power of the gods[33])

Furthermore, Hajime can analyze the abstract information of anything he so desires with evolution magic, so Reinhard and everything he have and could do will be easily understood by Hajime, which bring me to the next point, Hajime said to be able to counter anything that have worked before due to his immense intelligence and synergist talent, as you may notice this is very different to the Elsa vague statement about nothing working twice, and that's because in the case of Hajime we clearly know this is a result of his growing, intelligence and adaptability as master synergist. And before someone says that Hajime need time to create artifacts, that's isn't true in this key as he gained in middle of combat (the same part were he gained his Transcendence skill) the ability to create artifacts with ancient magic, in fact he can even create a mass-production factory of artifatcs with ancient magic in mere moments, so he can quite literally create as many things he want, specially if also considered how he can use spatial (and even restoration/time manip) magic to create areas where Reinhard can't pass so the production of Hajime weapons never gets interrupted. So Hajime can in fact quickly counter Reinhard ability to affect bullets trajectory, plus Hajime own marksmanship but this paragraph was focused on the supernatural ability to affect projectiles so meh.

To begin with, Reinhard can't resist anything at the level of ancient magic so those are game over for him as not even Od Laguna could help him against something of that level, so Hajime wins without even needing his chains.

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Doesn't look like Reinhard's hax will help him.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

Being blunt Hajime slaps, Reinhard has like 1 or 2 layers, while this version of Hajime has like 5-10 or something, and all his stuff is conceptual.

Getting deja vu, wasn't this done before?

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

So a completes stomp

 

[Robo432343]

Being blunt Hajime slaps, Reinhard has like 1 or 2 layers, while this version of Hajime has like 5-10 or something, and all his stuff is conceptual.

arifureta lost all their layers now

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

arifureta lost all their layers now

By Everything12

Before the scaling itself there is certain information that need to first be established:

Divine Edict is really powerful spirit magic with a mechanic that make it stronger when the user uses their full name[1] compared with the shortened version of their name, this difference in power is show to be significant enough [2] to overcome people able to resist the version with the shortened name, so Shortened Divine Edict < Full Divine Edict.

Between ancient magic exist evolution magic which significantly increase the power of things multiplying their strength[3], specifically weak evolution magic[4] double the potency[5] of something[6], normal evolution magic[7] that anyone can use[8] triple[9] the power[10] of things[2], and can increase[11] it fivefold[12], can increase the level of skills several times[13][14] multiplying their effects[15], evolution magic ability[7] affect[16] anything[2] and[17] everything[4] without distinction[6] because of its control[12] of information[18]. Does this include feats of things that would resist? So based on that Normal Divine Edict < Evolved Divine Edict.

So based on that previous information the scaling for Divine Edict go like this:

Limit Break Users/Kouki Resistance (Limit Break do damage to the soul, so those that can use Limit Break will get their soul permanently damaged if their soul isn't strong enough[19]. Kouki is someone able to use Limit Break without problem) < Kouki Overload Resistance (Overload is the superior version of Limit Break that put a greater burden in the user[20]) < Eri/Apostles Dark Magic (Is an inferior version[21] of spirit magic, and people who can resist it[22] can't resist[23] spirit magic[24]. Additionally she could affect with her magic Kouki soul) Getting somewhere here < Normal Spirit Magic (spirit magic resist[25] dark magic) < Eddy Divine Edict (Paladins special magic[23] is superior[26] to other Atavists, and Divine Edict is a specially powerful[1] spirit magic that can affect[12] people who resist spirit magic[27]) Looks promosing < Eddy Maker Divine Edict < Apostleified Eddy Divine Edict (apostleification boost the strength of the user magic[12] [likely with evolution magic since it's done by Ehit himself] and the replicas of holy artifacts that they wield futher strengthen their magic) < Apostleified Eddy Maker Divine Edict[12] < Laus Barn Spirit Magic (Laus, even in a half dead state, can supress[26] the spirit magic of those apostleified Relevance?) < Zero Alva Divine Edict (Is needed the combined effort[25] of most Liberators to face him) < Zero Alvaheit Divine Edict < Zero Alva Divine Edict with Evolution Magic < Zero Alvaheit Divine Edict with Evolution Magic < Current Alva Divine Edict (Because of the technique that turn faith in power his current power is conceptually far above[28][29] than his Zero version Adding Conceptual doesnt change anything) < Current Alvaheit Divine Edict < Current Alva Divine Edict with Evolution Magic < Current Alvaheit Divine Edict with Evolution Magic < Zero Ehit Divine Edict (Ehit is conceptually superior to Alva and his Divine Edict[30] can't be resisted by those that resist Alvaheit Divine Edict) < Zero Ehitorujue Divine Edict < Zero Ehit Divine Edict with Evolution Magic < Vol 6 Laus Barn Spirit Magic (By giving his all he was able to resist[12] Ehit Divine Edict) < Zero Ehitorujue Divine Edict with Evolution Magic < Current Ehit Divine Edict < Current Ehitorujue Divine Edict < Current Ehit Divine Edict with Evolution Magic < Current Ehitorujue Divine Edict with Evolution Magic < Soul Shell (Resist[31] Ehitorujue Divine Edict) < Yue Divine Edict (Is far above[32] Ehitorujue and can affect those that resist[33] Ehitorujue Divine Edict and with Soul Shell) < Post-Shadow Dragon Arc Yue Divine Edict (Her existence is conceptually stronger[34] than before do to dragon gods conception, and the more time pass the stronger her existence will become because of the conception)

Between 10 and 20 layers are left.

 

[Robo432343]

By Everything12

Between 10 and 20 layers are left.

was that evaluated in the thread??

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

was that evaluated in the thread??

It was evaluated by Everything12, but there was no response to Expectro explanation.

Verses/Characters that Lose Their Layers

• Arifureta (Loses some of the 28 layers)

Just leave it to Expectro.

 

[Robo432343]

It was evaluated by Everything12, but there was no response to Expectro explanation.

Just leave it to Expectro.

man lets just assume both have 0 layers for the sake of a fair match + the layers still need to be evaluated in the hax thread

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

the layers still need to be evaluated in the hax thread

What hax thread?

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

What hax thread?

Search hax layer thread

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Search hax layer thread

This one

Hax Layer Evaluation Thread

The purpose of this thread is to evaluate which verses do and do not qualify for layered hax under the newly codified standards, much like Glass did for type 5 acausality not too long ago. Given the massive amount of ground that needs to be covered, this will be a somewhat disorganized thread...

vsbattles.com

This is where the layers were evaluated. If it's not, can you post the link?

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

This one

Hax Layer Evaluation Thread

The purpose of this thread is to evaluate which verses do and do not qualify for layered hax under the newly codified standards, much like Glass did for type 5 acausality not too long ago. Given the massive amount of ground that needs to be covered, this will be a somewhat disorganized thread...

vsbattles.com

This is where the layers were evaluated. If it's not, can you post the link?

Yeah thats the one

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

Still a stomp

 

[Robo432343]

no

 

[Noneless21]

no

Tf you mean no, what's your argument

If we let the layers be real then Hajime stomp, if not then Hajime still use his speedblitz amp and blitz Reinhard

What's your argument then

 

[Robo432343]

Tf you mean no, what's your argument

If we let the layers be real then Hajime stomp, if not then Hajime still use his speedblitz amp and blitz Reinhard

What's your argument then

my argument is that it might be fair if there are no layers
reinhard also has his 100x perception thingy so its not a stomp

 

[Noneless21]

my argument is that it might be fair if there are no layers
reinhard also has his 100x perception thingy so its not a stomp

then it's not gonna count then

seriously, you're just pushing it at this point, just drop this and touch some grass, it's already 5 months

oh Reinhard has 100x perception? Does he has thought based attacks then?

 

[speedster352]

then it's not gonna count then

seriously, you're just pushing it at this point, just drop this and touch some grass, it's already 5 months

oh Reinhard has 100x perception? Does he has thought based attacks then?

Doesn’t he have the first move blessing which guarantees his attack hit?

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

then it's not gonna count then

seriously, you're just pushing it at this point, just drop this and touch some grass, it's already 5 months

oh Reinhard has 100x perception? Does he has thought based attacks then?

if its projectiles then they will change direction when aimed at him
He can block perception blitzing attacks on instinct
And you can argue for thought based attacks but you would need to bloodlust him since he avoids using it in character

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

man lets just assume both have 0 layers for the sake of a fair match + the layers still need to be evaluated in the hax thread

Even going by the last post of Theglassman12 (which apparently is the person the wiki unanimously chose to give the absolute authority to decide hax potency?) they would have 4 layers. Though, even assuming zero initial layers from both sides, I'm pretty sure I began this thread explaining why Hajime just counters.

reinhard also has his 100x perception thingy so its not a stomp

Btw, I think you are confusing stuff, Hajime had a 60x combat speed amp (since you changed it to 5-C he would actually have another 2x and 5x amp on top giving a total amp of 600x), and his weapons can be faster than himself so they would be higher than that, perception wise the amp is so high that he sees stuff at those speeds at a snail's pace. Purely speaking about speed Hajime is faster even with speed-equal rules. Though, well, to be fair, since you apparently changed the op yesterday to 5-C Hajime I guess you could restrict if you want the last 5x amp and most of his weapons with amps (the ones that do physical destruction at least Ig) because with those he is Low 5-B to 5-B, but even with that he would still be 120x faster with all his amps out, so regardless Reid would still be slower (also weaker and less durable but the talk was purely about speed so meh).