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Regarding the existence of Composite human: Part 2

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I've also noticed that this thread's getting super derailed. A new one might need to be made soon.
 
The very concept of rules is that you follow them unless an exception is justified, saying that you should do something because they are rules isn't circular reasoning, it's literally just applying the definition of words.

Putting it in the format of a usual circular reasoning does not prove anything, it does not make it so that it's the same thing as an argument made without reasoning, it's simply not allowing something that isn't allowed, and you just cannot expect someone to act otherwise till you give valid reasons for making an exception or change what constitutes as the rules in the first place
 
Why are you guys so blue?

CH is just going to be moved to a blog where we can list feats of humanity there. There we still fufill the purpose of what a humanity profile was all about, using it as a general scale for real world humans.

He isn't going to JBW or FC, he will stay on this wiki, but just on a blog
 
The exception was already made. It's your side that's trying to change the current situation. It is YOUR job to provide a reason for us to follow the rule NOW. Because we weren't following the rule before.
 
Amexim, you've got to calm down and stop a bit, alright? This thread has been derailed for 236 posts and you don't seem to be helping much.
 
I'm not even mad, wtf? I'm just telling you guys that you don't make sense. Should I use italics instead of caps to make it seem like i'm not yelling?
 
The reason why the exception was made before (popularity) was agreed not to be valid, so "the exception was already made" really doesn't work, since it was made for an invalid reason, and now it's your job to come up with a vlaid reason for the exception to continued being made.
 
Well, it seems this is it, then.

It was nice while it lasted. He shall live on somewhere else but here.

So, as I appear to see, Composite Human is now being transferred to a blog as a general recollection of human feats or something along the line. Is that the consensus it has been agreed on?

It seems that Amexim will no longer be able to contribute here, after all, due to his current status.
 
If agreed upon, yeah. Although I think a separate blog with all of humanity's feats would probably be better if that's what Composite Human is being used for.
 
He was only kept for fun, but he still tried to serve as a purpose of indexing the feats of humanity.

So either we keep CH but blog him or we make a new respect thread style blog which details the feats
 
It wouldn't hurt anyone if CH was kept as a blog, but if you wanted to find humanity's best feats, a seperate blog in respect thread format would be much more organised and easier to read.
 
I'm Blue daba dee daba die said:
He was only kept for fun, but he still tried to serve as a purpose of indexing the feats of humanity.
So either we keep CH but blog him or we make a new respect thread style blog which details the feats
Click to expand...
I think if the sole purpose of the blog is to index human feats it would be better to transform Composite Human's current profile to a respect-style page, yes. As hard as it may be for me to say that.

EDIT: On a second thought, I feel like while keeping Composite Human's former profile in a separate blog wouldn't do any harm, as GyroNutz says, I think it would be a little ineccesary if we're really doing what has already been mentioned.
 
Ok then, so, who will make the blog?

It's pretty clear that CH is no longer having a profile on this wiki and will now be in a respect thread about humanities feats.

Also, who should make the R.I.P thread
 
Hello, it is the me.

So it seems the main reason for CH being removed is that it goes against a rule, despite it being agreed to be kept before. However, I would like to know what other issues it causes besides just being against a rule that people agreed to make an exception to anyways. Rules exist to prevent harm from being done in some way. If there's no other problem caused, then what exactly is the problem wifh making such exceptions? Why shouldn't we be able to decide for our own community that it's an okay thing to have? The concerns about equipment and prep time are in no way specific to CH, and contradictory compositing also applies to just about every composite.

Would go more but I'm tired and have tests, might sleep
 
I think the main controversy is Vs threads. To be fair, there's a lot of debate on whether he should be assumed to know the strengths and weaknesses of every single character on the wiki. Some claim that him "Knowing all fiction" is considered wank, while others say that he should otherwise he's not truly composite. And composite human was made as our exception to the calc stacking rule among other things iirc.
 
An exception was only agreed to be made due to his popularity, which most people agree not to be a valid reason, so we can't really say "people agreed to make an exception to anyways", because the reason the exception was made isn't valid, and no other reason has been given so far.
 
Personally, I'm more for keeping the Composite Human profile because personally, how can one actually tell how strong humans can be at their best? I mean we have the average joe who can lift his own weight, then we have professional boxers who can really land a powerful punch, football players who tackle, weightlifters in the Olympics who can do a couple hundred kilograms at best, and we have powerlifters who can do Class 5 lifting feats.

If you ask me, ideally separating between the average person and a skilled person would be more optimal for the profile. Basically add a key for an untrained human and a skilled person is what I'm saying. Of course it goes without saying that unskilled and skilled humans are 9-C via tackling, but an average joe isn't exactly 9-C in other fields. This is coming from an average joe.

Pretty much what I'm saying is keep the profile, but make it so that we get keys diffrentiating between an average joe and a skilled person like a professional boxer or whatever.
 
Composite Human breaks so many rules about the VSBW though. It's a composite, for one thing, which we actively ban on the site. For two, the traits of the Composite human are intentionally cherrypicked; that is, we pick all the strengths of genetic traits of other humans but none of the weaknesses. So CH is a really egregious profile to begin with and should most definitely not be allowed. (Let's not mention the fact that we had to excerpt CH from calc stacking. What rules doesn't CH break?)

There's also the fact that what exactly CH can and cannot do is really debateable since some of the genetic traits he has don't really make any sense at all. There's also the fact that people will argue amongst themselves what weaknesses the CH would have. Overall, Composite Human should just be a separate blog as another site, as it's existence is completely invalidated by all of the site's standards.

'but muh CH is popular' is a bullshit argument. There are several profiles that are popular and have gotten deleted; let's not start bringing up the Youtuber profile debates.
 
Honestly, I'm just going to offer my 2 cents on the issue.

Personally, I think that the Composite Human profile should be allowed, and that the necessity of this whole debate highlights a somewhat major issue. I think there's a pretty big problem with how this is being approached.

While the "it's fun" argument is overdone and quite silly... in a way, it's not completely invalid in this debate. Many threads filled with some of the most interesting discussions on this website so far have been dedicated to the statistics for the Composite Human profile, and the subsequent applicability in Versus Threads. In the end, the reason people are so heavily involved in these discussions and evaluations is because it's simply enjoyable, not for any more serious reason.

As such, we should be more focused on basing the rules around what makes for enjoyable and thought-provoking discussions for the users of this wiki, rather than basing the discussions around these strict, predefined rules. If things like the Composite Human profile contribute to the enjoyment and in-depth discussions present on this website, then it's far more logical to base the rules around allowing these kinds of discussions rather than restricting them by treating the rules as law.

TL;DR: If the Composite Human profile is a source of genuine and thought-provoking discussion and it facilitates the enjoyment of the users, then it's a far more reasonable course of action to change the rules to allow it rather than restrict it by using the current rules as a defence.
 
It seems that Composite Human is... staying.

The votes are inconclusive/incredibly close right now.
 
@Grath I have no problem if you want to try and improve the rules themeselves, but make sure you know what exactly that would entail. Composite human is a hypothetical idea, something that isn't truly part of the real world, and doesn't belong to any established fictional universe either, changing the rules likely means allowing all such kind of profiles

Now, the purpose of the site is indexing fictional franchises, the only reason for allowing real world profiles despite this is for reference purposes which an information blog will serve much better than a hypothetical character possessing all of humanity's strengths. Simply adding in "composite human can stay" to the rules and calling it a day will of course not be fine so the site itself will have to change so that it's scope isn't fictional franchises and whatever helps index those fictional franchises

Btw, on this topic we and Skalt are actually working on another wiki specifically tailored to indexing hypotheticals. Can't promise anything at the moment, but that may potentially be a place for profiles like CH to end up, if others are satisfied with that over changing this wiki's foundation
 
Honestly, the issue itself forays into the idea of how closely rules should be followed over personal needs, almost Lawful vs Chaotic kek. But in all seriousness, I'm not sure it's possible we can really come to a conclusion regarding which takes priority in a discussion like this (hence the inconclusive votes), but it seems to me there isn't much of a difference between CH's existence and the other composites, so whatever can be said about CH can apply to them, so they may end up coming back.
 
If one wants to make an argument for all composites, that certainly belongs on another thread.

But, for now, I guess Composite Human stays on the wiki.
 
Moritzva said:
If one wants to make an argument for all composites, that certainly belongs on another thread.

But, for now, I guess Composite Human stays on the wiki.
Click to expand...
let's not jump the gun here, there's still a discussion to be had
 
Yobo Blue said:
Moritzva said:
If one wants to make an argument for all composites, that certainly belongs on another thread.

But, for now, I guess Composite Human stays on the wiki.
Click to expand...
let's not jump the gun here, there's still a discussion to be had
Click to expand...
There has been discussion and there will continue to be, but it's going in a circle and I see absolutely nobody changing their minds.
 
I think that would require a compromise more than just flat out denying it, especially since there is about as much support for CH going if not more. The separate wiki may be one good idea.
 
Yobo Blue said:
I think that would require a compromise more than just flat out denying it, especially since there is about as much support for CH going if not more. The separate wiki may be one good idea.
Click to expand...
If the most recent vote tally is accurate, + all the new votes for CH staying, I think it's in favor of Composite Human staying.

Although, a compromise could be making a thread discussing the treatment of CH- e.g. how to treat contradictory traits and what-not.
 
Well, it was in favor of deletion for a while, but we waited for quite a while before taking action. I guess what we need is a concrete way to decide when to end this discussion.
 
You guys should know that votes alone will not decide a judgment, that only happens in the case of purely subjective decisions, not matters of enforcing standards to content
 
Andytrenom said:
You guys should know that votes alone will not decide a judgment, that only happens in the case of purely subjective decisions, not matters of enforcing standards to content
Click to expand...
So we're just going to ignore 20-odd votes now?
 
Andytrenom said:
You guys should know that votes alone will not decide a judgment, that only happens in the case of purely subjective decisions, not matters of enforcing standards to content
Click to expand...
I'm aware but I don't want to be hounded by angry opposition kek
 
I don't think any reason for CH staying that isn't a variation of 'it's popular' has been given, and that reason has already been debunked. It's already been irrefutbaly proved that CH is breaking a whole gigaton of important rules regarding characters and that it's a massive double standard.

I suggest that if we allow CH to stay on the site, we change our rules and allow other composite profiles to exist. Perhaps that would really mess things up, but at the very least CH would have a justifiable existence.


Also, these votes are questionable as many of them don't seem to have good reasonings for CH staying.
 
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