- 20,509
- 1,590
-
This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.
For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here. -
We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.
Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.
Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page. -
Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.
Rakudai multiplier stuff
- Thread starter Ricsi-viragosi
- Start date
- 40,470
- 12,953
Pretty sure the entire point of the series is that in pure physicality, he's well above the rest of the cast, but in terms of magical prowess, he's nothing to glance at. In layman's terms, what he lacks in magic he more than makes up for in strength (& skill).
Also I highly doubt every fight gets resolved in a single fight. Especially given they'd also speedblitz him as well as OHKO him if they can keep up with/survive Rasetsu.
Also I highly doubt every fight gets resolved in a single fight. Especially given they'd also speedblitz him as well as OHKO him if they can keep up with/survive Rasetsu.
- 15,920
- 2,694
Rasetsu is used to one-shot a lot of people (Touka, Byakuya, Stella).The real cal howard said:
I myself would like 20x and 200x as the multipliers, since I think they make the most sense based on what we have.
- 40,470
- 12,953
Then where's the stakes if he can just shout out Kaio Ken and just instawin his fights in literally a second?
- 13,587
- 5,754
Uh, no? Ikki is absolute fodder in every regard but skill and a chick magnet. Pretty sure his stats on screen from his fight against Stella even showcase this.
- 15,920
- 2,694
Because Rasetsu only lasts 1 second and deals a very heavy burden on his body. He felt in coma the first time he used iirc.The real cal howard said:
- 40,470
- 12,953
Yeah. Because all the stats are biased towards magic. If Ikki was a joke physically no matter his skill he'd be fodder. Which given who he is and hasn't lost a fight, he's not.AnonymousBlank said:
- 26,160
- 3,653
- Thread starter
- #48
Wait, wasn't there ratings for stats early on (in the anime there was) where it's mentioned that everything but physicals are F, while physicals are A?
- 20,509
- 1,590
Ma gawd. Tfw people tell you stuff about a show they haven't read geez. Lemme get quotes real quick.
- 40,470
- 12,953
>Spent the last several days looking at reviews of the series
>Rakudai being one of the first anime I've watched to completion
How's the weather up there from that high horse you're sitting on?
>Rakudai being one of the first anime I've watched to completion
How's the weather up there from that high horse you're sitting on?
- 15,920
- 2,694
Yes, there are. Even on the SSSAF arc, they gave stats. Every member of Akatsuki has them, for example.Ricsi-viragosi said:
- 40,470
- 12,953
Yes, there are. Even on the SSSAF arc, they gave stats. Every member of Akatsuki has them, for example.
what's his stats then? ovo
what's his stats then? ovo
- 15,920
- 2,694
The funniest part on that is that a member of Akatsuki is Ikki's evil older brother.
- 20,509
- 1,590
Cal im not talking on what you may have seen or read. Im talking about what you're saying.
Yet a wide swing was just a wide swing. Ikki saw through her movement and raised Intetsu to receive it―but he immediately aborted that action and took a sudden step back. An instant later, L├ªvateinn struck the arena floor violently and the entire space shook like an earthquake.
"Wise choice. If you received that blow, it wouldn't have ended with just a few scratches."
"What an outrageous attack. So you weren't being serious in the chairman's office?"
"That's right. If I became serious in such a place, the entire school building would be destroyed."
Grinning broadly, Stella immediately took pursuit, and Ikki drew another step back to widen the distance. If he tried to stop such a swing head on, his arm would be crushed. Stella's weapon was a long sword, a heavy weapon, and it was common sense when facing heavy weapons that he'd have an advantage in retreating speed.
The very first fight between Ikki and Stella.
Despite her surprise, she immediately attacked Ikki with a second swing. Katharterio Salamandra created a sword of heat that had no physical body, and it could reach a target more than a hundred meters away. It wasn't something a flesh-and-blood human could simply evade.
But Ikki did.
The second strike, and then the third. Here and there on the battlefield, Ikki kept moving like a windstorm between her flashing strokes, completely dodging each attack. His movements were impossible to follow. Forget her sword, even her eyes couldn't keep up with Ikki's speed. Eventually, Stella could no longer catch even a rough visual of his position.
"Kuh, what's with that strength!? How can you move like that all of a sudden!?"
"Because that's my ability. Just like how Stella-san can control flames, I also have an ability as a Blazer."
Ikki's ability was… doubling his physical attributes.
It was called the worst among all the abilities a Blazer could have, because even without the boosting of physical attributes, a Blazer could gain far more force or mobility by applying magic. Indeed, Stella had used such magic during this match, and her attributes had multiplied five or six times, not merely doubled. In other words, Ikki's ability was a downgraded version of what every Blazer could do just by using magic.
He's physically A. But he's still trash just because of how the world works.
First off, Kuraudo dashed ahead which immediately killed the distance. He kicked the floor with his magically fortified legs and drew near Ikki.
"Haha!"
A flash of iron. He swung his nodachi with its saw blade with his right hand which ripped through the wind. He was full of defects and openings. A very crude and sloppy way of handling a sword. It was quite easy to defend. However, though he didn't have the basic knowledge on how to handle a nodachi, he swung it with a flash with only his arm strength alone!
Rather than slashing, it looked more like he was mowing it down.
A sloppy motion, but why's the swing so sharp!?
Once, twice, thrice. Intetsu which continued to block the hits started to creak. Ikki's arms screamed in pain. Even his ankles felt like they were jabbed.
What ridiculous power! As if he was a beast. His swings were like a wild beast baring his fangs. No logic, no theory, no smarts, he overpowered men with his brute strength alone!
Ikki vs Kuraudo
"Ittou Shura."
A burst of azure fire wrapped around his body as his sword spirit burst forth, like a rushing wind yet sharp enough to cut flesh. The trees in the park again shook, their leaves falling like raindrops. Having experienced many battles, Ikki's spirit had come to possess a very physical pressure.
Yet Ouma was not in the least shaken by that level of pressure. Rather than be in the least intimidated by Ittou Shura, he seemed to be annoyed—as one presented with something dull.
"A highly focused release of all one's power within a short period of time used in order to defeat with explosive force an opponent whose total reserves you cannot match… this is the height of deception. Just looking at it makes my skin crawl…. Come. Allow me to blow this stumbling stone away."
With almost leisurely movements, he settled into a battle stance. Stoic and unmoving, he evoked the image of a mighty mountain. Deep-rooted in the earth, an absolute presence. Ikki was almost overwhelmed by this feeling alone. But he had already played his trump card. He had a minute left, no more. Even a second's waste was fatal against this foe. Therefore—
"Haaaaaa!"
The knight in black initiated the decisive attack, his posture low to the ground like a shadow. In response, the Sword Emperor of Wind too made his move, his blade sweeping forth like a hurricane towards that shadow's head.
But when cloaked in Ittou Shura, Ikki was swifter than any wind!
I can do this!
He intended to end this in the first strike using the decisive difference in speed. Deflect Ouma's blow, avoid him, and strike at his body in a flash.
Don't be afraid.
His eyes fixed on the white blade bearing down on his head. Ouma could split the earth with this blow. If he allowed fear to cripple his deflection, he would be decapitated in a single strike.
Ouma vs Ikki first fight. Even in Ittou Shura ikki got massively stomped in AP.
Need any more cases?
Yet a wide swing was just a wide swing. Ikki saw through her movement and raised Intetsu to receive it―but he immediately aborted that action and took a sudden step back. An instant later, L├ªvateinn struck the arena floor violently and the entire space shook like an earthquake.
"Wise choice. If you received that blow, it wouldn't have ended with just a few scratches."
"What an outrageous attack. So you weren't being serious in the chairman's office?"
"That's right. If I became serious in such a place, the entire school building would be destroyed."
Grinning broadly, Stella immediately took pursuit, and Ikki drew another step back to widen the distance. If he tried to stop such a swing head on, his arm would be crushed. Stella's weapon was a long sword, a heavy weapon, and it was common sense when facing heavy weapons that he'd have an advantage in retreating speed.
The very first fight between Ikki and Stella.
Despite her surprise, she immediately attacked Ikki with a second swing. Katharterio Salamandra created a sword of heat that had no physical body, and it could reach a target more than a hundred meters away. It wasn't something a flesh-and-blood human could simply evade.
But Ikki did.
The second strike, and then the third. Here and there on the battlefield, Ikki kept moving like a windstorm between her flashing strokes, completely dodging each attack. His movements were impossible to follow. Forget her sword, even her eyes couldn't keep up with Ikki's speed. Eventually, Stella could no longer catch even a rough visual of his position.
"Kuh, what's with that strength!? How can you move like that all of a sudden!?"
"Because that's my ability. Just like how Stella-san can control flames, I also have an ability as a Blazer."
Ikki's ability was… doubling his physical attributes.
It was called the worst among all the abilities a Blazer could have, because even without the boosting of physical attributes, a Blazer could gain far more force or mobility by applying magic. Indeed, Stella had used such magic during this match, and her attributes had multiplied five or six times, not merely doubled. In other words, Ikki's ability was a downgraded version of what every Blazer could do just by using magic.
He's physically A. But he's still trash just because of how the world works.
First off, Kuraudo dashed ahead which immediately killed the distance. He kicked the floor with his magically fortified legs and drew near Ikki.
"Haha!"
A flash of iron. He swung his nodachi with its saw blade with his right hand which ripped through the wind. He was full of defects and openings. A very crude and sloppy way of handling a sword. It was quite easy to defend. However, though he didn't have the basic knowledge on how to handle a nodachi, he swung it with a flash with only his arm strength alone!
Rather than slashing, it looked more like he was mowing it down.
A sloppy motion, but why's the swing so sharp!?
Once, twice, thrice. Intetsu which continued to block the hits started to creak. Ikki's arms screamed in pain. Even his ankles felt like they were jabbed.
What ridiculous power! As if he was a beast. His swings were like a wild beast baring his fangs. No logic, no theory, no smarts, he overpowered men with his brute strength alone!
Ikki vs Kuraudo
"Ittou Shura."
A burst of azure fire wrapped around his body as his sword spirit burst forth, like a rushing wind yet sharp enough to cut flesh. The trees in the park again shook, their leaves falling like raindrops. Having experienced many battles, Ikki's spirit had come to possess a very physical pressure.
Yet Ouma was not in the least shaken by that level of pressure. Rather than be in the least intimidated by Ittou Shura, he seemed to be annoyed—as one presented with something dull.
"A highly focused release of all one's power within a short period of time used in order to defeat with explosive force an opponent whose total reserves you cannot match… this is the height of deception. Just looking at it makes my skin crawl…. Come. Allow me to blow this stumbling stone away."
With almost leisurely movements, he settled into a battle stance. Stoic and unmoving, he evoked the image of a mighty mountain. Deep-rooted in the earth, an absolute presence. Ikki was almost overwhelmed by this feeling alone. But he had already played his trump card. He had a minute left, no more. Even a second's waste was fatal against this foe. Therefore—
"Haaaaaa!"
The knight in black initiated the decisive attack, his posture low to the ground like a shadow. In response, the Sword Emperor of Wind too made his move, his blade sweeping forth like a hurricane towards that shadow's head.
But when cloaked in Ittou Shura, Ikki was swifter than any wind!
I can do this!
He intended to end this in the first strike using the decisive difference in speed. Deflect Ouma's blow, avoid him, and strike at his body in a flash.
Don't be afraid.
His eyes fixed on the white blade bearing down on his head. Ouma could split the earth with this blow. If he allowed fear to cripple his deflection, he would be decapitated in a single strike.
Ouma vs Ikki first fight. Even in Ittou Shura ikki got massively stomped in AP.
Need any more cases?
- 40,470
- 12,953
I mean, kinda. You didn't give any Rasetsu cases.
- 20,509
- 1,590
Im proving wrong your "he's a top tier in terms of physical ability". Which is flat wrong.The real cal howard said:
- 40,470
- 12,953
You...didn't disprove that though, because they need magic to boost themselves. Everyone else is magic and therefore can buff themselves to a greater extent. It requires magic for them to boost their mobility and power to dwarfing Ikki levels.
- 20,509
- 1,590
...
Which means in terms of AP ikki is actually trash....
Pretty sure the entire point of the series is that in pure physicality, he's well above the rest of the cast, but in terms of magical prowess, he's nothing to glance at. In layman's terms, what he lacks in magic he more than makes up for in strength
That part was wrong at it's very core. He does not make up for it in strength. He makes up for it strictly in skill (and speed, but mostly skill).
Which means in terms of AP ikki is actually trash....
Pretty sure the entire point of the series is that in pure physicality, he's well above the rest of the cast, but in terms of magical prowess, he's nothing to glance at. In layman's terms, what he lacks in magic he more than makes up for in strength
That part was wrong at it's very core. He does not make up for it in strength. He makes up for it strictly in skill (and speed, but mostly skill).
- 5,322
- 433
So whats being debated at this point we seem to be in agreement with 10x and 200x right?
- 40,470
- 12,953
If they're not killing Ikki in a single hit, that means he must've built up his body in order to compensate for that magical difference. And given he was hit several times by that archer guy and wasn't turned into Swiss cheese, what I'm saying has merit. Because all the skill in the world won't make Bruce Lee beat a tank.
- 20,509
- 1,590
Literally most of the cast can kill him in a single hit. Stella in particular with just the shockwave of her punch was said to have enough power to literally make Ikki's head vanish (the shockwave would do that).
>Archer guy
Ma gawd, that's not even misunderstanding anymore. The archer guy's arrows were piercing right through his body. What do you think would happen from being hit by an arrow? Explode? I love how you're implying as if he could just tank the arrows when he very clearly was getting arrowed to hell and back with the only reason he didn't die was cus Kirihara wanted to humiliate him and avoided vitals.
Edit: Also i love how you're comparing bruce lee to Ikki like the skill level is the same.
@Pen
Huh? Not a series you can get into? I haven't encountered anyone who has read the novel and disliked it. Don't judge a series, i'd say you should give it a shot.
The current context is on this fight. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OL97sbrEr3o
>Archer guy
Ma gawd, that's not even misunderstanding anymore. The archer guy's arrows were piercing right through his body. What do you think would happen from being hit by an arrow? Explode? I love how you're implying as if he could just tank the arrows when he very clearly was getting arrowed to hell and back with the only reason he didn't die was cus Kirihara wanted to humiliate him and avoided vitals.
Edit: Also i love how you're comparing bruce lee to Ikki like the skill level is the same.
@Pen
Huh? Not a series you can get into? I haven't encountered anyone who has read the novel and disliked it. Don't judge a series, i'd say you should give it a shot.
The current context is on this fight. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OL97sbrEr3o
- 40,470
- 12,953
The Ikki shouldn't be able to touch any of these people regardless of his skill feats then. Also I'm almost certain in the anime his body wasn't full of holes and if it was, he certainly wouldn't be able to fight the next day.
- 20,509
- 1,590
When you have skill feats on Ikki's level, you very clearly can.The real cal howard said:
And just the fact that the arrows didn't stick onto him is enough proof they went through.
>Wouldn't be able to fight the next day
>They get treated by IPS capsules which call dealing with a completely lost arm or a crushed heart easy.
Yes that's totally a lasting wound.
- 40,470
- 12,953
Oh my goodness this skill things needs to stop. Skill doesn't ignore durability.
Take Batman. Mastered every single martial art. Considered one of the smartest dudes in the universe. Outskills literal gods who have done nothing but training for thousands of years.
Tell me, you think his skill is enough to beat Doomsday?
Take Batman. Mastered every single martial art. Considered one of the smartest dudes in the universe. Outskills literal gods who have done nothing but training for thousands of years.
Tell me, you think his skill is enough to beat Doomsday?
- 5,322
- 433
It has a plot device that has made me drop/despise many series earl, people going up against impossible/improbable odds and winning. The fact is ikki is skilled and it lets him beat someone who can throw around minature suns....
I can't deal with that level of no, no context will make that ok in my mind. Its the sames reason I hate many things, when a character goes up against vastly more powerful opponents they should lose and die regardless of there improtance to the series.
There should be a point where a gap is to wide, a point where no amount of skill/luck/ability should overcome. The point where a guy via pure skill beats a women who ee with heat and throw around suns is the point I lose any interest. The fight should have started, stella rams a minture sun into him and he dies. Thats the only way I would have an into the series but according to what Ive heard ikki goes up against improbable odds all the time and wins. I despise that.
I can't deal with that level of no, no context will make that ok in my mind. Its the sames reason I hate many things, when a character goes up against vastly more powerful opponents they should lose and die regardless of there improtance to the series.
There should be a point where a gap is to wide, a point where no amount of skill/luck/ability should overcome. The point where a guy via pure skill beats a women who ee with heat and throw around suns is the point I lose any interest. The fight should have started, stella rams a minture sun into him and he dies. Thats the only way I would have an into the series but according to what Ive heard ikki goes up against improbable odds all the time and wins. I despise that.
- 20,509
- 1,590
He has lost against vastly more skilled opponents too. It's just that he actually can deal with it.
Im actually wondering do you think fights in rakudai go like.
"Fight starts"
"Fights end"
"Then people say how did he win? , via skill"
You actually see every ability being used and ikki countering them one by one. Im not gonna force you to watch a show. Im just telling you that you should give it a shot at seeing why it's so much fun to see that level of skill in play. All people go like "that's just dumb no amount of context or skill can do that", but when you actually see him flawlessly pulling everything off, it's a LOT easier to understand it. The reason why literally the only ones who even had a problem with the clone feat were people who haven't read the series.
Context is everything. So i'd say, watch the anime (12 ep), it's not that long, but you might just end up enjoying the hell out of it. If you do you can jump onto the novel knowing it just gets FAR better from that point onward.
So tl;dr. Trust me on this one and give it a shot, you'll see why amazing skill can actually do all that and still be fun and logical without needing to be "he achieved magic with skill" or anything where skill is not just "he has lived for 3 billion years" or just straight up supernatural.
Im actually wondering do you think fights in rakudai go like.
"Fight starts"
"Fights end"
"Then people say how did he win? , via skill"
You actually see every ability being used and ikki countering them one by one. Im not gonna force you to watch a show. Im just telling you that you should give it a shot at seeing why it's so much fun to see that level of skill in play. All people go like "that's just dumb no amount of context or skill can do that", but when you actually see him flawlessly pulling everything off, it's a LOT easier to understand it. The reason why literally the only ones who even had a problem with the clone feat were people who haven't read the series.
Context is everything. So i'd say, watch the anime (12 ep), it's not that long, but you might just end up enjoying the hell out of it. If you do you can jump onto the novel knowing it just gets FAR better from that point onward.
So tl;dr. Trust me on this one and give it a shot, you'll see why amazing skill can actually do all that and still be fun and logical without needing to be "he achieved magic with skill" or anything where skill is not just "he has lived for 3 billion years" or just straight up supernatural.
- 5,322
- 433
You don't understand earl he is alive after fighting people vastly more powerful then him. Thats enough for me to have no interest, he lost great! But he's still alive at this point and that breaks my suspension of disbelief. I have zero interest in someone skilling there way through battles they should die in, that fight with the arrow guy?
Ikki won because the arrow guy didn't put an arrow through his head/heart from the start, his opponent should have won that fight but didn't because ikki is skilled and he didn't go for the kill right away. That right there? Despise it with a burning passion, character wins cause enemy doesn't go for the kill right away because...Reasons.
edit ill check out episode twelve though
Ikki won because the arrow guy didn't put an arrow through his head/heart from the start, his opponent should have won that fight but didn't because ikki is skilled and he didn't go for the kill right away. That right there? Despise it with a burning passion, character wins cause enemy doesn't go for the kill right away because...Reasons.
edit ill check out episode twelve though
- 63,529
- 8,506
Don't judge the series because of this, Rakudai is a pretty decent series outside of the wiki.The pen or the sword said:
- 40,470
- 12,953
Arrow guy was in a school tournament and would've easily gotten expelled, if not outright arrested if he killed Ikki though.
- 5,322
- 433
Didn't he plan to do just that at the end?
- 63,529
- 8,506
Killing isn't discouraged in the tournaments if you're pushed to your limit, Amane showcased this when he stopped Ikki's heart.
- 8,753
- 1,617
He wasn't exactly quite right in the head. But more than anything, he was sadistic . He wasn't trying to win, he wanted to put him down as much as he could then give him a killer finish (ba dum tss).
- 5,322
- 433
Arrogance/sadism giving away the victory another of my most hated plot devices...
- 20,509
- 1,590
Ikki would have stomped if outside factors like nervousness and stuff weren't in play. It was stated.The pen or the sword said:
- 5,322
- 433
That doesn't make this any less stupid to my eyes invisible opponent has a chance to kill enemy and screws around long enough to let other guy win... yay!
- 40,470
- 12,953
If Ikki would've stomped why was he nervous? I remember the context behind the fight and he did lose a fight to the dude but it was because he would've gotten in trouble if he fought back.
Also when has Ikki ever lost?
Also when has Ikki ever lost?
Agnaa
VS Battles
Super Moderator
Administrator
Calculation Group
Translation Helper
Human Resources
Gold Supporter
- 15,578
- 13,865
From those novel quotes Earl posted above...
In that first fight with Stella Ikki doubles his physical attributes, and that turns the fight from him struggling to him completely speedblitzing Stella. He could speedblitz 7 times over with a 200x multiplier, and he'd be able to speedblitz 3 times over with a 10x multiplier, and I kinda doubt the series portrays it that way, he probably goes from struggling to barely winning.
Ikki vs Kuraudo had him blocking only feeling pain, not getting one-shot or anything, and Ittou Shura doesn't even fully turn that around, but maybe this is because of the "Ikki uses skill to block higher tier attacks into the ground" thing you mentioned to me?
@The pen or the sword You should watch the Monogatari series
In that first fight with Stella Ikki doubles his physical attributes, and that turns the fight from him struggling to him completely speedblitzing Stella. He could speedblitz 7 times over with a 200x multiplier, and he'd be able to speedblitz 3 times over with a 10x multiplier, and I kinda doubt the series portrays it that way, he probably goes from struggling to barely winning.
Ikki vs Kuraudo had him blocking only feeling pain, not getting one-shot or anything, and Ittou Shura doesn't even fully turn that around, but maybe this is because of the "Ikki uses skill to block higher tier attacks into the ground" thing you mentioned to me?
@The pen or the sword You should watch the Monogatari series
- 20,509
- 1,590
If ikki had died. Kurono is there for a reason. Dying in a tournament is actually nothing new. The very start of the tournament "the tournament takes place with material form devices, injuries or even death are not out of the question".The real cal howard said:
Literally nobody gives a shit even if you die mid tournament.
- 40,470
- 12,953
Bro I was arguing in your favor then lol...
- 5,322
- 433
Kinda reinforcing my point about him not going for the kill right away being incredibly stupid to me, arrogance and sadism are the crutch of lazy writers that need to place there characters in dire straits only to pull out the win.
