• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

Prototype Downgrades: Part 2

Status
Not open for further replies.

ByAsura

He/Him
VS Battles
Administrator
22,035
18,108
Continued from here: https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/3886846

AP

Miscellaneous
Brawlers, one of the stronger infected, are capable of destroying tanks by simply falling on them. This scales to virtually all infected/enemies in game, such as Juggernauts, Evolved, Super Soldiers, Hydra, etc.

Robert Cross uses a strain of the virus and powerful armour in order to survive Mercer's attacks, as well as weapons to deal damage.

Goliaths
Goliaths are apparently 50 feet in height, strong enough to partially shake buildings to pieces with seemingly indirect hits and can deflect rockets or tank them with virtually no damage. They always grossly outclass Heller, so I think it's fine for them to be Building level.

Now I'm going to go into why Mercer doesn't scale:

"Mercer is responsible for their creation and should be more powerful."

Mercer only released the virus that created the Goliaths, he didn't do it directly. The DX-1118 virus is consistently stated to rapidly evolve and change, even before Mercer himself make it ten times more potent.

"Mercer can control them."

After his Evolved infected almost all known Whitelight stores with cultures taken from himself, Alex was able to control all of it down to the molecular level. The virus, as mentioned before, was released from his own body, so it's highly likely he can control them simply because they're another creation of Blacklight itself, as Greene did in Hope, Idaho.

Elizabeth Greene
In her base form, Elizabeth Greene was able to easily overpowered early and mid-game Alex Mercer, meaning she easily scales above Brawlers.

Mother (her biomass form) is many storeys in height, virtually unaffected by normal Blackwatch artillery, and put a massive crater into the street upon resurfacing. Unlike Greene's page suggests, her Crimson Shockwave doesn't cover all of Times Square, more like a 20 metre radius. Through sheer size, she is easily Building level.

Lifting Strength
Quoting from the previous thread and using only cut-scene/comic feats.

All of these monsters and the Evolved would scale to BoG Mercer, who can lift a car after being heavily injured. Hydras are more than strong enough to toss heavy vehicles, but I'm not sure what breaking those restraints would get.

Greene and Goliaths are fine as they are currently, and the aforementioned monsters would likely be higher if we used feats from gameplay.

Speed
I made this point because I really doubt this is actually a sonic boom. Also, in the previous thread we agreed that dodging tank shells is reaction speed, not travel or combat. So here's a list of travel speed feats

According to WoG, the producer of Prototype intended Mercer to be faster than most vehicles, so something like Subsonic lines up with the feats above.

  • "Well. We intended Alex to be...well one of the most powerful characters in video game if you believe it. We made him powerful enough to lift cars, tanks, destroy buildings and even kicking helicopters off the air. Fast enough to outrun even the fastest vehicles. I think it's safe to say that we did a pretty good job in doing so (chuckles)" - Tim Benniso
I'm not sure how fast Brawlers or Juggernauts would be (they certainly jump and travel way faster than humans), but Leader Hunters and other monsters are capable of traveling at similar speeds to early and mid-game Mercer.
 
Just my 2 cents, the WoG isn't necessarily indicative of a level Mercer should be around.

For one, that statement means as much to me as Frieza threatening Toppo with a blast that could "destroy a planet" in the Tournament of Power despite everyone having universal feats.

Two, the statement itself is contradicting as well as vague and questionable. If the intention was to make Alex one of the most powerful characters in video games, I would think the creators didn't play many video games at all. And fast enough to outrun even the fastest vehicles could mean anything. The fastest vehicles on Earth are all supersonic at least. Your typical super car or race car can travel anywhere between 200-300 miles per hour, but those aren't the fastest vehicles.
 
WoG is consistent with most of his feats, that's the point I'm trying to pass here. It's just supporting evidence.

Frieza's statement is accurate, he can destroy a planet. It's just nothing in comparison to what he could achieve according to fan scaling.

It's clear he thinks that destroying tanks and running faster than helicopters places a character among the higher-end of video game characters, power-wise. That shows he doesn't know about other characters, not that Mercer's ability to run faster than vehicles is contradictory.

It's more likely that he's referring to the vehicles within Prototype because most of the feats he lists happen in game; Mercer can destroy Hives and Infantry Bunkers, and outrun or down Helicopters with a kick.
 
Its nothing in the scope of Frieza's feats that makes it worth mention with direct logical inferences from the show.

But he would be wrong to think that. Fans know it, and a video game professional should know this even better. Regardless there are jets in Prototype, so with your argument that would mean Mercer of capable of running at supersonic speeds.
 
No, that is generally the scope of Frieza's feats. Scaling puts him at Universe level.

That's, again, not the point, respond to the argument I actually made; he thinks all those feats make him that powerful. Most (Tim says most, not all) vehicles in Prototype aren't jets, and they don't move in anything except web of intrigue memories (and even some of those don't actually happen in the Prototype universe) and very few cutscenes.
 
The quote was "outrun even the fastest vehicles". And jets are in the last mission of the game.

"and they don't move in anything except web of intrigue memories and very few cutscenes."

This is also moving the goalposts. The vehicles don't have to move for us to determine what their speed is if we know the model of the vehicle in questions. There's no way to determine the speed in-game anyway.
 
ByAsura said:
You misunderstood what I meant. Mercer is made of the blacklight virus, but he isn't the same thing as the virions in that vial.
That's a weird statement, as not only has the game explicitly stated that Mercer is the Blacklight Virus itself multiple times (not "made of" Blacklight, but is Blacklight. As in he is the entire virus itself, not just made of it and is infected by it like the other Blacklight infected.), but has heavily implied that Mercer is the very vial that got shattered and took over the original Alex Mercer's corpse. Kind of weird to say that he isn't the Blacklight Virus outright when he actually is such...
 
@Noodles Wrong thread. Bring it up there (where I'm not going to respond anyway). Also, that's not even what I meant.

@Callsign Where, as I mentioned before, they don't move. Goalposts are with helicopters, IIRC. Also, you just shot yourself in the foot, we can't determine their speed, and jets aren't "most vehicles" in Prototype.
 
"Where, as I mentioned before, they don't move."

I've actually played this game for many years . They join the fight.

"Also, you just shot yourself in the foot, we can't determine their speed"

If you've read the sentence before that there would be no need to backtrack like this. This is something that's done universally across the wiki.

"and jets aren't "most vehicles" in Prototype."

"Fast enough to outrun even the fastest vehicles."

There's nothing saying "most vehicles". Again, the above is the actual quote. The only thing that says "most" is "most powerful", which is related to strength.
 
hey about lifting strength mercer is capable of tearing a person in half directly down the middle with his muscle mass power how much lifting strength would that require?
 
I suppose you're right then. I've literally never seen that (or at least taken notice) in my gameplays.

I read this wrong. I thought you said we don't know the model in that very same sentence, which is why I said you shot yourself in the foot.

True, I suppose I have a tendency of that. His feats generally place him around Subsonic, and aircrafts generally don't even surpass Mach 1 in populated areas.

@Sun At least Class 5.
 
It could be way higher. I don't really even remember where I got that from (I did get it from some random source).
 
also its not like he is punching you in half or anything, he litetraly grabs you by yer pectorals and rips you in two halfs with a single motion
 
Except Manhattan is being treated as a warzone and they're over the water not the city so they're already under less restrictions.

"However, "even the fastest" does not mean literally all."

Well logically if you're faster than the fastest vehicle you're faster than all of them.
 
In Prototype 1, the Red Zone is largely not infected till very, very late in the game, and like 5% to 20% are still human even by that point (Greene-Bloodtox mission to end-game). Also, there aren't many jets in Manhattan to begin with, a web of intrigue log even implies they're a last resort. Breaking the sound barrier can shatter windows.

I already removed that.
 
There aren't zones yet in Prototype 1. Manhattan was treated as a warzone from the second or third mission, and the jets come in at end game. Kind of besides the point though.
 
That really has no relevance, I just said the Red Zone because that's the area of Prototype 1, it wasn't supposed to mean anything.

As you said, they don't come until the end of the game, or really play any role in it. So I highly doubt he was even referring to it, especially since he never outruns one in-game.
 
Now you're applying criteria to a WoG statement. I highly doubt these sentences are referring to in-game since he leads with "most powerful in video games". But again this is your interpretation.
 
It makes more sense that he wouldn't be including jets that make virtually no appearance in the game and has almost no bearing on the plot. Helicopters makes more sense and is consistent.

But fine, if you want to ignore the statement entirely.
 
@Zamasu We've never seen Alex assume a Mother form, and Greene was already out when he consumed her.
 
hey i wanted to ask how we should qualifie elizabeth greene's sream as the mother it covered a good portion of time squere and was capable of destroying everthing in it tanks choppers cars as well as severely dameging Mercer
 
Sir sun man said:
hey i wanted to ask how we should qualifie elizabeth greene's sream as the mother it covered a good portion of time squere and was capable of destroying everthing in it tanks choppers cars as well as severely dameging Mercer
She'd be 8-C I think.
 
ok then it should some what scales to mercer since he was able to take the hit at the start of the fight (cutseen) i dono how to scale it proper though would it be just high 9A or flat out 8C
 
So, where's the quote that says that Bloodtox could cause necrosis to form in infected tissue? Because I'm pretty sure this should be one of the main reasonings for why Mercer's resistance to Biological Manipulation should be back on his profile.
 
I lost the link. It was in the pre-remaster version of the game (where Greene also makes an earthquake), and the video (that I uncovered after a long time) is no longer available. However, it is supposed to be the equivalent of a cancer, so that could be something.
 
Well, that's quite inconvenient.

Being akin to cancer might be good enough though, since cancer are cellular-level by default.
 
You can ask the staff and experienced members listed in the Prototype verse page to comment here.
 
Thank you for helping out. That seems to make sense, yes.
 
I kind of forgot about this thread. Most people seem to agree with '''Building level''' Mother form.
 
ByAsura said:
I kind of forgot about this thread. Most people seem to agree with Building level Mother form.
I guess it is fine to put her Mother form or Mutated key at 8-C

If it is fine and Imake the edit for it; I would put what you have in the OP roughly as justifications:

 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top