Probability Manipulation vs Precognition

[Random1201]

How would a being with the ability to manipulate Probability to their whim fare against someone who sees every future possibility and every possible brancing future ?

Conditions:

Both have a day to consider their choices

Both beings have Building level stats,Low-High Regenerationn,and FTL reactions and combat speed

Both have Genius level intelligence

 

[TheJ-ManRequiem]

Probably the prop manip, just will a meteor to hit them, can't exactly dodge that.

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

Depends how good the probability manip is.

If they can make a chance of something happening 100%, then they definitely win.

If they can just give their opponent a bit of bad luck, I'd say the precog user.

 

[Nico-v11]

Well let's say that prob guy makes it possible for precog guy to have a stroke or a heart attack. Well not much can be done there

 

[Huesito88]

But then let's just say the person also has regen (low,high) and universal teleportation. Then?

 

[Nico-v11]

Peak human stats bro

 

[Nico-v11]

The probabilty of the next Big Bang happening.....and then happening the next instant. Really broken power for high tier users

 

[Huesito88]

Wouldn't that also kill the user. Also imagine lighting striking 100 times where the other character is located

 

[Nico-v11]

Universal teleportation would save him....probably

 

[TheJ-ManRequiem]

These are just peak humans with the powers, the prop manip wins, heart attack, outside if forces, etc and even ifprecog knows it will happen he can't avoid it or orevent various things due to peak human stats.

 

[Nico-v11]

The most powerful prob user will always beat the most powerful precog user with only peak human stats being used

 

[Random1201]

Changed the OP to make it more interesting

 

[Perilouss]

Probability manipulation stomps

Probability manipulation vs Future Manipulation is a better matchup imo

 

[Authorofall]

Fiction allows you to quickly summarise a question of this nature by pointing the arrow to superiority (i.e A>B) like no man's business; however the truth of it is that there's faaaaaaaaaa.....arrr more implications to a question of this magnitude that it'd boggle any human mind, & there ain't enough books in the Earth & words in the dictionary to explain the reasons why.

First of all, a paradox inhibits the question from even making sense. To know all of the future & how everything results also means you've known the intricacies of how everything that exist works. This is absolute knowledge—omniscient. It means to have the capacity to contain & comprehend infinity in your heart. But to be all knowing, wouldn't this also mean you're always present everywhere—all of creation? So all along you couldn't help but have infinite speed (not whatever speed OP proposed); hence the inhibition to the question even making sense.

To manipulate all probability seems to me like an automatic step to Godhood as well. It means all things that exist—all creation— must bend to your will & obey your every command.....So all along you're actually all powerful.

So all along, this was actually a case of all powerful Vs all knowing; but how can you be all powerful but not all knowing? How can also be all knowing without being all powerful? Therefore a case of ominipotent Vs ominipotent exist. Now how can omnipotent Vs ominipotent even work as a question? ..............So all along we were dealing with the same Personality, therefore a fight never took place because it's literally beyond the realm of reasoning for it to take place.

 

[Nico-v11]

Being all knowing doesn't mean you're capable of doing everything you know

 

[Authorofall]

It does. This isn't fiction where we can be told someone is all-knowing, yet limited in a durability stat—by being somekind of mortal in a lesser plane of existence or dimensionality which shys away from the absolute.

The moment OP brought all-knowing into the picture, we ceased from talking about mortality (or some dude with building lvl stat); now we talk (absolute) immortality—you were there before the foundations of all the universe, & you've known the end from the beginning & vise versa; not bound to any concept, including the ones we're familiar with (like energy, time & space). However, for you to be there before the foundation of all the universe, you ought to be an Almighty Personality.

 

[Joseph619]

Precog isn't very useful against good probability manipulation, since it only sees a possible future which is altered by probability manipulation.

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

Authorofall... you can be completely omniscient without being omnipotent or having existed from the start of the universe. Just because you can know about something in all its intricacies doesn't mean you can affect it in any way if such a thing is beyond your abilities to begin with. You can have the knowledge without being able to do anything about it.

Which is why in this case, the probability user wins.

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

First of all, a paradox inhibits the question from even making sense. To know all of the future & how everything results also means you've known the intricacies of how everything that exist works. This is absolute knowledge—omniscient. It means to have the capacity to contain & comprehend infinity in your heart. But to be all knowing, wouldn't this also mean you're always present everywhere—all of creation?

No. Being omniscient is not omnipresense, and your argument begins to break down on its first conclusion.

To manipulate all probability seems to me like an automatic step to Godhood as well. It means all things that exist—all creation— must bend to your will & obey your every command.....So all along you're actually all powerful.

Probability manipulation on its highest level is still absolutely nothing to an omnipotent who are already beyond such things by a degree immeasurably beyond infinity. At most it would be High 1-B seeing as probability is a fundamentally mathematical concept and 1-A and higher are already beyond all maths.

So all along, this was actually a case of all powerful Vs all knowing; but how can you be all powerful but not all knowing?

Its entirely possible. They just have to not want to know it. E.g. the LoI

How can also be all knowing without being all powerful?

Also entirely possible as I covered above. Just because you know everything about something doesn't mean you can affect it in any or every (because that's what you would need to be omnipotent) way

If we are actually taking both probablity manipulation and precognition (and not retrocognition btw) to their highest possible levels of power, it becomes a high tier reality warper vs a physically human nigh-omniscient. Obviously the probability user just warps them away

 

[Joseph619]

Precognition users also needs good reaction time, the user can't wait forever to see the future and act accordingly since the opponent will also be on the move meanwhile. A character with slow reaction time won't get much advantage from precog, whereas probability manipulation is generally a passive ability which even helps slower characters

 

[Kaltias]

Depends from the probability manipulation, i'd say. If the probability user can send its chances of winning to 51% or above, then it wins most of the time. If both are at the maximum possible, the probability user just give the other a 100% chance of losing or something like that

 

[Authorofall]

How can you know all things yet not be all powerful? How....(Nah forget it).

I could introduce a scientific concept that'd reach a conclusion of "matter" (particle) existing in the "heart" but that'd mess up a lot of minds (I might have to talk about quantum physics—the wave particle duality theorem & all the implications we've had via experimentation; & space/time & even the Origin)

Sometimes I think "if only I could pull you into the literal thinkings of my mind" & to see some of my perceptive but like I said, there ain't enough books on this planet to explain the technicalities of such concepts; there aren't even books on the planet to explain the technicalities of how a grain of sand came to be.

(I've read the tier-system here & while they might work for fictio many times; reality is a completely different story).

 

[Kaltias]

Yeah, but this is fiction. Nonsensical stuff happens all the time

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

@Authorofall I really think you are thinking too deeply into this if you are getting into quantim physics and wave particle duality tbh

An omnipotent can choose to be all-knowing, but they don't have to be.

Why would a person need to be omnipotent to be all knowing? Like I said, there is a different between knowing everything, and being capable of anything.

 

[Authorofall]

OP is asking arbitrarily which is superior of the two. He wasn't speaking (addressing) a particular fictional character Vs another fiction character in which case the Authors (of both fictional character) would've introduced a system by themselves, placed a definite structure & limitation; but flat-out asking which concept is superior.

"All major truths are parallel" You'd be unwise to answer such a question without drawing knowledge from a superior source. The superior being what you observe in reality (the 3D world we live in) & the inferior being works of fiction (created by us) & subject to total obliteration.

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

If precognition is put to its highest limit, i.e. being able to see and comprehend the infinite possible and impossible futures, and probability manipulation is also put to its highest limit of being able to make anything that can be described in terms of probability (High 1-B and lower) have a 100% or 0% chance of happening, and all other factors are equal, the probability use is going to win.