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Apologies, but I can't help much as I just saw this thread and commented recently, but I will try.
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Pokemon Upgrade: Necrozma and High 3-A
- Thread starter ProfessorKukui4Life
- Start date
- Status
Rikimarox2
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Only staff members? Or all members?
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Just so we're clear, Low 6-B comes from the Bird Trio, who could take down Lugia by working together, so they are each at a third of its power level.
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Quick question, is it like the lake trio combing hax to calm palkia and dialga but with AP? because team work like that would make them downscale from lugia rather than dividing the tier.
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Yeah, but the Musketeers get a “likely 5-B to 4-B” for being implied to be able to fight Kyurem (if revisions go over, this would become “likely 3-C to High 3-A”). Therian Form legendary genies scale to them.
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Considering there isn't a single statement of Ultra Space being infinite in size, and that it explicity having an opposite side according to PokéSpe (which shouldn't even be possible in an infinite sized location since they can't have edges, this is the reason we don't accept the DCU as infinite sized despite its statements of being infinite in size), I strongly disagree with this upgrade.
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Its other side not opposite side, and there's already evidence of the universe being infinite, and infinity can have edges
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Which again, means it has edges.
There's literally 0 statements saying the Ultra Space is infinite, even the OP doesn't have a single scan on it because there simply isn't.
An infinite sized place can't have edges, that would imply it having a limit to its space, which in turn means it isn't infinite to begin with.
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It can be infinite and expanding, and if a universe has an actual edge that implies its not expanding, and there already are scans of infinite space in the pokemon universe. And having another side doesn't mean it has edges where'd you get that from? There's also the infinite power statement from xerneas, solgaleo and lunala, and victini so its consistent
Lou_change
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Ok imagine you have infinite apples and infinite oranges in an infinite universe the fruit might be touching each other or never touch each other because infinity doesn't follow one line of logic.
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Something can't be infinite AND expanding, since expanding means it is stil growing in size, automatically meaning it isn't infinite.
Something not expanding =/= its size is infinite. The Earth isn't expanding and that doesn't mean it is infinite in size.
Necrozma's feat isn't in the Pokémon World, it's in Ultra Space. Besides, even if it was in the Pokémon World, the individual universes aren't infinite in size either.
From the fact something can't have sides if it doesn't have edges. You can look at any geometrical figure for reference, only something without an edge can lack sides since that means there's nothing limiting its size.
"Infinite power" is the absolute most common hyperbole ever. Tons of characters have "infinite power" statements and that doesn't make them High 3-A, you can read our standards regarding statements and see this.
Hasty12345
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it could just be infinite in it's xy plane but be finite in it's z-axis (i.e. it's not "omni-directionally" infinite), therefore it can have a parallel (opposite) plane which is also infinite in it's xy plane.
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Professor4life isn't gonna be happy about this....
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Something that's infinite can still grow. You do realize that infinity has several higher degrees, right?
Nice strawman, i never said "Something not expanding =/= its size is infinite", if you think the edge is an actual edge, then by that logic the universe isnt even expanding
Necrozma did absorb the light of the universe and all of ultra space which should logically include all universes. Individual universes are stated to be infinite by lucian
Another side can just mean another part of ultra space
Where's the evidence of the consistent infinite power statements being hyperbole? The necrozma feat alone is more than enough to prove those aren't hyperbole
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Let's debunk this nonsense a bit:
- Ultra Space is the dimension which contains all the possible Ultra Wormholes, and these ultra Wormholes are "likely infinite" as explained in the Part 4 and 5 of the blog, so going against them being infinite means going against a cosmology blog accepted after a whole discussion.
- The blog ecen explains why "infinity can expand", because of bigger infinities being a thing in the following line: Aside from that, literally nothing states that there are newly created new universes per mirror since, once again, the universes are already there, meaning that there are already infinite universes since all the possible variants of the universe are present in the mirrors at once. The infinitely-expanding universes can perfectly mean just the universes being generated as new cartridges are bought as told in an earlier part of the blog. Even moreso, there are different sizes of Infinity, meaning that an already infinite set of universes can become even bigger, reaching a new size of Infinity bigger than before, without an actual limit. Multiverse's larger than the size of Baseline 2-A exist here for a reason, and are entirely viable to have. Ergo, my dear Ion, this was already debunked.
- An infinite sized place can have edges, tf are you saying. Imagine yourself a tunnel, of infinite lenght and wide 4 metres. The tunnel has a zig zag shape, meaning that it already has infinite edges. To futher support this, imagine that in said tunnel there are even 2 lines, the left made of apples, and the right one made of pineapples, both of them stretching infinitely in the tunnel with said zig zag line. There are now 2 opposite sized, despite both being infinite in size because infinite lenght. But isn't even done here. Imagine now yourself in front of an horizontal line full of white spheres, that is infinite in lenght as well. You decide to make all the spheres at your right black instead of white. You yout got 2 sides of spheres, one black and the other white, with both of them being infinite.
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Only staff members. They make the final decisions.
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@KieranH10 @Starter_Pack @The_real_cal_howard @SamanPatou @GyroNutz @Dragonmasterxyz
What do you think of Kukui's suggested compromise solution and of Ionliosite's objections to this revision?
What do you think of Kukui's suggested compromise solution and of Ionliosite's objections to this revision?
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Yes, and saying that infinity cannot expand is extremely absurd, its very obvious why that's wrong
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I personally have to agree with this.
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- Thread starter
- #266
Hey all. Sorry again that im responding late. I've been busy the past few days so I couldn't form a response sooner. I'll respond to things to give clarity to while I've been away from this.
The only ones who would get the likely are Necrozma, the light trio, the Tapu, the UB's, Sivally, Melmetal, Zeraora, Beware (Anime) and the Aura Trio. Everyone else is getting a "Possibly". The formers getting the likely is fine since we know for a fact that the light trio and aura trio scale from Necrozma, the Tapu scale from said light trio, the UB's scale from said Tapu, Sivally, Zeraora and anime Beware scale from said UBs, and Melmetal scales from Sivally. Everyone else downscales from them, but to lesser extents, so "Possibly" fits better with them as a more reasonable upgrade than everyone just getting likely.
So not everyone would be getting a "Likely" rating, which makes this much more agreeable under this compromise.
And it seems the stuff about "infinites and edges" were already addressed in my absence, so I think that should be good too.
Thats actually exactly what we decided mid-thread, I just haven't had a chance to update my OP. My bad on that. But you hit the nail on the head with this.
The only ones who would get the likely are Necrozma, the light trio, the Tapu, the UB's, Sivally, Melmetal, Zeraora, Beware (Anime) and the Aura Trio. Everyone else is getting a "Possibly". The formers getting the likely is fine since we know for a fact that the light trio and aura trio scale from Necrozma, the Tapu scale from said light trio, the UB's scale from said Tapu, Sivally, Zeraora and anime Beware scale from said UBs, and Melmetal scales from Sivally. Everyone else downscales from them, but to lesser extents, so "Possibly" fits better with them as a more reasonable upgrade than everyone just getting likely.
So not everyone would be getting a "Likely" rating, which makes this much more agreeable under this compromise.
And it seems the stuff about "infinites and edges" were already addressed in my absence, so I think that should be good too.
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So who disagrees to even a "possibly" high 3-A?
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- Thread starter
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Zeraora I mentioned, but yeah I forgot the other 3. They'd get the likely too.
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Don't know about the other three, but I do believe you're looking for Bewear (Anime)
Lou_change
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Thank you both.
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Guzma should also get the likely high 3-A, with z moves. He's already regarded as stronger than the elite four
Same for Kukui since he has strong z moves and also has a tapu ko- hol up, how does Kukui not have a profile?
Same for Kukui since he has strong z moves and also has a tapu ko- hol up, how does Kukui not have a profile?
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1) Guzma hasn't even the 4-B Z move to begin with.
2) Derailing again, ruining a thread already controversal from its own.
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Considering everyone and their mother disagreed with Ion's counter-argument.
No, still siding with Kukui.
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Guzma should get it though, with z moves
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Why?
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IIRC the E4 in SM could fight UBs with z moves or something
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- Thread starter
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Please enough with this derailing, once again Garchomp. This thread is already controversial enough as it is, and you've already been told continuously to stop this.
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The only Z-Move that should be considered for this right now is Ash’s Pikachu’s 10,000,000 Volt Thunderbolt because that has actually defeated opponents that would fall under at least 3-C, likely High 3-A.
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