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Pokemon Types Revisions REDUX

The real cal howard said:
I fail to find a single instance in fiction in general where a mind manipulator falls prey to that of a mind manipulator of equal potency to them without a mental struggle ensuing.
Click to expand...
That's not how we treat things here. I mean no disrespect here but Pokemon is not going to get special treatment Cal because you want Pokemon to have mind resistance. You disagree, make a CRT. Otherwise what you believe is irrelevant.
 
@Cal if you believe in what you are saying, you should make a thread to give all mind manipulators mind manipulation resistance rather than discussing it here
 
Dragonmasterxyz said:
Yes it is. Shown outside the games once. That is all that's needed especially when this has been the case in game for 20+ years. There is no denying that. This is a fact. That is the very definition of consistency Kukui.
Click to expand...
It doesn't matter if its been a case in the games if it is game mechanics all said 20 years. One instance outside of the games, instead of at least a few, doesnt make it consistent. 2 wrongs dont make a right. Either that, or we give Pikachu or every electric type resistance negation for electricity manipulation.

If anything, if we take Cals word about status moves ignoring the type thats supposed to resist them seriousy, that would instead mean status moves have resistance negation themselves unlike the normal moves that get resisted.
 
Who says it's game mechanics in the first place. You are all going by the assumption that all moves are bound by type affinities, especially non offensive ones. It is not game mechanics. Prove to me that it's game mechanics. Show me these being labeled as a game mechanic. You can't slap Game Mechanics on something just because you don't want you Dark types to lose their resistance when all evidence points to it working. All the games blatantly show this and the series outside the games show this. This one time valibates the game's which further supports this source. It is not game mechanics. Two wrongs don't make a right. But you have not proven that this is a wrong. You have no proof. Your arguing from incredulity as you have no evidence that states this is contradicted nor a game mechanic. All you can say is that "It's game mechanics". That is not going to fly and I am sure no one else here is going to let that fly either

That's simply trying to make something unfavorable to you favorable instead of accepteing the fact of the matter. This is blatant dishonesty.
 
Returning to the topic, Psychic- types resist Psychic- type because something about their bodies resist the facets of the type. Yet apparently, their bodies are picky like that and can resist multiple facets of the type but not the rest, despite both Confusion and Hypnosis relying on PSI according to Hypno's Pokedex entries. So Pokemon both can and can't resist PSI simply because. They can resist the telekinesis of Psychic and Confusion but not that of Telekinesis. They resist moves that are literally stated to be with "psychic capabilities" but can't resist the same psychic power to be used in a different way. They resist someone attacking their dreams, which are completely mental-based, but not resisting any other thing that attacks their mental state. And best yet, they can focus and strengthen their mind to a hilarious extent, but it doesn't mean anything to a separate mental attack.
 
And it is not one time as it would have worked on Greninja if he did not block the sound with his tongue.

Xerosic Malamar Hypnosis Adventures
 
"Who say's its game mechanics in the first place. You are all going by the assumption that all moves are bound by type affinies, especially non offensive ones. It is not game mechanics/ Prove to me that it's game mechanics. Show me these being labeled as a game mechanic."

Cal's explanation on status moves above very much proves this being a game mechanic.

"And the series outside the games show this. This one time validates the games which further supports this source"

A single time, which means literally nothing. Not even 2 times for this happening, just once. Never again. If that doesnt tell you it's inconsistent, IDK what will. Again, Pikachu has effected ground types with electric moves in the series outside the games too and we say no to that. Hypnosis is the same. Unless you accept Pikachu having resistance negation for being able to electricute ground types, neither is getting accepted here.
 
Dragonmasterxyz said:
And it is not one time as it would have worked on Greninja if he did not block the sound with his tongue.
Xerosic Malamar Hypnosis Adventures
Click to expand...
Speculation. Not to mention the pokemon using it is a combo of both Psychic and Dark types. It being able to effect other dark types isn't a surprise at all.
 
Malamar has the best mental abilities of any non-Legendary Pokemon. Even if I was 100% right Malamar could still affect Greninja.
 
Oh so now this doesn't count. So now we are blatantly ignoring everything. What the actual shit you two.
 
Burden of Proof is for you to disprove this with scans of the contrary. I wonder who everyone else would side with here. I wonder who a neutral party would side with here. Kalt agrees with me and so do many others. I will happily leave this to a vote.
 
Dragon you should calm down before you say something you'd regret. Just take a step back for a bit man.

That being said, as of now I'm agreeing more that Dark types shouldn't immediately resist mindhax. As for other stuff, not sure right now.
 
Dragonmasterxyz said:
Oh so now this doesn't count. So now we are blatantly ignoring everything. What the actual shit you two.
Click to expand...
It wields the most compelling hypnotic powers of any Pokémon, and it forces others to do whatever it wants.
~ X Pokédex​
U owe me an apology.
 
I owe you nothing as regardless, it shows Hypnosis works on Dark Types. I showed sources for this, yet you have shown nothing of the contrary.
 
>Hypnosis has worked on Dark Types for 20+ years.

Game Mechanics.

>Shows a scan of it working on Dark Types

Inconsistent.

>Shows another scan.

Specualtion. Doesn't count because it's Malamar.

I can't even believe all of this at all...
 
Plus, what you didn't post Dragon, proves my point even more about Malamar.

For one, Malamar's hypnosis is done using a sound wave frequency, not hypnotic suggestion like the actual move Hypnosis does. Frequency is what you hear, hypnotising is what you see. So Malamar's hypnosis isn't even the actual move, it's its own thing. Second, Malamar is again both a psychic and dark type. It's natural capabilities are derived from both attribrutes. So even with the benefit of the doubt, it being able to effect another dark type like Greninja isnt a surprise.
 
Umm. Read your scan again. The Hypnosis is DUE to Malamar. Hypnosis can be sound based my friend. Saying it's only by sight is false. Malamar proves this much. Hypnosis is Hypnosis regardless. What you showed proves jack and shit.

That is not even a mechanic in series. Show me a source where this is stated. Being Psychic/Dark doesn't make your Hypnosis part Dark. That's not how that works, that not how it ever worked. Stop making things up.
 
So posting a scan where its literally stated to be because of Malamar's pokedex abilities means it can be applied to the actual move Hypnosis?

That is 100% false.
 
ProfessorKukui4Life said:
Dragonmasterxyz said:
Speculation? That is literally what's stated on Bulbapedia. https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/XerosicOh what, now because it is a Dark type it is effective. Now you are pulling shit out of your ass. You know damn well that being part dark does not make Hypnosis part dark. Seriously now?
Click to expand...
Because it's not the move Hypnosis. It's Malamars own abilities.
Click to expand...
Which is Hypnosis.

"Malamar's known moves are Hypnosis, Topsy-Turvy, and Night Slash, and his Ability is Contrary."

Directly from the site.
 
When it locks eyes with an enemy, it will use a mix of PSI moves such as Hypnosis and Confusion.
~ Hypno's Red and LeafGreen Pokedex entries​
Game outright says that Confusion and Hypnosis are based on the same thing. Yet being able to resist PSI of Confusion doesn't mean you can resist the PSI of Hypnosis? They're the same PSI, and Pokemon's bodies interpret it as PSI, but one can be no-sold while the other goes full on.
 
That's...

That doesnt hange the fact that it didnt resist mind manip.

What does it being a dark type have to do with it affecting people that supposeably have a resistance.?

I legit dont want to debate pokemon because the last time a staff member threatened me, but seeing these arguments, i can see why Dragon is getting aggressive.
 
ProfessorKukui4Life said:
So posting a scan where its literally stated to be because of Malamar's pokedex abilities means it can be applied to the actual move Hypnosis?
That is 100% false.
Click to expand...
100% false when said website even says it is the move Hypnosis and lists it as the actual ability. What?
 
Because we are suddenly trying to apply the pokemons own pokedexs abilities to the actual move, making them equal, which is NOT true. Otherwise why would Malamar be stated to have the best mind hax out of all non-legendaries if the actual move hypnosis can do the same thing to the same degree?

Thats what I don't agree on.
 
Because, just because it's the move Hypnosis =/= it has the same potency. Like Hypno, his move Hynosis is easily gonna be stronger than they Hypnosis of a Stantler. Same for Malamar.
 
Dragonmasterxyz said:
ProfessorKukui4Life said:
Dragonmasterxyz said:
Speculation? That is literally what's stated on Bulbapedia. https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/XerosicOh what, now because it is a Dark type it is effective. Now you are pulling shit out of your ass. You know damn well that being part dark does not make Hypnosis part dark. Seriously now?
Click to expand...
Because it's not the move Hypnosis. It's Malamars own abilities.
Click to expand...
Which is Hypnosis.
"Malamar's known moves are Hypnosis, Topsy-Turvy, and Night Slash, and his Ability is Contrary."

Directly from the site.
Click to expand...
Then why would that scan state it comes from Malamar's own feat of having better mind control than other pokemon instead of just saying it comes from the actual move?

Also Dragon, that link doesnt work.
 
@Cal nah, it wasn't you (You're too wholesome) It was some random staff member who went crazy when i said cross composite scaling seems to be an exclusive thing to pokemon that i didnt agree on. Ill look for the thread, but im pretty sure the guy got banned already for other things.
 
Want to repost them?
 
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