• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

Pokemon Discussion Thread - Red & Blue arc

Still not big on this fragmented form of revising these...

That aside, game final evos are 6-C via Abomasnow, not High 7-A
 
Just a question, how do we know what pokemon is above what/which pokemon are comparable and which are not?

The profiles just kinda say this with no explanation, so what do we rank the Pokemon based on?
 
Apparently, the Pokemon Singapore Championships is tonight:



Starts in about a little under 3 hours & 20 minutes, at 3 UTC, IIRC.

Surprisingly, unlike the usual Pokemon VGC streams on Youtube, this one (currently, as I type this) has chat enabled.
 
Apparently, the Pokemon Singapore Championships is tonight:



Starts in about a little under 3 hours & 20 minutes, at 3 UTC, IIRC.

Surprisingly, unlike the usual Pokemon VGC streams on Youtube, this one (currently, as I type this) has chat enabled.

As of about 20 minutes ago, it has begun. Surprisingly late, but oh well. Maybe I miscalculated?

For now, it's just the commentators talking. I assume tech set up & stuff need to happen; Even at regular VGC Events, there can often be around 45 minutes before a match is shown on stream.
 
As of about 20 minutes ago, it has begun. Surprisingly late, but oh well. Maybe I miscalculated?

For now, it's just the commentators talking. I assume tech set up & stuff need to happen; Even at regular VGC Events, there can often be around 45 minutes before a match is shown on stream.
About 20 minutes ago from THIS post, they finally begun their 1st stream match. UI is also different from the usual. There was also a disconnect. I wonder what their tech support is doing.
 


Very interesting info on the in-game AI in Gen 1s, 2 & 3.
Note this info from the description:
Gen 1 AI Writeups https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/gameboy/367023-pokemon-red-version/faqs/64175/ai

Gen 2 AI Writeups

Gen 3 AI Writeups
*This info is from the Emerald Kaizo romhack, but aside from changing some moves and adding others, the AI works as it does in the vanilla game for Gen 3.

(On a related note, I hate how YT truncates long urls, & turns all urls into redirects.)
 
Last edited:


Apparently, the guy who took a Hyper Beam from Lance's Dragonite is a Black Belt -based on spriting- & he has an appearance in Pokemon Masters: Ex.

"A long time ago... when I was still a security guard for the gift shop... A frighteningly strong opponent... but it was because of that that I decided to reach the top! But I'm still scared of Hyper Beam!"

So uhhh, yeah? IIRC, games are canon to Masters, but Masters isn't canon to games.

Still, his sprite in HG/SS helps identify him as a Black Belt.

This'd suggest more humans scaling to Pokemon. Although, Black Belts often have the stronger physical feats among NPCs. The upper limits, I suppose?

The Masters Ex dialogue, for what it's worth, indicates that he found Lance/Lance's Dragonite "frighteningly strong" to the point that, although it did inspire him to train to be stronger, years later, he's still scared of the move that hit him.
 

I took notice of this.
Some interesting sections from it:
Psychic CameronRoute 123Daze and confuse!Ones with weird powers.I can see through exactly what you're thinking!RSE
I can see through everything you're thinking.ORAS
Telepathy feat?
Battle Girl CyndyRoute 115The first strike wins!Speedy Fighting type.RSE
Speedy Fighting types.ORAS
If my Pokémon lose, I'll carry on the fight!RSE
If my Pokémon lose, I'll carry on the fight myself!ORAS
Human scaling to Pokemon? That or a desperation move; Just because you continue the fight doesn't mean you can do anything, let alone beat whatever beat your Pokemon.
Elite Four DrakeEver Grande CityRSE
Pokémon LeagueORAS
Harness strong abilities.RSE
Harnessing the strongest stats.ORAS
The raw power of Dragons!RSE
The latent power of Dragon types!ORAS
I dedicate myself to the Pokémon that saved me.RSE
I battle every day to understand and be understood by my Pokémon.ORAS
Interesting how his dialogue changed with the remakes.
Elite Four GlaciaEver Grande CityRSE
Pokémon LeagueORAS
I use items for help.RSE
I make use of items to assist in battle.ORAS
Flaming passion in icy cold.RSE
Flaming passion in icy cold!ORAS
The Ice-type can be better trained in this hot land.RSE
The Ice type can be trained to greater levels because of the heat here.ORAS
Ice-types have more potential if raised in hot lands? At least, that's what Glacia believes, but she also raises like, 2 or 3 Pokemon from Spheal's line, which can have Thick Fat. I wonder if it's true for Glalie & others...? "Push your limits to the extreme" & all that is what she means, right?
Triathlete IsaiahRoute 128Exploit the environment!All hail the Water type!I won't be beaten by some beach bum Swimmer!RSE
I won't be beaten by any beach-bum Swimmer!ORAS
Prideful much? Admittedly, sports are inherently competitive, but I do wonder if this implies he can outswim other swimmers. Or only just the ones that are lazy/"beach-bums"?
Psychic JackiRSERoute 123Battle at full power.Pokémon of many mysteries.When we spoke, I was really using telepathy.
Another apparent telepathy feat?
Old Couple John & JayMeteor FallsOur love lets us prevail.We've had them for years.Married 50 years, we've devotedly raised Pokémon.RSE
Married 50 years—we've had plenty of experience raising Pokémon together!ORAS
Shoutouts to that experience.
Ace Duo Jude & RoryORASVictory RoadWe make an exquisite combination.Anything is fine as long as it's strong.Strongest combination? Right here!
Conceit? Or should we take them seriously with the "Strongest combination? Right here!". Are they just a lovey-dovey couple who think they're the strongest, or should we lend some credibility to the idea that they're the strongest, at least among Ace Trainer couples, lol?
Triathlete KatelynRSERoute 128All-out offensive!Water Pokémon rule!I must swim over 6 miles every day.
(Originally 10 km. Likely just converted to 6 miles for localization because USA uses Imperial rather than metric. Stamina feat?)
Leader Tate&LizaRS
Mystic Duo Tate&LizaE
Leader Liza & TateORAS
Mossdeep CityWe battle in cooperation.RSE
We battle in cooperation!ORAS
Always friendly Pokémon.RSE
Pokémon that are always friendly!ORAS
We understand each other, and we understand others.RS
Papa has trouble telling the two of us apart!E
We can read each others' minds—and the minds of our opponents, too.ORAS
Their "Favorite Pokémon" section (The 2nd section) presents some interesting implications about their teams.... Also, more telepathy feats. Oh & apparently even their own dad has trouble telling them apart.
Fairy Tale Girl MomoORASMt. PyreI leave that up to my Pokémon.Fairy types, I guess.I love Pokémon. It's people I'm no good with.
A Fairy Tale Girl Class Trainer who, for her "strategy" section, says "I leave that up to my Pokémon.". Interesting behavioural note.
Ace Trainer NevilleORASRoute 108I just let myself go with the flow.Pokémon that know Surf.I'm a Trainer who likes to splash about drifting in the troughs between waves.
He's found on Route 108, which is practically all water, & this guy likes "drifting in the troughs between waves", & Pokemon that know Surf. Swimming Stamina feat?
Black Belt NobRoute 115Grand slam pummeling!Fighting type.RSE
Fighting types.ORAS
Not to brag, but I can bust ten roof tiles!RSE
Not to brag, but I can bust through 10 bricks with my fists!ORAS
Another AP/Striking Strength for Pokemon World humans. (GSC Chuck & that 1 Black Belt that can break boulders may be better, though.)
Leader NormanRSORAS
Reliable One DadE
Petalburg CityI flexibly adapt my style.Grown in a balanced manner.RSE
Those grown in a balanced manner.ORAS
Pokémon are my life. My chosen path is harsh...RS
I walk the 30 minutes from home to here every day.E
I've chosen to dedicate my life to Pokémon, but the road is hard...ORAS
Apparently, Petalburg to Littleroot is a 30 minute walk in Emerald?
Elite Four PhoebeEver Grande CityRSE
Pokémon LeagueORAS
Confuse and confound.RSE
Confuse and confound opponents.ORAS
There's nothing definite.RSE
It's hard to pin them down.ORAS
I wonder how my grandma at Mt. Pyre is doing?RSE
I wonder how my grandma is doing at Mt. Pyre.ORAS
Weird "Favorite Pokémon" section, considering her team is clearly specialized in/focused on Ghost types.
Ace Trainer PortiaORASRoute 109A stable kind of battling.Large Pokémon that I can ride on.I get "surfsick" real easy, but even when feeling bad, I'm not too shabby.
Good Stamina/Intelligence feat, I guess? Or just confident.
Sis and Bro Rita & SamRS
Sis and Bro Lila & RoyE
Sis & Bro Rita & SamORAS
Route 124We split our duties.RSE
We each take a different role!ORAS
We like friendly Pokémon.RSE
We like friendly Pokémon!ORAS
We enjoy Pokémon together as sister and brother.RSE
We enjoy our Pokémon together as siblings!ORAS
Their names were Rita & Sam in Ruby & Sapphire, then changed to "Lila & Roy" in Emerald, then changed back to "Rita & Sam" for OR/AS.
Elite Four SidneyEver Grande CityRSE
Pokémon LeagueORAS
Offense over defense!RSE
The best defense is a good offense!ORAS
The Dark side's beauties.RSE
The aesthetics of the Dark side!ORAS
They said I was a punk, but I'm one of the Elite Four!RSE
You can talk all you want—all that matters is how strong I am, right?ORAS
Behavioural info.
PokéManiac SteveRSE
Poké Maniac SteveORAS
Route 114Wrestle down with power.RSE
I'll pin you down with power...ORAS
Took all night to catch.RSE
It took me all night to catch it...ORAS
Big, burly, and buff Pokémon are the best...RSE
Big, burly, and buff Pokémon are the best for me...ORAS
It took him "all night" to catch his Pokemon, eh?
It's apparently an Aron. Route 114 is right outside Meteor Falls, but Aron is normally found in Granite Cave near Dewford Town, relatively far away. Did Steve catch it a while ago? Either way, if it took "all night", is that a credit to the human or the Pokemon? At least Aron, despite being only 40 cm, is 60 kg, so it kinda fits the "burly & buff" part, even if not the "big" part.
Champion StevenRSORAS
Hard as Rock StevenE
UnknownRSE
Pokémon LeagueORAS
Pick on the foe's weakness.RS
Attack the weak points!E
Strike enemies where they're weakest!ORAS
The ultimate Steel Pokémon.RS
Ultimate Steel Pokémon.E
The ultimate Steel-type Pokémon.ORAS
When it comes down to it, I'm still the strongest!RS
I'm the strongest and most energetic after all!E
When it comes down to it, I'm just the strongest there is right now.ORAS
Neat behavioural info.
Hex Maniac ValerieMt. PyreSlow, steady suffering.Scary to meet at night.RSE
Ones you'd be afraid to meet at night.ORAS
I see things that others can't see...RSE
I see things that no one else seems to see...ORAS
if we take that quote seriously, Extrasensory Perception?
Rich Boy WinstonRoute 104Strategy? Who needs it?I spent big money on it!RSE
I've spent tons of money on training it!ORAS
I, being rich, sleep in a custom Pokémon bed.RSE
Rich me sleeps in a bed of Pokémon.ORAS
Why did the remake make it sound like he uses his living Pokemon for his bed instead of just a bed designed around Pokemon?
 
Are the FRLG League rematches considered canon or useable for scaling? Because if so then Clair, the Johto League and potentially that Black Belt all maybe have High 6-A scaling from Mewtwo. A nameless Black Belt being Mewtwo level seems pretty silly though, especially if we go with the assumption that his strength should equal his durability.
 
Are the FRLG League rematches considered canon or useable for scaling? Because if so then Clair, the Johto League and potentially that Black Belt all maybe have High 6-A scaling from Mewtwo. A nameless Black Belt being Mewtwo level seems pretty silly though, especially if we go with the assumption that his strength should equal his durability.
Unsure.
In theory, that Black Belt could just be called an outlier. The only known history he has after it, aside from fleeing after the attack, is in something not canon to the main games.

IDK if the Elite Four are equal to Legendaries. Might be a topic worth more discussion.
 
In theory, that Black Belt could just be called an outlier. The only known history he has after it, aside from fleeing after the attack, is in something not canon to the main games.
That might be for the best tbh.

IDK if the Elite Four are equal to Legendaries. Might be a topic worth more discussion.
I believe they’d still be scaling to the Tower Duo due to HGSS (Which might be another reason why we should ignore the Hyper Beam moment lol).
 
Question, how do the balms in Legends Arceus work? Their purpose is to calm down the frenzying bosses, however they’re also used against Arceus itself which obviously isn’t berserk or anything. Also when you deplete its “HP” the battle just kinda ends. Is Arceus just arbitrarily deciding to stop at a certain point or something?
 
Question, how do the balms in Legends Arceus work? Their purpose is to calm down the frenzying bosses, however they’re also used against Arceus itself which obviously isn’t berserk or anything. Also when you deplete its “HP” the battle just kinda ends. Is Arceus just arbitrarily deciding to stop at a certain point or something?
The Balms in the Arceus fight are probably it's way of giving you a 'weapon' based on your experiences in the adventure, and it's giving you a final challenge. It ends the fight by more or less giving you a pat on the back and saying 'good job', so seemingly all of it was arranged by Arceus to give you a chance to 'win'.
 

"A Nintendo Direct is on the way! Watch the livestream starting at 7:00 AM PT on 6/18 for around 40 minutes focused on Nintendo Switch games coming in the second half of 2024. There will be no mention of the Nintendo Switch successor during this presentation."

Less than 6 hours left until it starts!

You'll be able to watch via their Youtube streams, probably their Twitch streams, & if you don't like that, I'm sure there will be no shortage of unofficial streamers/reacters covering the event.
 

"A Nintendo Direct is on the way! Watch the livestream starting at 7:00 AM PT on 6/18 for around 40 minutes focused on Nintendo Switch games coming in the second half of 2024. There will be no mention of the Nintendo Switch successor during this presentation."

Less than 6 hours left until it starts!

You'll be able to watch via their Youtube streams, probably their Twitch streams, & if you don't like that, I'm sure there will be no shortage of unofficial streamers/reacters covering the event.
Less than 1 hour left!
 
Haha! Look at what was just posted on The Game Theorists YouTube channel. 😆

LeBron after challenging Mewtwo and getting hit with a shadow ball (He forgot to tell it they were playing basketball);
Toji Fushiguro Toji GIF - Toji Fushiguro Toji Jjk GIFs

By the way, would anyone be willing to do work on Tsareena's profile, please?

In particular, adding its previous evolutionary stages to its profile, which it currently lacks the details of?
Sure, I'll add them to the list of Pokémon profiles I'll remake soon.
 
Last edited:
Say, actually started using the online features of Scarlet now and tried my luck in Wonder Trade for kicks. I've been receiving a lot of hacked shiny level 100 Pokemon with perfect stats promoting Pokemon forging sites. Literally, their nicknames are "www.piratedpokémon.yarr" or something like that. And then when looking around at online trades, it's surprisingly easy to find people trading shiny legendaries with perfect IVs as well, including event Pokemon. These... are all hacked right? I mean, not pointing fingers or anything, anyone can play the game however they prefer, but I personally rather to avoid using cheats and all.
 
Say, actually started using the online features of Scarlet now and tried my luck in Wonder Trade for kicks. I've been receiving a lot of hacked shiny level 100 Pokemon with perfect stats promoting Pokemon forging sites. Literally, their nicknames are "www.piratedpokémon.yarr" or something like that. And then when looking around at online trades, it's surprisingly easy to find people trading shiny legendaries with perfect IVs as well, including event Pokemon. These... are all hacked right? I mean, not pointing fingers or anything, anyone can play the game however they prefer, but I personally rather to avoid using cheats and all.
They’re all hacked. Release them as soon as you get them so they don’t permeate the economy.
 


NEW POKEMON BATTLE ROYALE ANIMATION VIDEO OUT!!!

Like previous battle royales, this one is a collaboration between TerminalMontage & Lockstin & Gnoggin. Lockstin & Gnoggin did most of the analysis, so a lot of the conclusions are indeed from Lockstin & Gnoggin, & so you can see the given expanation(s) here:

 
Need to get all the legendary pokemon in SV

And I only have violet version so I need to join others to play together to do so

So can anyone I this thread help me out
 


NEW POKEMON BATTLE ROYALE ANIMATION VIDEO OUT!!!

Like previous battle royales, this one is a collaboration between TerminalMontage & Lockstin & Gnoggin. Lockstin & Gnoggin did most of the analysis, so a lot of the conclusions are indeed from Lockstin & Gnoggin, & so you can see the given expanation(s) here:


That explanation video was pretty lackluster I have to say, they basically give all Future Paradox this odd weakness against sound based on nothing at all and Scream Tail have this weird almost nuclear level of sonic scream, also definitely outdated because he said that Raging Bolt wasn't noteworthy in competitive, which is an obvious lie as it's really good in VGC
 
By the way, would anyone be willing to do work on Tsareena's profile, please?

In particular, adding its previous evolutionary stages to its profile, which it currently lacks the details of?
Seems interesting. Might also do Wailord and Glalie/Froslass as well since they seem to have a similar problem

Also would anyone be interested in checking this out?
 
Y'know I was thinking about our current LS situation and I kinda have an idea. Throwing things should technically constitute for LS, right? After all, you do still need to lift or even just hold said object before throwing it (Which means they're not like, striking at it).

With that in-mind, can we just use Seismic Toss or Circle Throw on some really heavy mon like Cosmoem (Who is almost a ton) as justification for at least Class 1? I do know that Riolu can learn Circle Throw and Machop can learn Seismic Toss naturally so even if we find better feats, we at least have a good LS feat for the babies and first-stagers
 
Pokémon is really a disaster in this site, like why does profiles about WILD Pokémon said that the WILD Pokémon are assumed to have perfect IVs and EVs, those are things that wild Pokémon can't normally have without the action of trainers, also them knowing every egg move or tutoring move is really questionable
 
Y'know I was thinking about our current LS situation and I kinda have an idea. Throwing things should technically constitute for LS, right? After all, you do still need to lift or even just hold said object before throwing it (Which means they're not like, striking at it).

With that in-mind, can we just use Seismic Toss or Circle Throw on some really heavy mon like Cosmoem (Who is almost a ton) as justification for at least Class 1? I do know that Riolu can learn Circle Throw and Machop can learn Seismic Toss naturally so even if we find better feats, we at least have a good LS feat for the babies and first-stagers
Interesting.

Though, if we separate Striking Strength from Lifting Strength to say that any Pokemon can throw Cosmoem, then I'm not sure we can readily use Evolutionary Stage comparability to justify that they "Should be able to throw Cosmoem, which weighs 999.9 kg", especially when it's unlikely for any Pokemon to have encountered or battled one, as it's mostly a Pokemon from another world; There isn't much evidence suggesting there are wild Cosmoem, for other Pokemon to battle. I'm not sure how the Max Raid Den Solgaleo/Lunala appear, nor the Snacksworth ones, but Lunala & Solgaleo canonically have the appeal to open wormholes to other "worlds", be that far away or other unierses.

Also hindering comparability scaling for it is that Cosmoem is the 2nd stage of a Legendary/Ultra Beast Evolutionary line.
On the topic, Cosmog has its own feat, although its mostly Environmental Destruction that may be worth looking into:

....Though it may need to be checked again & possibly updated in case time has affected standards.
Pokémon is really a disaster in this site, like why does profiles about WILD Pokémon said that the WILD Pokémon are assumed to have perfect IVs and EVs,
Pokemon are a species.
It does so so that the participants in Versus Threads can be at their best, like we do for other profiles.
If we put Android Saga Goku in a battle, we wouldn't default to throwing him in when he's tired or hungry or already interested or when he's on the verge of a heart attack, unless the Opening Post deviated from the Standard Battle Assumptions by independently specifying as such.

& it is not impossible for a Pokemon to have fully Perfect IVs.
& EVs are Effort Values, obtainable by defeating other Pokemon, something we assume a Pokemon would do anyway; It's likely a player convenience or a product of the catching system that Pokemon have 0 EVs when obtained, given the limit on how many EVs can be distributed to an individual Pokemon, Gens 1 & 2 aside.
those are things that wild Pokémon can't normally have without the action of trainers, also them knowing every egg move or tutoring move is really questionable
OR/AS has a feature where Wild Pokemon are shown to be able to be found knowing Egg Moves.
Tutoring is questionable, though. At best, it was released after being taught Tutor Moves.
 
Last edited:
Back
Top