Overlord General Discussion Mk.II

[ExodusNexus]

Your ignoring the fact the resurrection item was used up directly in your quote. Your scans seem slightly different then what everyone seems to be using though.

 

[Apeironaxim]

The effect strengthened by this skill would kill even an opponent with an ability that made them immune to instant death, once a certain time elapsed.
The way to avoid it was, as Shalltear had done, to use some kind of resurrection effect on oneself within the twelve-second time limit.

No I'm not, this quote is Ainz explaining TGOALID

In the first sentence Ainz is explaining that TGOALID makes it so it can kill someone who is immune to instant death

While the sentence right after talks about how the only way to avoid being killed is using a resurrection effect on yourself

 

[ExodusNexus]

Using a resurrection effect generally resurrects things.

 

[Apeironaxim]

You do realize that in order to resurrect you need to die right?

Which Ainz states can be avoided by using a resurrection effect on yourself before TGOALID counts down

 

[ExodusNexus]

Exactly. She used a effect that would resurrect her.

 

[Apeironaxim]

My point is that using a resurrection effect during TGOALID allows you to resist its effects

The effect strengthened by this skill would kill even an opponent with an ability that made them immune to instant death, once a certain time elapsed.

The way to avoid it was, as Shalltear had done, to use some kind of resurrection effect on oneself within the twelve-second time limit.

The first sentence states that the TGOALID will kill you even if you are immune to instant death, while the second sentence states the only way to avoid being killed is using a resurrection effect

If Shalltear had revived herself like you believe, the second sentence would be false, as the only way to resurrect is to die

When Shalltear dies and is resurrected later in Nazarick, she can't remember what happened

If she died to TGOALID and revived herself, this should also result in the same memory loss

Which considering she continued to fight Ainz, this means she didn't die and resurrect, but instead resisted TGOALID, as, again, Ainz states you can avoid being killed by TGOALID by using a resurrection effect on yourself

 

[DeathNoodles]

This brings an another interesting question:

If a character has an resurrection ability, what happens if Ainz uses TGoALID with True Death? Do they still resist the instant death effect, or they won't due to their resurrection effect being negated?

From what I cna recall, Ainz didn't use True Death against Shalltear in that fight for some reason. He most likely wants to be able to resurrect her back after the fight, so I can assume why he didn't use it against her.

 

[Apeironaxim]

The effect strengthened by this skill would kill even an opponent with an ability that made them immune to instant death, once a certain time elapsed.

The TGOALID just enhances the instant death effect to kill even if they are immune, but using a resurrection effect negates that effect, not the instant death spell itself

So to answer your question, I think they would resist the resistance negation part (which is TGOALID), but if they don't have death manip resistance, they still get hit with the instant death spell, in this case True Death

 

[Mand21]

I also believe TGoALID: True Death is potentially the nastiest instakill combo of the verse. However, True Death does not negate especially powerful ressurrection spells such as True Ressurrection, so unless TGoALID buffs that too, it's possible to revert it.

But yeah, if it does, then basically you're forcing a game without permadeath to have it, which in my humble opinion seems earned as hell by a lv100 badass character.

 

[Apeironaxim]

This would make sense in Shalltear's case, as she is already immune to instant death, so all she had to do was use a resurrection effect on herself to negate the part that bypasses her immunity

 

[Apeironaxim]

I hope my points make sense, but if you want clarification I'll be happy to help

 

[Apeironaxim]

From what I cna recall, Ainz didn't use True Death against Shalltear in that fight for some reason. He most likely wants to be able to resurrect her back after the fight, so I can assume why he didn't use it against her.

True Death only targets one person, he wanted to get rid of her summons, Einherjar, and her at the same time, but unfortunately she could negate the effects of TGOALID on herself by using a resurrection effect, which he didn't know she had, making her the only one who survived

 

[Apeironaxim]

I also believe TGoALID: True Death is potentially the nastiest instakill combo of the verse. However, True Death does not negate especially powerful ressurrection spells such as True Ressurrection, so unless TGoALID buffs that too, it's possible to revert it.
But yeah, if it does, then basically you're forcing a game without permadeath to have it, which in my humble opinion seems earned as hell by a lv100 badass character.

TGOALID only "buffs" the instant death part of the spell, so it can kill even if they're immune

Also I would assume the auto-respawn players have can't be negated, as I think resurrection magic was only used to revive someone mid battle and lessen the penalty of level loss

 

[DeathNoodles]

Considering most of the Overlord characters we actually see are either New World residents or NPCs, I doubt Ainz would encounter such an issue as there are rarely any players (especially high level ones) in the New World from what I can recall, so the auto-respawn isn't quite an issue for Ainz so far.

 

[Apeironaxim]

Do you agree with resurrection effects allowing you to resist the properties of TGOALID?

 

[Apeironaxim]

The auto-repawn was most likely a game thing, and is probably not a thing in the New World

 

[DeathNoodles]

I guess, since that is the limitation of TGoALID. However, the TGoALID description explicitly states that the resurrection effect must be used before the 12 second timer is up. That basically implies that even you can't resist TGoALID with resurrection if the 12 second passes.

 

[Apeironaxim]

Yes, if the resurrection effect isn't used/activated in those 12 seconds, you're dead

 

[Apeironaxim]

Do you need me to clarify anything?

 

[DeathNoodles]

Do you need me to clarify anything?

I got an another question instead:

When Overlord's Hellfire is shown to be able to bypass resistances to Fire Manipulation and destroy souls, does that apply to all Hellfire in general, or only specific hellfire spells?

 

[Apeironaxim]

Considering the names Hellfire Wall and Hellfire Mantle, aka different applications of Hellfire, anything with Hellfire in the name should have the same effects unless stated otherwise

 

[DeathNoodles]

Considering the names Hellfire Wall and Hellfire Mantle, aka different applications of Hellfire, anything with Hellfire in the name should have the same effects unless stated otherwise

Would that mean Ainz's Hellflame spell can bypass fire resistances and incinerate souls as well? I know that spell of Ainz's is hellfire as it has black flames, the same colour of flames that Demiurge's Hellfire Wall has.

 

[Apeironaxim]

That's a tough one, as Ainz doesn't explain anything about Hellflame, but if I had to answer I would say yes

 

[DeathNoodles]

Well, we need other users' thoughts about that before we can truly confirm anything.

 

[Apeironaxim]

Yes, I would also like to have other peoples thoughts on resurrection effects allowing you to resist TGOALID's properties

 

[FDrybob]

In Overlord, resurrection from an item is clearly different than resurrection from using a Guild's NPC manager. The latter appears to completely recreate the NPC based on their most recent "backup". Plus, normal resurrection doesn't cost gold.

 

[Apeironaxim]

Any mention of a "backup" you can provide me?

 

[FDrybob]

That's just speculation on my part, but there's already plenty of evidence that they work differently (appearance, cost, method of use, etc). It would certainly explain her lost memories as well.

 

[Apeironaxim]

Would the lost memories not be related to the use of the world item?

After all, she had no idea why she was there or why she was fighting, and before then she just stood there until someone attacked her

 

[Apeironaxim]

I feel like the world item was the cause more than anything

 

[Apeironaxim]

Also, in any game I can think of, when you're afflicted with some kind of effect and then die, when you respawn the effect is gone

So if Shalltear really did die from TGOALID, why would she still be affected by the mind control?

 

[FDrybob]

There's no way to tell for sure. It could also be that the effect is not stopped by normal resurrection, and, like I theorize, guild bases use a recreation-type of resurrection for their NPC's which would bypass it. There's no clear answer.

 

[Apeironaxim]

But it takes more assumptions to assume it isn't cleared by normal resurrection, and instead she didn't die and resisted TGOALID by using a resurrection effect

Occam's Razor (hope I'm using it right)

 

[Apeironaxim]

This is also supported by how Ainz explains TGOALID

The effect strengthened by this skill would kill even an opponent with an ability that made them immune to instant death, once a certain time elapsed.

The way to avoid it was, as Shalltear had done, to use some kind of resurrection effect on oneself within the twelve-second time limit.

The first sentence states that the TGOALID will kill you even if you are immune to instant death, while the second sentence states the only way to avoid being killed is using a resurrection effect

If Shalltear had revived herself, the second sentence would be false, as the only way to resurrect is to die

 

[Apeironaxim]

Unless I completely missed it, Shalltear doesn't have death manip resistance for some reason

And Yuri too for that matter

 

[Jucaslucas]

The Pleiades can also survive a Reality Slash. I feel like they should get some type of resistance for that.

 

[Apeironaxim]

Pretty sure that's just tanking an attack

 

[AnonymousBlank]

Isn't RS spatial manip? Not sure that is something you tank. If it was AP, it depends on who cast it (pretty sure it was Ainz, in which case, outlier)

 

[Apeironaxim]

Pretty sure it just ignores durability and deals damage

 

[Apeironaxim]

I would also like to know where it is stated the Pleiades can survive it, and also the quote if you could