Overlord Discussion Mk.VI

[Apeironaxim]

More Overlord

Always more

 

[DeathNoodles]

"yuri is the purest form of love"

Heresy! Only love for Sasuga Ainz-sama is the purest form of love.

 

[LSirLancelotDuLacl]

It depends, about the scaling thing earlier. Problem is that by MMO rules, and this is many times just not followed at all in game based anime, even a pretty low character can very much hurt you - is just that they are likely gonna have such a hard time landing anything like debuffs on you and the damage is so incredibly inconsequential that they might as well be outclassed.

As a rule of thumb, small damage isn't enough to scale. Many times is not even enough to back scale. You don't need to be as strong as someone to make them feel pain or, for example, make someone bleed from the nose. The problem is information clashing - this doesn't happen but, as an example, Gagaran being able to defend and be very hurt but not lethally from a serious hit from Entoma. This is where you look for further context like, since this is a game, maybe Entoma isn't as well equiped to resist damage?

Anyway, this is just a case of very little damage and making someone feel pain, which shouldn't be enough.

 

[Apeironaxim]

Thank you very much, this is what I was thinking too

In that case, how do you think the scaling should go?

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

Overlord is coming back, they said it at the Germany event and Maruyama backed it. My guess is that the details haven't been confirmed because it's coming out January or spring 2020. Meh, this is Maruyama's merchant mind working at it's best since in Japan source gets a boost in sales because of it's adaption, Overlord taking #1 spot in 2018 LN sales.

https://comicbook.com/anime/2019/08/05/overlord-season-4-anime-announced-report/

 

[Yobo_Blue]

I mean

It helps that it's not crap like many

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

It helps but it's mostly adaptation and promotion material. Of-course content is what keeps them hooked, but before 2015 Overlord wasn't on the radar until it's 2015 adaptation and like zombies they must have rushed to buy the books because it got a good placement despite the anime airing summer, not giving it a-lot of time to pick up on sales.

2015 #4 (season 1)
2016 #5
2017 #9
2018 #1 (Season 2 & 3)

 

[NeoSuperior]

The actual tweet in question:
"Am Samstag im Overlord-Panel haben unsere Ehrengäste ūbrigens eine vierte Staffel von #Overlord angekūndigt nähere Infos gab es aber noch nicht."

source: https://twitter.com/KSMAnime/status/1158242661431750657

My translation:
"By the way, on saturday at the Overlord-panel our guests of honor announced the fourth season of #Overlord further information was not yet available though."

This seems to be some sort of official account of the hosts for the panel that Maruyama, so-bin and an Overlord anime staff member were staying at for a signing session (the twitter timeline even got a pic with them on it). However there is always the possibility that this "announcement" was meant as a joke or was perhaps some sort of mistranslation, from KSM's side, so I remain slightly skeptical about this until it's officially confirmed or denied from the Japanese side.

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

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[Apeironaxim]

So from the reasoning of Lancelot's post, do we agree that people like Gagaran won't scale to Entoma?

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

Id say so especially when both her and the nija were being pretty thourghly trounced before evil eyes arrival.

 

[NeoSuperior]

@Muchacho mrm

IIRC the sales for the Overlord anime were around 5k-6k Blu-Ray/DVD sales per release and from what I heard, 3k is usually what's neccessary to break even.

The LN also did excellently with volume 13 reaching around 200k sales last year, though from what I heard the Evil Eye spin-off sold much much less, but I can't recall the exact figures since those have become much harder to find now that MAL stopped posting the weekly oricon LN sales since Febuary of this year.

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

im not surpised while the evileye side story had its appeal (To some people) It didn't really serve to expand the story or even the world. It gave us a bit of history and a view into how Suzuki Satoru would act without the tomb influencing him but we don't really know anything more about the world then we do now. As worldbuilding is a huge aspect of overlord the side novel probably didn't have the largest appeal.

Honestly I feel like a side story focused on modern overlord would have done better as it would have served to expand our rather narrow view of the world. Of course I understand thats not why he wrote the sidestory nor do I blame him im just thinking about what may have applead to more people.

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

Not sure about the sales but on Amazon.jp I remember it received bad reviews because people were compaling on the process, which was paying for all 3 BDs and sending proof to then pay for the actual book at a higher price than the main novels. I'll check amazon again in a bit.

Entoma was playing for food until she actually said she was going for the kill. Scaling Gagaran seems like a stretch, I'm against that.

 

[InfiniteSped]

Should the Pleiades scale to Ainz, since he apparently thought that they could survived a Double Maximized Tier 10 spell? Even his tier 2 spells can harm Shalltear, after all.

 

[Apeironaxim]

Should the Pleiades scale to Ainz, since he apparently thought that they could survived a Double Maximized Tier 10 spell? Even his tier 2 spells can harm Shalltear, after all.

Do you agree with Lancelot's reasoning or not?

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

Probably not seeing as they would most likly have very little health left after that though his estimations were off due to them being buffed dopplegangers. Especially seeing as health doesn't seem to equal durability especially as the whole point of reality slash is to ignore dura.

I think infinite sped just hates scaling in overlord...I don't really blame him

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

Tier 2? IIRC he used [Magic Arrows] and boosted them to tier 10. Pleaiades surviving brings us to night lich being one shotted...

 

[Apeironaxim]

I think he's joking, since that's usually what the means

If he's not

then oh boy

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

He used triplicate maximize magic to instakill the lich didn't he?

 

[Apeironaxim]

Tier 2? IIRC he used [Magic Arrows] and boosted them to tier 10. Pleaiades surviving brings us to night lich being one shotted...

ok for one, Magic Arrow is Tier 1

so i don't know what this proves

especially when it's said Tier 2 spells from Ainz can harm Shalltear

granted "harm" probably means very little damage, since you know, it's only Tier 2

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

1st-tier spells could not breach Shalltear's magic defenses, but Ainz had cast that spell anyway.

The 90 magical bolts scored hit after hit on Shalltear, rapidly dropping her health. The reason why they could pierce Shalltear's defense was because Ainz had used a skill to temporarily boost the magic arrows to the equivalent of 10th tier spells.

Nothing, was just pointing out that she was hit by that.

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

Yep, harm brings us to HP values

 

[InfiniteSped]

Lich was triple, not double, so it doesn't count.

I remember people agreeing that Ainz's tier 2 could hurt Shalltear, and that was a feat for him, not a weakness for her defence. I'm just going with that.

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

Except his teir two couldn't harm her he had to boost it to the tenth teir using a skill so....

 

[InfiniteSped]

If we ignore that scaling, we end up with people being able to hurt characters thousands of times more powerful than them, which I think won't end well

 

[Apeironaxim]

Shalltear's magic defense is based on the strength of the caster

If it's a weak caster, not even Tier 10 spells will do anything

But since Ainz is such a strong caster, Tier 2 spells can do something

Obviously he wouldn't use Tier 2 spells without buffing them like he did to Magic Arrow, since Ainz states he didn't even use anything lower than 8th tier to farm in YGGDRASIL

Again, harm =/= comparable in power, especially since this is based on MMOs which can have lvl 20s doing damage to lvl 80s, as outlined in Lancelot's post, so please stop arguing that it does

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

Anyway Im agreement gargran and the rest of evileye's team shouldn't scale to her. She can scale to the pleides and the pleides don't scale to ainz and the gaurdians.

edit from the authors statements the entirety of blue rose lost to her pretty handily and she only lost to the granny and even then them winning was influenced by evileye wanting comrades on some level.

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

Eh, Ainz sent 2 reality slashes. The first with no addition/meta magic while the seconds was a twin that we have no reason not to assume it's Lupus that got hit as he shouts that she's out shortly after, which is the same as being hit by triple.

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

Dont the pleidies also have vastly better equipment to the night lich?

 

[Apeironaxim]

Dont the pleidies also have vastly better equipment to the night lich?

Also these were doppel-Pleiades buffed by a lvl 100

 

[InfiniteSped]

To give an idea, Gazef, Brain, Gagaran, etc, all scale to that fireball calc, which is less than a ton of tnt.

In the other thread you guys talked about the cloud calc being 1 Gigaton. That's a billio times more than the other one.

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

Durability negation though, but equipment can grant stats. Aah, I realise the flaw in logic, I forgot HP values. Meh, I'll just think of Ainz killing the night lich as him not playing around as we see lower tiers and god tiers one shot people of lower level easily.

Take Demiurge's casua hit:

She had not been injured, but if she had not used a spell that turned physical damage into mana loss, she would have already been dead.

 

[InfiniteSped]

Anyway, it'd be better to create a CRT to see what other people think.

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

Weve been trying to figure out the general consensus on how to scale characters before creating a crt

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

@InfiniteSped

It's a correct calc but it's also flawed, it assume the summoned being has no level, again HP values and actually durability. If we take that calc and use it for all tiers, major downgrades shall fall upon us, elemental for example a water elemental (level 84+) is hit by Ainz serious attack and it isn't vaporized/pulverized and we'll downgrade Ainz after we calculate the volume of the water...There is also Cure elim gnawing at the neck of an elemental, Cocytus slashing at the throat of a mud summon and killing it just like that...

 

[InfiniteSped]

Weve been trying to figure out the general consensus on how to scale characters before creating a crt

Well, I doubt that's gonna happen, so it might be better to just lay all the arguments in a CRT and see what other people think of it

 

[The_pen_or_the_sword]

Fair, but we do have a big problem in overlord durability and hp aren't based on real world physics, a water element can be more physically durable and heat resistant than a steel wall even if its only three feet tall. Thus the calc we have for the mud elementals is only correct if we assume the elemental is level zero...

 

[Apeironaxim]

Also you know..the fact it's based on an MMO, the kind of games where you can deal damage to someone 70 levels above you, and yet obviously not be considered comparable in any way

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

Link to the BD

It's actually being sold for 104,000, normally main volumes are around 1,000 while the side story if you get all BD you'll need to pay 1500 but this madman is selling the book at that price.