One Piece: Marco's Flames CRT

[Eminiteable]

A few additions to Marco

Shockwave Generation and Durability Negation:
It's already been confirmed in the SBS and manga that Phoenix flames aren't real flames like the Mera Mera etc, they don't spread like fire and they don't burn people. When Marco uses his flames offensively despite not burning they are shown to damage characters, being described as a shock wave; we can see this to be true as despite Queen taking severe damage his exterior skin was shown unharmed.
(Source)

Shock waves in the One Piece universe are consistently described and shown to be a form durability negation. Thus Marco who's phoenix flames share this property would have these abilities.
(Source: 1 2 3 4)

Shockwave Generation and Durability Negation (His Phoenix Flames used offensively have the properties of a shock wave, which can bypass exterior defenses and internally damage the victim)

Fire Manipulation:
Small update to his fire manipulation justification. Despite being evenly matched initially in a clash Prometheus was eventually repelled due to Marco's phoenix flames; this is described by Marco being due to the Phoenix Flames "special properties" rather than just Marco overpowering Prometheus. Thus his phoenix flames should have the properties to repel regular flames.
(Source)

Fire Manipulation (Can control blue fire that has healing abilities in him and in others, and can also shoot fireballs at people. His phoenix flames have "special properties" allowing them to repel regular flames)

 

[RoronoaxRobin]

This looks fine to me. I agree!

 

[Mr.Cinos15]

I also agree with the changes.

 

[Elizhaa]

Changes seem fine.

 

[SlendVeny]

Marco vs Prime Whitebeard when?

 

[14405User]

Agree seem fine.

 

[KochengPutih]

Looks good
Agree

 

[Eseseso]

Seems fine, so I agree.

Does the Phoenix Brand change affect Zoan Queen's durability in any way?

 

[Eminiteable]

No

 

[Eseseso]

No

Ok then I fully agree.

Is phoenix brand like a durability-negating shockwave attack?

If so we can just scale Zoan Queen's durability to be far above his base.

 

[Eminiteable]

Is phoenix brand like a durability-negating shockwave attack?

If so we can just scale Zoan Queen's durability to be far above his base.

Yes his fire balls negate durability via shockwaves, also no reason for it just to be phoenix brand.

The justification doesn't need to be changed, it's the same value regardless.

 

[Eseseso]

The justification doesn't need to be changed, it's the same value regardless.

I mean if you wanna be accurate...

And does this mean King tanking Bluebird isn't a durability feat?

 

[Eminiteable]

Not sure why you think King and Queen's durability justifications need to be changed because of this.

 

[Eseseso]

Not sure why you think King and Queen's durability justifications need to be changed because of this.

Because if all of Marco's flame attacks are shockwaves that negate durability we can't use them for scaling. That's why Killer isn't ranked at Yonko level with his own shockwave attacks.

King would still have yonko-lvl durability in base due to scaling above his no-flame base which took an attack from Haoshoku Infusion Zoro, albeit with some bleeding and a bad cut, and kept going.

 

[Eminiteable]

Because if all of Marco's flame attacks are shockwaves that negate durability we can't use them for scaling. That's why Killer isn't ranked at Yonko level with his own shockwave attacks.

Listing a character's Durability Negation feats on an AP justification isn't the same as listing a characters durability feats against durability negation.

Killer using dura neg to harm someone is not the same as King/Queen's taking durability negating attacks.

 

[Eseseso]

Listing a character's Durability Negation feats on an AP justification isn't the same as listing a characters durability feats against durability negation.

Killer using dura neg to harm someone is not the same as King/Queen's taking durability negating attacks.

I mean their organs have durability that scale to the dura negation, I suppose.

 

[Ryuga21]

Shouldn't he have some sort of soul manipulation for making Big Mom's homies useless and instantly knocked out with his flames?

 

[Ryuga21]

Btw, I agree with everything proposed.

 

[Eminiteable]

Shouldn't he have some sort of soul manipulation for making Big Mom's homies useless and instantly knocked out with his flames?

It's covered by Non-Physical Interaction I think.

 

[SlendVeny]

Marco vs Prime Whitebeard when?

Unironically though, Marco's starting to look like one of the stronger characters in the verse going off hax alone.

 

[XDragnoir]

King would still have yonko-lvl durability in base due to scaling above his no-flame base which took an attack from Haoshoku Infusion Zoro, albeit with some bleeding and a bad cut, and kept going.

Which attack are you talking about here?

 

[Eseseso]

Which attack are you talking about here?

He gets hit with his flames off by Zoro's Haoshoku Infusion, and while he does bleed from this attack he isn't too worse for wear. Naturally, his flames-on Base would scale easily above this so it stays at yonko tier durability.

 

[XDragnoir]

Thanks, been ages since i read it.

Anyway, i agree with the OP

 

[Ryuga21]

It's covered by Non-Physical Interaction I think.

Hmm, why? I mean, Soul Manip fits best, albeit limited; in fact, it can be both as Marco didn't make contact with Zeus and knocked him as well iirc.

 

[Eminiteable]

Hmm, why? I mean, Soul Manip fits best, albeit limited; in fact, it can be both as Marco didn't make contact with Zeus and knocked him as well iirc.

Zeus was knocked out prior by brook.

 

[Ryuga21]

Zeus was knocked out prior by brook.

Zeus was awake during the clash with Prometheus, and we see him generating electricity, but after Linlin drop Marco's neck we only see him fully knocked out with x-shaped eyes, even though he was not directly hit by Marco's flames. Big Mom's speech give more reassurance to suppose Zeus was affected by Marco's special properties (Soul manip), since she said that she had no spiritual weapons to fight him at that moment.

 

[Eminiteable]

Zeus was awake during the clash with Prometheus, and we see him generating electricity, but after Linlin drop Marco's neck we only see him fully knocked out with x-shaped eyes, even though he was not directly hit by Marco's flames. Big Mom's speech give more reassurance to suppose Zeus was affected by Marco's special properties (Soul manip), since she said that she had no spiritual weapons to fight him at that moment.

Fair enough then.

 

[Ryuga21]

Furthermore, in Japanese mythological culture, blue flames have a strong connection with souls, or the spirit world in general. Even within One Piece we've seen souls engulfed in blue flames.

 

[Duedate8898]

Question, as far as we I know, only one thing generates shockwaves in One Piece and that's the Gura Gura No Mi. What other instances in the series do we have to support all shockwaves negating durability?

 

[KobsterHope07]

Question, as far as we I know, only one thing generates shockwaves in One Piece and that's the Gura Gura No Mi. What other instances in the series do we have to support all shockwaves negating durability?

There are also:

• Impact Dial and Reject Dial (the dials from skypeia)
• Rokuogan (the rokushiki’s ultimate technique)

 

[Eminiteable]

Question, as far as we I know, only one thing generates shockwaves in One Piece and that's the Gura Gura No Mi. What other instances in the series do we have to support all shockwaves negating durability?

See the sources listed in the OP, including the ones I listed there's also kroom.

 

[Duedate8898]

In that case, I'm cool with it

 

[The_man_with_the_Midas_touch]

Minor thing. Would it not be more accurate to describe it as “Limited“ Durability Negation?

We list both the Impact Dial and Rokuogan as minor durability negation (On Usopp’s and Lucci’s page) so if Marco’s flames follow a similar logic, it should probably be listed in the same manner.

 

[Eminiteable]

Minor thing. Would it not be more accurate to describe it as “Limited“ Durability Negation?

We list both the Impact Dial and Rokuogan as minor durability negation (On Usopp’s and Lucci’s page) so if Marco’s flames follow a similar logic, it should probably be listed in the same manner.

Idk who decided on that but it was probably many years ago.

Attacking internal organs is listed on the durability negation page's standards list, there's no reason for minor/limited to be applied.

 

[The_man_with_the_Midas_touch]

Idk who decided on that but it was probably many years ago.

Attacking internal organs is listed on the durability negation page's standards list, there's no reason for minor/limited to be applied.

Oooh, alright. nvm then.

 

[Darkvie123]

Seems fine. I agree

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

Yee agree

 

[Fireld]

Fair enough then.

If you agree with @Ryuga21, shouldn't you update the OP then?

 

[Eminiteable]

Since multiple staff and members have agreed I'll apply the changes now.

 

[Mr.Cinos15]

Has this been finished?