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One Piece - Discussing stats (Chapter 955 and onward)

In the jaiminisbox translation it was stated that Zoro was able to get it back because he's used to handle swords of that type because of Wado Ichimonji.
 
@The Calaca

Thank you for helping out.
 
https://i0.wp.com/jaiminisbox.com/r...ma_5d79d0e70d553/07.png?quality=100&strip=all

In this page, it says that Zoro would have died (essentially) if he hadn't been a strong swordsman.

https://i0.wp.com/jaiminisbox.com/r...5d79d0e70d553/14-15.png?quality=100&strip=all

In the bottom left panel, Hitetsu only says that weak people can't handle Sandai Kitetsu, Wado Ichimonji, or Enma.

Not even in the official translations does it say that Zoro was able to get his haki/body back because of the swords; only that he is more familiar because he's used to those "types" of swords.
 
Sorry but at what point did anyone say the smith explicitly said how it worked? I only remarked it was a possibility that if Zoro absorped haki back it was from a sword.

As far as those translations go, they talk about how Zoror is not weak and thus doesn't die from powerful swords.

So regarding absorption, does the translations actually say that is what Zoro did? I'm asking cause looking at the panel it's not exactly visually clear and even less so verbally confirmed.

I don't care whether or not Zoro gets haki absorbtion. I care that a strong case is made that he can actually for sure do it and why he can do it. "Zoro is Zoro" is not a valid reason.
 
>Asking for a statement

>The feat happened on-screen

What?

He can get his strength and Haki back at him because he knows how to handle troublesome swords. Plain and simple. Logical? Not too much, but it happened.
 
How is it not visually clear? We get both visual and verbal confirmation that Enma took Zoro's haki and nearly used it all up.

I'm making the case that Zoro is the reason why he was able to bring his body back via haki.

Calaca is making the case that the sword is the reason why Zoro brought it back, since he's more familiar with it.

But if that were the case, there wouldnt be such an emphasis on Zoro taking control.
 
For the record, I'm making the case that Zoro is able to do that by himself but his will is strong enough to prevent getting drained from the sword. The argument that the Wado Ichimonji is what gave Zoro that capability isn't something I defend myself. To me, it's just one of the reasons why Zoro was able to do that, because he's used to handle strong and troublesome swords.

Hitetsu himself confirmed that Enma works like a cursed blade, and he has overcome that curse during two whole years with no repercussion.
 
We get confirmation Enma unleashes a lot of Haki at once. That's not up for debate. What is up for debate is:

Whether or not Zoro actually got his Haki back

How he got his Haki back

@Calaca seems to argue for Zoro independant of swords has the ability to absorb Haki because "Zoror is Zoro".

I'm undecided if Zoro even got his Haki back at this point, and I prefer the more logical explanation that one or more of his swords has that ability.

There are just too many questions right now if we give Zoro haki absorbtion. Can other characters do it? If not, what makes Zoro so special? Why is he only doign this now after twenty+ years? etc.

As I said, we wil def get more feats with those swords very soon so I prefer to wait and see. If you don't think its the swords, that's fine, but I just don't agree with rushing an addition based off of "Zoro is Zoro".
 
We see Zoro getting it back. Questioning further this point is just asking too much just to ignore the evidence.

It doesn't matter what you decide about the feat. The manga is pretty clear with it and your "personal opinion" about the mechanics of it matter little to nothing with what the manga actually shows.

You're just overcomplicating this needlessly.

Not like it matters. The resistance is already on his profile and you have presented no evidence of the contrary.
 
>>You're just overcomplicating this needlessly.

Why is it this is your response every time someone doesn't agree with your view and asks for evidence?

>>Not like it matters. The resistance is already on his profile and you have presented no evidence of the contrary.

I'm aware you already took it upon yourself to add it. I'm allowed to comment when I think something is being rushed and/or offer alternatives.
 
Because the evidence you're asking for it's literally in the chapter.

You're not offering any alternatives tho. You're complaining and digging needlessly on the topic because you're looking for caveats to disprove a straightforward feat explained and justified in a single chapter.
 
I don't see what the issue here. We see Zoro getting his Haki drained by Emma, and he was able to resist it and get it back. There is nothing to dispute that. That is a Resistance to Energy Absorption

Why he can do it now is unimportant. Perhaps he never have the chance do so as he never been put in this kind of situation? Perhaps he did it because he is Zoro? Who knows? Either one doesn't nullify the fact that Zoro had just demonstrated this resistance in the chapter

>>Can other characters do it? If not, what makes Zoro so special?

This is like asking about Luffy's Gear Fourth and Katakuri's Advanced Observation. We have yet to see someone develop their Fruit in such a way that Luffy has with Gear Fourth. What makes him special? Why can't other characters develop such a technique like the Yonkou who each live more than twice than the rubber pirate has? What makes Katakuri special to have develop such an advanced Observation that no other character so far besides Luffy has demonstrated? They just are and that's it.
 
On top of that, asking something like "can other characters do it?" it's a non-sense. It was stated that the only person able to tame Enma was Oden. What makes Zoro special, you say? Well, the fact that he's one of the only two characters who were able to control such a sword.
 
I agree with Calaca. Let's drop this discussion please.
 
I'm just gonna say one more sentence on the matter: If we see Zoro lose his muscles and strength to the point where his arm looks bony, and his arm has Haki unintentionally activated, then see him will both back to his own body, I don't see how it is up for debate.

@Calaca - Newer abilities such as potential energy-related and shockwave manipulation have not been added to the haki page (last I checked, especially since now we're discussing new potential abilities pertaining to haki), and the format should likely be changed to list each ability type, and have the magnitude (inept, adept, proficient, advanced, etc) listed under instead of current, as Fix pointed out that simply listing the page for Haki does not provide sufficient detail for each character's usage of Haki.

For example, we'd have Zoro be competent with transfering his haki to other tools such as his blades (via a more "basic" application of Goken), and being capable of using Statistic's amp via Koka quite proficiently, but he's never shown Precognition (unless the fight w/ the angler fish suggests as much in the manga), but is known to have some level of Extrasensory Perception with Kenbunshoku.

Luffy on the other hand as quite a number of feats. He's advanced in Extrasensory Perception for Haki, and at least proficient w/ Precognition after his fight w/ Katakuri. He's also now an adept user of Goken to the point where he can comfortably use the advanced application without much strain, but we've yet to see him EVER transfer his Haki to other objects (I forgot if he actually did so to his sandals in Gear 4th at some point, but if not, then yeah...)
 
Cameron seems to make sense.
 
You made such revision before and the Haki page was updated according to your suggestions which are the same you're saying now, actually. I even started some character revisions to give the proper proficiency to each user (but since there are like 80 Haki users it's understandable that I couldn't finish the job yet).

The only things to add are the Goken properties, since Forcefield is already listed on the page.
 
@Calaca - Yes, I did want those revisions, but as pointed out more recently, it would be better to list proficiency based on each type of ability under Haki instead of being as broad as I've basically forced it to. The current page merely suggests "inept, adept, etc" for each Buso and Ken, but not something like this (incredibly simple format, but it should get the point across compared to the current page):

Buso Haki

  • Bypassing Elemental Intangibility (basically a universal ability for Buso users) - brief explanation
  • Statistics Amp - brief explanation in regards to invisible barrier, koka, etc.
    • Inept app: explaining limitations and capabilities
    • Adept app: explain
    • Proficient app: explain (ex: someone like Zoro or Doflamingo, who can coat entire sections of their body, and even weapons for at least brief periods of time)
    • Advanced app: explain (ex: someone like Vergo who can coat his entire body, and even affect weapons)
  • Forcefield Creation - brief explanation
    • Inept app:
    • Adept app:
    • Proficient app:
    • Advanced app:
(stopping there cuz too much overall for a small example)

Using the same format as the page, that's basically what it would look like. We currently have them jumbled together when a proficient user of x haki may have access to such abilities, but never have shown one of the abilities that falls under that category. If the profiles were already changed, that's fine, and the Haki page itself is likely the only thing that would be affected due to it simply organizing each ability accordingly.
 
So the same format but with a different organization, I get it.

Well, I'm neutral about that. I like both versions since the current can be improved in order to be more especific and well detailed as well.
 
I believe I'll start working on the format for the Meito page in my blog and then post it here when it is complete to get input on changes or other things that should be included.

I'll also attempt at making one for the Haki page displaying the changes I believe should be made.
 
It seems fine.
 
What do you mean?
 
@Ant - Chapter 956. Spoilers.

Shichibukai System was Abolished, therefore there seems to no longer be need of the section on the page, and all the pirates were moved to their respective sections
 
Okay. That makes sense.
 
Is rear admiral higher than vice-admiral?
 
I will use the Meito draft to make the official page, and then have the page linked on each sword user's profile under the Standard Equipment section. This might lead me to change Zoro's page very slightly unless each key has his swords listed as they were at each arc.
 
Okay. That seems fine.
 
I have removed it.
 
Regarding Doflamingo's Black Knight, while its Durability should remain Unknown, I think its AP should be increased to the same value as Doflamingo (High 7-A likely Low 6-B) for one simple reason. It has hurt Luffy on more than one occasion and fought him off-panel for some time, and it doesn't really have any anti-feats as it has one-shot everyone it has come across (Kelly Funk, Killer Bull/Ucy, etc), and pressured Law, who's sword durability already scales from taking many attacks from Doflamingo.

So basically, the Black Knight hurt Luffy, who no-sold almost every attack from a High 7-A (Fuji), and also took hits from Doflamingo himself.
 
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