NEP 2 Alovenus

[Lormac_CC]

Graham from Mgkf regeneration from nothingness tho , and he have Nep2

I believe that is because he can still exist in that state, in fact that should be his true form(not sure about this)

 

[Fixxed]

Graham himself is the void

Only the core(?), so what about Anos....

I believe that is because he can still exist in that state, in fact that should be his true form(not sure about this)

Same with alovenus, capable to still exist after very concept of Hp got erased/ Exist at state where as same case with non existen state...

 

[GreatIskandar14045]

I very much prefer if staffs could elaborate their disagreement with good debunk post instead of just saying "this isn't enough for our standards".

 

[Delta333]

Only the core(?), so what about Anos....

Anos is not NEP type 2,only his root is,you can ask Null if you want

 

[Megaraptor149]

I very much prefer if staffs could elaborate their disagreement with good debunk post instead of just saying "this isn't enough for our standards".

True, at least staff must give their argument

 

[Lormac_CC]

Same with alovenus, capable to still exist after very concept of Hp got erased/ Exist at state where as same case with non existen state...

From what I can see, both are completely different situation, for Alovenus she can still exist when her HP stat gets erased and can come back when the concept of HP gets erased, these are two different situations

 

[Planck69]

I very much prefer if staffs could elaborate their disagreement with good debunk post instead of just saying "this isn't enough for our standards".

We don't get into the nitty gritty because there's no nitty gritty to get into. We have one statement of "existing before existence" and another that just seems to be a regeneration feat. Neither really qualify for our standards and there's little else to say.

And really, there's no reason to get into some elaborate post if something doesn't meet standards, that's sort of why we have them.

 

[Fixxed]

Oh, your HP has been reduced to zero. You should know this already.”

Even when her HP had been reduced to zero or less, or when her HP statistic itself was erased, Alovenus still wouldn’t die. The battle would continue for as long as she wanted it to continue. She could stand up again as long as she wanted to do so.

Last i Askes this, this is qualified for Nep2 or not if not, why....

 

[GreatIskandar14045]

We don't get into the nitty gritty because there's no nitty gritty to get into. We have one statement of "existing before existence" and another that just seems to be a regeneration feat. Neither really qualify for our standards and there's little else to say.

And really, there's no reason to get into some elaborate post if something doesn't meet standards, that's sort of why we have them.

But there's nitty gritty here, you could at least explain why reversing time until the state that you don't exist at all at the first place isn't qualified as type 2 NEP for instance, clearing misconception and elaborate what the standards are should be the least productive stuffs you can do as staff. Saying "this doesn't meet standards!" without any fuckery elaboration is nowhere helpful at all. Cheers.

Not saying myself is in agreement with the thread, in fact, I don't really care about it at the first place.

 

[Bernkastelll]

You need more proof than a random statement like this for Type 2.

it is a lack of concepts as well, as the concept of HP is reduced to 0, which usually would mean that the character cease to exist


yes, concept of HP, wild last boss has ''Concept of HP''

 

[Delta333]

if anyone have scan that proved Alovenus being capable of existing in non-existence in the first place,pls show me,because simply regenerating from nothingness is not NEP

 

[Fixxed]

if anyone have scan that proved Alovenus being capable of existing in non-existence in the first place,pls show me,because simply regenerating from nothingness is not NEP

No have... But only have this scene

Oh, your HP has been reduced to zero. You should know this already.”

Even when her HP had been reduced to zero or less, or when her HP statistic itself was erased, Alovenus still wouldn’t die. The battle would continue for as long as she wanted it to continue. She could stand up again as long as she wanted to do so.

 

[Rikimarox2]

The first scan indicates regeneration, not NEP2, since it said she will come back rather than stay in non-existence. And that is, at best, Low/Mid-Godly, not even High-Godly.

"The ability to reverse time and make the opponent non-existent."

How is this NEP2, exactly? They simply get reversed to before they were born, but that doesn't mean concepts of themselves are getting erased. There's barely anything worth mentioning here. It mentions nothing about concepts whatsoever, just that "Lul time reverse and they go boom". At best, this could give NEP1, but even then, she regenerates, so It can't qualify for that.

Alovenus would come back even if her HP was erased” is strictly “Alovenus would come back even if the very concept of her HP was erased

That... doesn't really mean shit? Health Points have nothing to do with one's own identity or concept, and this would simply mean that she has some real good immortality, or Invulnerability or smth. But definitely not NEP2.

Unless you show me that people's own concept will genuinely cease to exist if HP was erased, then you could make an argument for that, but I haven't seen anything like that here.

 

[Bernkastelll]

Unless you show me that people's own concept will genuinely cease to exist if HP was erased, then you could make an argument for that, but I haven't seen anything like that here.

 

[Fixxed]

The first scan indicates regeneration, not NEP2, since it said she will come back rather than stay in non-existence. And that is, at best, Low/Mid-Godly, not even High-Godly.



How is this NEP2, exactly? They simply get reversed to before they were born, but that doesn't mean concepts of themselves are getting erased. There's barely anything worth mentioning here. It mentions nothing about concepts whatsoever, just that "Lul time reverse and they go boom". At best, this could give NEP1, but even then, she regenerates, so It can't qualify for that.


That... doesn't really mean shit? Health Points have nothing to do with one's own identity or concept, and this would simply mean that she has some real good immortality, or Invulnerability or smth. But definitely not NEP2.

Unless you show me that people's own concept will genuinely cease to exist if HP was erased, then you could make an argument for that, but I haven't seen anything like that here.

On this Verse, concept of Hp more deeper than other ( i already send explanation on top)

 

[Rikimarox2]

Are there any instances of a character getting their concept erased when their HP gets erased as well?

Because what you sent doesn't really imply their concept got erased. HP stands for Health Points, if that gets erased, then you'll just die, but not that your very own concept ceases to exist. HP just seems to indicate whether something is alive, or dead, nothing to do with concepts of an individual.

 

[Delta333]

No have... But only have this scene

I have read it and does that just simply mean she can return from nothingness instead of existing in that state?Because if she can regenerate then she would not die,not because she can exist as nonexistent

 

[Fixxed]

I have read it and does that just simply mean she can return from nothingness instead of existing in that state?Because if she can regenerate then she would not die,not because she can exist as nonexistent

On that's scene is different case with non existen ( Regeneration)


I checked up and i have some mistake

-Alovenus would come back even if her HP was erased” is strictly “Alovenus would come back even if the very concept of her HP was erased”. (Translator note)

And this

Oh, your HP has been reduced to zero. You should know this already.”

Even when her HP had been reduced to zero or less, or when her HP statistic itself was erased, Alovenus still wouldn’t die. The battle would continue for as long as she wanted it to continue. She could stand up again as long as she wanted to do so

its different scene, and now i Askes translator member to translate the Raw scene

 

[Rikimarox2]

Yeah, it just seems to indicate whether she's dead or alive, nothing to do with her own concept.

Really ain't seeing anything NEP2 worthy here.

 

[Delta333]

On that's scene is different case with non existen ( Regeneration)

I know but she can still regenerate in different scene

 

[Fixxed]

Yeah, it just seems to indicate whether she's dead or alive, nothing to do with her own concept.

Really ain't seeing anything NEP2 worthy here.

She still capable to exist after The very concept of Hp got erased.

I know but she can still regenerate in different scene

“

“Oh, your HP has been reduced to zero. You should know this already.”

Even when her HP had been reduced to zero or less, or when her HP statistic itself was erased, Alovenus still wouldn’t die. The battle would continue for as long as she wanted it to continue. She could stand up again as long as she wanted to do so.

Alovenus Hp become 0
Got statement if her Hp stastic (concept of Hp) got erased, she wouldn't die, this sentence meaning. Alovenus capable still exist although Her concept Hp got erased. Pretty sure if alovenus not requiring regeneration or not, because the point of this battle is battle of will

 

[Rikimarox2]

...I know. What I meant is that, even if the concept of HP was erased, that doesn't mean the concept of herself was erased as well. HP ≠ Ones own identity.

We're just going in circles here. I disagree with this CRT, until someone actually brings up some new evidence or smth.

 

[Delta333]

Alovenus Hp become 0
Got statement if her Hp stastic (concept of Hp) got erased, she wouldn't die, this sentence meaning. Alovenus capable still exist although Her concept Hp got erased. Pretty sure if alovenus not requiring regeneration or not, because the point of this battle is battle of will

Why does battle of will mean she doesn't need to regenerate?

 

[QuasiYuri]

Just wondering, how are undead affected by this HP stat? Otherwise it may fall under a form of immortality rather than any form of NEP.

 

[Antvasima]

@Celestial_Pegasus @Planck69 @QuasiYuri @Antoniofer

Has this thread been rejected then? If so, we should probably close it.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

Just wondering, how are undead affected by this HP stat? Otherwise it may fall under a form of immortality rather than any form of NEP.

We aren't really shown any undead, dead people appear, but their souls are just brought back and inserted into a physical body, resurrection in other words.

HP is just something that shows whether something is dead or alive, if it's 0 you are dead, the closer you get to 0, the closer you are to death. The more HP you have, the more alive you are ie you are harder to kill.

What's said is that even if Alovenus HP is 0 or even less than that, or even if the concept of HP itself is erased, she would still come back. The less than zero stuff is weird to consider if at 0 you are already dead, i guess like a negative you are an undead?

Alovenus is immortal, can't die by any means. If you consider this in context where just being a God gives you concept manipulation, and every single one of Alovenus and Ruphas attacks deal absolute destruction, concept manipulation is not enough to kill Alovenus, but that's like a totally different argument from NEP2, you would have to say that when Ruphas reduced her HP to zero, she actually erased Alovenus conceptually? And then while in that state, Alovenus was still acting? The lines between regeneration and NEP2 get blurred here, and i don't really understand NEP2 anyway.

 

[QuasiYuri]

We aren't really shown any undead, dead people appear, but their souls are just brought back and inserted into a physical body, resurrection in other words.

HP is just something that shows whether something is dead or alive, if it's 0 you are dead, the closer you get to 0, the closer you are to death. The more HP you have, the more alive you are ie you are harder to kill.

What's said is that even if Alovenus HP is 0 or even less than that, or even if the concept of HP itself is erased, she would still come back. The less than zero stuff is weird to consider if at 0 you are already dead, i guess like a negative you are an undead?

I always saw less negative HP as a "heal hurt you, punches hit you".

Although given the context, I think it may be Immortality type 7 or 5.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

If -Hp=undead, 0=dead, and +Hp=alive, Alovenus not dying even if the concept of Hp is erased, might be a better argument for type 5, cause she wouldn't be dead or alive i think.

That statements posted so far have been cut up, this here is the entire section from chapter 188, that talks about Alovenus dying

Ruphas’ sword broke the Goddess’ sword, and even sliced through the Goddess’ body. The slash tore through everything in its path and continued to fly on indefinitely. The slash, which seemed to cut even the Final Point open, became bigger as it flew on to a distant location—and eventually disappeared.

Naturally, the Goddess didn’t die because of this. Death would not come to her by any means except for suicide. Even if her soul was destroyed, erased without any traces left, or rendered non-existent, she would still return, calmly and brazenly.

The current Ruphas might be able to forcibly kill the immortal Alovenus, but it seemed she had no intention of doing so. In any case, Alovenus herself had already painfully accepted her defeat.

“…Eh? Ah? Im—Impossible…I’m currently…”

“Oh, your HP has been reduced to zero. You should know this already.”

Even when her HP had been reduced to zero or less, or when her HP statistic itself was erased, Alovenus still wouldn’t die. The battle would continue for as long as she wanted it to continue. She could stand up again as long as she wanted to do so.

However, she had lost. Indeed, there was no doubt that Alovenus had lost. Furthermore, if Ruphas had wanted to kill her, Alovenus would be dead already.

From the context here, Alovenus was currently dead, but she could regenerate for as long as she wanted to. And this would apply if the concept of HP itself was erased, she would be erased, but wouldn't die, cause she can't die, death can't come to her by any means, and if she wants to, she can return to life.

I do think type 5 immortality for Alovenus would be fine idk about NEP2 though.

 

[QuasiYuri]

"Death would not come to her by any means except for suicide" would support it too.

I'm gonna stay on the type 5 Immortality side then. Unless there's more that could change stuff.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

Idk if it helps but even early on before becoming a God, life and death was something she could manipulate

However, she alone was different. In a world without dreams or fantasy, she alone was a dream and a fantasy. She could use magic and she had supernatural abilities. She could fly in the sky and survive in outer space. She could emit fire from her hands and could stop aging at a whim. Even rejuvenation was easy for her.

She had once experimented with her own body by incinerating it into ashes, but even that did not disrupt her consciousness. She had lost her body, yet her consciousness remained. When she tried to undo it, she was able to return to her original state immediately. Even life and death were phenomena that she could bend to her will.-Chapter 182

Obviously what's shown before about the concept of HP being erased is on a way higher scale, but this sort of stuff where Alovenus is dead, and then comes back, was a thing before she got godhood, it's just way more potent now.

So in short i do think if Alovenus was conceptually erased she wouldn't die, and she could regenerate from that, it's regeneration and type 5 immortality, whether its NEP2 is for the people here to decide.

 

[Fixxed]

Eliizha said this on another Post in another thread

" I don't really see a problem with listing NEP when they are erased"


Also for returning Non existence is not average Of EE, Its Conceptually EE/similiar like that. because all ruphas attack contain Conceptual Attack. Also Alovenus after ascending to a goddes, her human self & history has completely Vanished from history. And returning Alovenus to non existen state is actually Nep2.

When did it all begin? She couldn’t remember anymore.

Although it was just barely, she could recall that she had once used to be a human. However, when she became a deity, her human self had completely vanished from history, as if she had never existed in the first place. Therefore, only she herself knew that she had once been a human, but there was no way to prove it.

It had occurred too long ago for her to remember the twists and turns that had happened after that. However, there was no doubt that, in the end, she had faced the creator deity, destroyed it, and became the next deity

185 alovenus

So my argument is same like before, alovenus got rendered to non existen=Nep2

 

[Fixxed]

Small addition and proof if rendering to non existen is Conceptual attack. I think we agree if that's EE is based from Time manipulation. But the Concept Of time didn't exist on this battle.

(i) During the fight between Alovenus and Ruphas, the “concept” of time was erased and time ceased to exist (Translator note)

 

[Planck69]

All you've proven here is High-Godly regeneration.

 

[Fixxed]

All you've proven here is High-Godly regeneration.

Elizha: " I don't really see a problem with listing NEP when they are erased"

 

[Planck69]

Elizha: " I don't really see a problem with listing NEP when they are erased"

OK, and?

 

[Fixxed]

OK, and?

Then Alovenus Will receive NEP2 after she got erased by Conceptual erasure

 

[Planck69]

Then Alovenus Will receive NEP2 after she got erased by Conceptual erasure

Confirmation from a single staff member isn't gospel. So far the vast majority of the staff that have come here and some knowledgeable members simply treat it as Type 5 Immortality and High-Godly regeneration.

Seeing how insistent you are over this then I suppose we can wait for Elizhaa to come her and elaborate himself.

 

[Delta333]

Pretty sure NEP type 2 for EUG case that Elizha mentioned in that thread is completely different with Alovenus,but yeah we can just wait for him for confirmation

 

[Planck69]

Pretty sure NEP type 2 for EUG case that Elizha mentioned in that thread is completely different with Alovenus,but yeah we can just wait for him for confirmation

Wait, that above was for another character and verse entirely?

 

[Fixxed]

Wait, that above was for another character and verse entirely?

You can check the link i send btw....