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Natsu vs Asta 7-5-0 GRACE

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Arnoldstone18 said:
Just to reiterate one more time before going to work

SBA, 10 meters apart, they have no knowledge of themselves,

Natsu has the AP advantage of 30.91 megatons while Asta is lacking at 8.83 megatons, Natsu has the superior lifting strength as well. However, The reason I still vote for Asta is because of the following:

Asta’s evasion abilities are superior: Asta can predict moves, evade attacks, and counter-attack by sensing Natsu’s ki, Asta also goes into a state where his body moves on his own when he is in a very dangerous situation (instinctive reaction), Yes, Natsu may also have precognition, however, Asta has resistance to precognition and is capable of throwing off Natsu’s senses which puts Natsu at a disadvantage.

Asta swords: They are imbued with Anti-magic and the tip of his swords are shown to be very sharp. His swords could dig into Vetto, who scales to 26.5 gigatons. Asta will be able to deal piercing damage to Natsu. Asta also can take away his magic as well.

Others: little things like a slightly higher combat intelligence and adaptability due to his creativity and the ability to decipher and imitate moves at a glance. Natsu only has the ability to decipher moves at a glance. Natsu also has a dragon roar but it is out of character for him to start with that at a very close range of 10m and as soon as Asta strikes him and takes away his magic, it will be too late to use dragon roar or other fire magic abilities. Is Natsu dumb enough to eat anti-magic? I feel like that's a possibility if he doesn't know about the ability

So far the only argument for Natsu is his superior strength. I hope I was able to convince everyone that superior strength isn’t enough to take down Asta. Asta’s superior evasion skills and counter-attacking with piercing damage with the tip of Asta’s Anti-magic swords. He has slightly better combat intelligence, and adaptability.

These are my reasons Asta wins.
Click to expand...

Asta's win con
 
Natsu has considerable AP advantage, huge LS advantage which he does use against blades opponents such as catching Taurus’ axe, range (and yes I know there is a chance it won’t come into play but it still exists if it’s needed), experience against people who null his magic so he’ll know to switch up his tactics after the first attack, can predict people who blitz him with his sense of smell, comparable skill to Asta etc.
 
AnonymousBlank said:
Natsu has considerable AP advantage, huge LS advantage which he does use against blades opponents such as catching Taurus’ axe, range (and yes I know there is a chance it won’t come into play but it still exists if it’s needed), experience against people who null his magic so he’ll know to switch up his tactics after the first attack, can predict people who blitz him with his sense of smell, comparable skill to Asta etc.
Click to expand...
That's fine but who is more likely to win? Also, SBA has changed so take a look at it real quick.
 
AnonymousBlank said:
Natsu has considerable AP advantage, huge LS advantage which he does use against blades opponents such as catching Taurus’ axe, range (and yes I know there is a chance it won’t come into play but it still exists if it’s needed), experience against people who null his magic so he’ll know to switch up his tactics after the first attack, can predict people who blitz him with his sense of smell, comparable skill to Asta etc.
Click to expand...

Arnoldstone18 said:
Just to reiterate one more time before going to work

SBA, 10 meters apart, they have no knowledge of themselves,

Natsu has the AP advantage of 30.91 megatons while Asta is lacking at 8.83 megatons, Natsu has the superior lifting strength as well. However, The reason I still vote for Asta is because of the following:

Asta’s evasion abilities are superior: Asta can predict moves, evade attacks, and counter-attack by sensing Natsu’s ki, Asta also goes into a state where his body moves on his own when he is in a very dangerous situation (instinctive reaction), Yes, Natsu may also have precognition, however, Asta has resistance to precognition and is capable of throwing off Natsu’s senses which puts Natsu at a disadvantage.

Asta swords: They are imbued with Anti-magic and the tip of his swords are shown to be very sharp. His swords could dig into Vetto, who scales to 26.5 gigatons. Asta will be able to deal piercing damage to Natsu. Asta also can take away his magic as well.

Others: little things like a slightly higher combat intelligence and adaptability due to his creativity and the ability to decipher and imitate moves at a glance. Natsu only has the ability to decipher moves at a glance. Natsu also has a dragon roar but it is out of character for him to start with that at a very close range of 10m and as soon as Asta strikes him and takes away his magic, it will be too late to use dragon roar or other fire magic abilities. Is Natsu dumb enough to eat anti-magic? I feel like that's a possibility if he doesn't know about the ability

So far the only argument for Natsu is his superior strength. I hope I was able to convince everyone that superior strength isn’t enough to take down Asta. However, Asta’s superior evasion skills and counter-attacking with piercing damage with the tip of Asta’s Anti-magic swords are enough to take down Natsu. He has slightly better combat intelligence, and adaptability.

These are my reasons Asta wins.
Click to expand...

I think i mentioned why Asta counters these, what are your thoughts?
 
It looks like Asta can counter Natsu's advantages through his skills and abilities on his profile. Antimagic is very bad for Natsu. He might even eat it. So there's that then again I can't vote so I will leave it at that.
 
speedster352 said:
It looks like Asta can counter Natsu's advantages through his skills and abilities on his profile. Antimagic is very bad for Natsu. He might even eat it. So there's that then again I can't vote so I will leave it at that.
Click to expand...
I heard OP can vote, idk if it was changed recently tho

AnonymousBlank said:
I disagree for reasons already brought up so I’m still voting Natsu
Click to expand...
okay
 
The most notable thing here is that even if Asta can temporarily stop Natsu's magic, Natsu's physicals still scale to his magic's AP, so he'd still have a raw advantage. Combine that with his experience with swordsmanship that's arguably better than Asta's at this point (aka Erza's) and his own skill in hand-to-hand combat, and I don't see how stopping Natsu's magic will put him at too much of a disadvantage.

Also, Natsu has the stamina to withstand being stabbed
 
CloverDragon03 said:
The most notable thing here is that even if Asta can temporarily stop Natsu's magic, Natsu's physicals still scale to his magic's AP, so he'd still have a raw advantage. Combine that with his experience with swordsmanship that's arguably better than Asta's at this point (aka Erza's) and his own skill in hand-to-hand combat, and I don't see how stopping Natsu's magic will put him at too much of a disadvantage.

Also, Natsu has the stamina to withstand being stabbed
Click to expand...
But his magic will be off and Asta will have the ap advatange
 
Natsu has similar abilities such as Adaptation, Instinctive Reaction, and Analytical Prediction (funnily enough, Natsu's Analytical Prediction is pretty similar to Ki with how he does it via using all five of his senses)

Also, they start 10 meters apart, but if they end up further apart later into the fight, Natsu has ranged attacks that Asta will struggle with (Asta struggles with range, which I believe Vetto mentioned before)
 
DF is a physical transformation so even if Asta turns off his magic, Natsu is still half dragon.

Also does Asta or his sword(s) have heat resistance feats in this key and if so, how good? Because Natsu’s base body temp melts steel after 3 ish seconds.

Edit: Plus Natsu’s scaling here is that he clowns on someone who stomps a passive 27.3 megatons and the 30.91 megatons was a casual hand wave that accidentally hit 30.91 megatons.
 
AnonymousBlank said:
DF is a physical transformation so even if Asta turns off his magic, Natsu is still half dragon.

Also does Asta or his sword(s) have heat resistance feats in this key and if so, how good? Because Natsu’s base body temp melts steel after 3 ish seconds.
Click to expand...
He doesn't have Heat Resistance in this key, he gets that later on
 
CloverDragon03 said:
Natsu has similar abilities such as Adaptation, Instinctive Reaction, and Analytical Prediction (funnily enough, Natsu's Analytical Prediction is pretty similar to Ki with how he does it via using all five of his senses)

Also, they start 10 meters apart, but if they end up further apart later into the fight, Natsu has ranged attacks that Asta will struggle with (Asta struggles with range, which I believe Vetto mentioned before)
Click to expand...
  • Damage Reduction: (Assimilated Kiato's swordsmanship, which allowed him to tank a blow from Vetto by deflecting the force of the blow, his head would have been blown out of his body if he had not done so)
  • Enhanced Instinctive Reaction and Sense Manipulation: (Assimilated Kiato's fighting style, which throws the opponent's senses with its movement and makes said movements unpredictable to the eyes of ki sensers)
  • Technique Mimicry: (Is capable of picking up moves and replicating them during a fight as shown in his fight against Kiato)
  • Reactive Power Level: (During his battle against Vetto, Asta was able to intercept and deflect Vetto's Forbidden Magic beam despite being completely overpowered by a more suppressed Vetto moments before. Adapted in a short period of time to Magna's fire balls, where each fire ball becomes invisible halfway through and randomly teleport around the target right before hitting them. Went from not being able to track a single throw even with ki sensing to being able to deflect a barrage of them for several minutes, thus without moving much and while protecting the crystal behind him)
  • Resistance to Information Analysis and Precognition: (Assimilated Kiato's swordsmanship whose movements were able to throw Asta's sharp senses off and rendered Asta unable to read his ki)
  • Resistance to Temperature Manipulation: (Unaffected by the cold temperature generated by Neige's Snow Storm, which was cold enough to create icicles),
Click to expand...
 
I'll go through these one by one:
  • This only applies if he can use his sword to reduce the damage, which can be done yes, but it does nothing if Asta takes a direct hit
  • Does nothing about Natsu's heightened sense of smell
  • This seems limited only to swordsmanship, as confirmed later in his fight with Liebe
  • This heavily depends on Asta's ability to prolong the fight, and Natsu has his own Accelerated Development (which Erza refers to as "the stronger his opponent is, the better he performs")
  • Again, not relevant to Natsu's sense of smell. This is more so relevant to Ki sensing
  • This is only for Cold Temperatures, not the opposite, as shown by his inability to traverse through Yultim Volcano without his Black Asta form
 
speedster352 said:
Did you not read Asta's other abilities? All I keep hearing is Natsu is stronger and he will win
Click to expand...
tbh, nobody cares about sheer number of counters Asta has... their logic "If asta catches these hands its over"


CloverDragon03 said:
Natsu has similar abilities such as Adaptation, Instinctive Reaction, and Analytical Prediction (funnily enough, Natsu's Analytical Prediction is pretty similar to Ki with how he does it via using all five of his senses)
Click to expand...

Asta has resistance to Analytical prediction (y'know, the type that works on ki readers)

Asta also has higher intelligence too


CloverDragon03 said:
Combine that with his experience with swordsmanship that's arguably better than Asta's at this point (aka Erza's)
Click to expand...

Asta assimilating the swordsmanship of 4 very experienced swordsmen at this point in the story... Yami, Kruger, Mars, and Kiato

how is Natsu arguably better, especially around X784?? Bruh...
 
Arnoldstone18 said:
his swords are the same swords he used later on, they get heat resistance lol
Click to expand...
But Asta himself doesn't
Arnoldstone18 said:
tbh, nobody cares about sheer number of counters Asta has... their logic "If asta catches these hands its over"
Click to expand...
Those counters have been addressed, so you're just insulting the people themselves since they're not saying Asta wins
Arnoldstone18 said:
Asta has resistance to Analytical prediction (y'know, the type that works on ki readers)

Asta also has higher intelligence too
Click to expand...
Looking at Asta's intelligence on his profile, his intelligence feats are very similar to Natsu's so I don't know why his intelligence is Genius. It should be Gifted.
Arnoldstone18 said:
Asta assimilating the swordsmanship of 4 very experienced swordsmen at this point in the story... Yami, Kruger, Mars, and Kiato

how is Natsu arguably better, especially around X784?? Bruh...
Click to expand...
None of these grant any notable abilities outside of Kiato's swordsmanship.

Again, you shouldn't be so completely and utterly opposed to the idea of people thinking Natsu wins
 
Speed is unequalized so what are the new arguments?
CloverDragon03 said:
But Asta himself doesn't

Those counters have been addressed, so you're just insulting the people themselves since they're not saying Asta wins

Looking at Asta's intelligence on his profile, his intelligence feats are very similar to Natsu's so I don't know why his intelligence is Genius. It should be Gifted.

None of these grant any notable abilities outside of Kiato's swordsmanship.

Again, you shouldn't be so completely and utterly opposed to the idea of people thinking Natsu wins
Click to expand...
 
AnonymousBlank said:
Wouldn’t matter since Class M still squishes puny Asta and if he stabs Natsu as someone (not sure who) on this thread keeps saying, he isn’t dodging anything.
Click to expand...
Hello there, Its "not sure who" speaking

Asta has dual weilding. He is able to continue fighting with the second one, he is dodging everything haha
 
Arnoldstone18 said:
Hello there, Its "not sure who" speaking

Asta has dual weilding. He is able to continue fighting with the second one, he is dodging everything haha
Click to expand...
Hello “not sure who”, how are you this fine day?

And he would need to let go of one of the swords the moment Natsu grabs it since he ain’t beating Class M … which just gives Natsu a sword to use Asta’s own sword style against him lol.
 
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