Naruto Uzumaki vs Cadis Etrama di Raizel

[Celestial_Pegasus]

And i am seriously seeing sub realistic muzaka being possible considering that with the 1 sec timeframe he would be mach 4320.7 without transforming.Transforming makes werewolves far more powerful.M-21 an artificial werewolf without transforming is maybe building level and supersonic but with transforming he goes up to mountain level and hypersonic+

 

[Aparajita]

And i am seriously seeing sub realistic muzaka being possible considering that with the 1 sec timeframe he would be mach 4320.7 without transforming.Transforming makes werewolves far more powerful.M-21 an artificial werewolf without transforming is maybe building level and supersonic but with transforming he goes up to mountain level and hypersonic+

Make a thread about it is my suggestion. I don't know the verse to comment on it.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

And i am seriously seeing sub realistic muzaka being possible considering that with the 1 sec timeframe he would be mach 4320.7 without transforming.Transforming makes werewolves far more powerful.M-21 an artificial werewolf without transforming is maybe building level and supersonic but with transforming he goes up to mountain level and hypersonic+

Make a thread about it is my suggestion. I don't know the verse to comment on it.

I basically made all the noblesse pages but anyway from your extreme lowballs it seems like raizel does indeed have the speed to compete with naruto and thats not even taking into consideration the fact that muzaka wasnt even transformed when he performed that feat.

 

[GreatestSin]

Just as Blood field erases anything, TSB's do the same.

but naruto only resisted TSBs because of senjutsu/six oaths chakra, this doesnt mean that he is immune to all kinds of atomization-beams (like raizels attacks or the in-story dust release) ^_^

i give it to raizel, his ability to control minds and blodd is to OP

 

[Faisal_Shourov]

TSB erases things to the point where it can't even regenerate, that confirms alone that it'll erase adamantium or vibranium. This is common Naruto knowledge :/

TSB negates ninjutsu, even then Sakura survived it and regenerated. It doesn't even affect people with natural energy as power source. It's not very impressive as hax

 

[GreatestSin]

^to be fair, sakura survived because she had super-healing-mode like tsunde, otherwise she would be dead :I

 

[Faisal_Shourov]

^I know, however Sakura and Tsunade's regen is low-mid and there are people who can regenerate entire limbs (piccolo), or even head (alucard). Anybody who can regenerate is practically safe from TSB. And those who have natural energy are immune to it (Naruto punted Madara's TSB IIRC).

 

[GreatestSin]

^i know, naruto-verse in general has at most low-tier Regenerationn except for kaguya and madara who regrew severed limbs :I either way, i agree TSB is really not shown to be that impressive if it comes to "atomization a enemy" i doubt that anyone in the naruto-verse can actually survive the destruction that bloddfield does to the victims body

 

[Faisal_Shourov]

^Exactly, TSB is not very impressive because of its restrictions. People with low regen can fight without worrying about it. This is true atomization

 

[Non-Bias]

Eh?


but naruto only resisted TSBs because of senjutsu/six oaths chakra, this doesnt mean that he is immune to all kinds of atomization-beams (like raizels attacks or the in-story dust release) ^_^

i give it to raizel, his ability to control minds and blodd is to OP


TSB negates ninjutsu, even then Sakura survived it and regenerated. It doesn't even affect people with natural energy as power source. It's not very impressive as hax


^to be fair, sakura survived because she had super-healing-mode like tsunde, otherwise she would be dead :I


^I know, however Sakura and Tsunade's regen is low-mid and there are people who can regenerate entire limbs (piccolo), or even head (alucard). Anybody who can regenerate is practically safe from TSB. And those who have natural energy are immune to it (Naruto punted Madara's TSB IIRC).


^i know, naruto-verse in general has at most low-tier Regenerationn except for kaguya and madara who regrew severed limbs :I either way, i agree TSB is really not shown to be that impressive if it comes to "atomization a enemy" i doubt that anyone in the naruto-verse can actually survive the destruction that bloddfield does to the victims body


^Exactly, TSB is not very impressive because of its restrictions. People with low regen can fight without worrying about it. This is true atomizatio


^ I can see that you two don't understand how TSBs really work so I'll clear this up for you. First of all, someone with Senjutsu/Six Paths Chakra isn't immune to TSBs. They simply have control over them to the point where it would seem like it. This was made obvious by the fact Obito nearly killed himself with them before he gained control of the Juubi's power (the databook even said that Naruto kicking one away had to do with his immense power level not immunity). Those with Senjutsu aren't safe from its power either as we've seen in the manga and The Last.


Secondly, TSBs work differently in effect depending on the shape of them. Sakura ran into one and lived because her Regenerationn and the fact it was in a staff form. If she ran towards Madara and tried to hit while the shield version was up, she would have killed herself because her whole body would have hit it.


Having said this, there is nothing that Raizel can do in the last two matches that would give him the victory here from what I've seen in the series where I'm at.

 

[Faisal_Shourov]

^If somebody with immense power level can kick away TSB, it means it's not really atomization since atomization ignores stats like durability. Goku can't kick away atom busting attacks because of 'power level'. You can't resist atomization with greater power level, you only do it if you're immune to the hax. TSB is a weak tier atomization (if it's atomization in the first place) since it doesn't atomize if you have nature energy. It can still harm since TSB has forest busting DC according to databook

 

[Non-Bias]

What flaw? I can find you the panel where it's directly stated that TSBs are just like Jinton in effect. That's just hax letting them survive such a thing.

 

[Faisal_Shourov]

What flaw? I can find you the panel where it's directly stated that TSBs are just like Jinton in effect. That's just hax letting them survive such a thing.

It's like jinton theory, if it was like jinton in practical Naruto's legs would be gone since Naruto can't absorb Jinton like Madara. TSB has it's limitations unlike true atomization techniques (like the one I posted above). Naruto can't do anything against that since it has nothing to do with nature energy or ninjutsu

 

[GreatestSin]

What flaw? I can find you the panel where it's directly stated that TSBs are just like Jinton in effect. That's just hax letting them survive such a thing.

their flaw is that someone with senjutsu/six paths chakra is immune to TSBs effect, naruto proved both where he first managed to injure obito with senjutsu-rasengan and later where he kicked TSBs away after enetering six paths sage mode ^_^

 

[Non-Bias]

So TSBs having the same power as Jinton is only a theory now despite its feats and sayings? It's like you're ignoring what the word "hax" means now lol. Either way, there's nothing that Raizel can do in the last two matches that would really harm Naruto. How does he win those rounds?

 

[Non-Bias]

What flaw? I can find you the panel where it's directly stated that TSBs are just like Jinton in effect. That's just hax letting them survive such a thing.

their flaw is that someone with senjutsu/six paths chakra is immune to TSBs effect, naruto proved both where he first managed to injure obito with senjutsu-rasengan and later where he kicked TSBs away after enetering six paths sage mode ^_^

Didn't I show you that they aren't immune to TSBs in my earlier post?

 

[Faisal_Shourov]

So TSBs having the same power as Jinton is only a theory now despite its feats and sayings? It's like you're ignoring what the word "hax" means now lol. Either way, there's nothing that Raizel can do in the last two matches that would really harm Naruto. How does he win those rounds?

Featwise Naruto kicked away TSB, and Naruto can't block jinton. The hax is for nature energy users that they're immune to TSB's atomization. Obito wasn't even control of sage power when he got damaged, you said it yourself (before gained control of Juubi's power). TSB is a limited hax with restriction

 

[GreatestSin]

Didn't I show you that they aren't immune to TSBs in my earlier post?

you said that power level somehow matter, what truly is the case is that naruto gained six paths sage mode, which, until now, was the only thing that allowed shinobis to create and use TSBs...
for you obito argument: it is easy to see that he hadnt fully mastered his abilitys, his power went berserk and he got sideeffects (immunity doesnt need to be passive, and it doesnt have to mean that the user can control the element he is (consciously) immune against(that means that sage mode users can attack TSBs as if they are physical but they neither can create or control them ^_^ )...

either way, raizel can create bloodfield and is as fast (if not faster) than naruto, furthermore raizel has very strong mind control abilitys and if he is atomizing someone than it will be similar or even better than the sideeffect of the last amaterasu-chidori vs rasengan, which easily took narutos and sasukes arms (bloodfield would do the same but with narutos head),

therefore i think raizel wins in all matches ^_^

 

[Non-Bias]

Featwise Naruto kicked away TSB, and Naruto can't block jinton. The hax is for nature energy users that they're immune to TSB's atomization. Obito wasn't even control of sage power when he got damaged, you said it yourself (before gained control of Juubi's power). TSB is a limited hax with restrictio

^ Oh boy. You should really re-read what I put above because it seems like you're doing your best to ignore it man. Senjutsu/Six Paths Chakra users aren't immune to TSBs. Obito is the prime example of this. If he was immune to Senjutsu it wouldn't be a weakness would it? TSBs are made of Senjutsu and as you can see it nearly killed Obito because of that. TSBs are simply in the control of the users to the point where it would seem like immunity because of the way they use them. Don't be fooled by this lol.

As for Naruto blocking Jinton, keep in mind that Non-Senjutsu related attacks have been shown to be very ineffective against those with Six Paths Chakra. This was once again seen best against Obito. Amaterasu can turn someone to ashes in seconds and Rasenshuriken can liquefy enemies via cellular destruction yet a combination of the two didn't even phase Obito. That alone means that Jinton would most likely be ineffective, but even if you don't buy that Naruto has a field of energy around his body that can be credited to blocking Jinton. Because keep in mind that he tanked Toneri's TSBs Sword and he wasn't using his Six Paths Chakra when he did it (and I already proved that no one is immune to TSBs so please don't bring that up lol).

The Chakra Cloaks simply have feats of tanking atomization which is a form of hax. Kind of like Blut Vene has feats of tanking AZ.

 

[Faisal_Shourov]

^Obito was only affected when he wasn't even control of his sage power. Otherwise TSB doesn't atomize any six paths senjutsu user. Nothing to be fooled, it's a fact.

Naruto kicked away TSB without energy cloak, if Jinton hit Naruto's legs they would be gone

 

[GreatestSin]

@nonbias

i think we should stop this discussion since it goes off-topic, all i see is that atomization works on naruto, the reason fro TSB was that he was able to manipulate it (which you said yourself), that doesnt mean he is protected against all kinds of atomization attacks (and even if dust release doesnt work than only because of the thing you said (six paths chakra/being the tentails jin protects from ordinary jutsus)) therefore bloodfield works which will result in naruto getting wiped out or raizel control naruto via mind control, my vote goes for raizel ^_^

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

Mind control won't work due to Kyuubi.


Sixth of Sage Paths users aren't immune to every as it was heavily implied Kaguya's ETSB would kill him on impact.

Naruto low difficulty.

 

[Non-Bias]

@nonbias
i think we should stop this discussion since it goes off-topic, all i see is that atomization works on naruto, the reason fro TSB was that he was able to manipulate it (which you said yourself), that doesnt mean he is protected against all kinds of atomization attacks (and even if dust release doesnt work than only because of the thing you said (six paths chakra/being the tentails jin protects from ordinary jutsus)) therefore bloodfield works which will result in naruto getting wiped out or raizel control naruto via mind control, my vote goes for raizel ^_^

Prove Bloodfield would kill Naruto then. So far you haven't shown any feats that suggests it could rather than your own opinion.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

@nonbias
i think we should stop this discussion since it goes off-topic, all i see is that atomization works on naruto, the reason fro TSB was that he was able to manipulate it (which you said yourself), that doesnt mean he is protected against all kinds of atomization attacks (and even if dust release doesnt work than only because of the thing you said (six paths chakra/being the tentails jin protects from ordinary jutsus)) therefore bloodfield works which will result in naruto getting wiped out or raizel control naruto via mind control, my vote goes for raizel ^_^

Prove Bloodfield would kill Naruto then. So far you haven't shown any feats that suggests it could rather than your own opinion.

Blood field is hax that erases existance but if that isnt enough to convince you raizel wins then there is blood phoenix which if it touches you you break into blood crystals and your soul departs to the afterlife.

 

[Non-Bias]

^ If it touches you meaning that Naruto can dodge, fly away (can Raizel fly? I haven't read all the chapters yet), or shield his body with TSBs. It helps that Naruto's capable of making thousands of clones that can use Bijuu Mode and spam Bijuu Bombs. I don't see any chance of victory for Raizel, especially if Naruto uses the abilities of the other Bijuu (such as reflecting attacks on the same scale and alkaline toxics that covers the surrounding area). Furthermore, Raizel apparently loses a lot of power using these techniques which means that he can't spam them and would gradually become weaker as the fight progresses.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

^ If it touches you meaning that Naruto can dodge, fly away (can Raizel fly? I haven't read all the chapters yet), or shield his body with TSBs. It helps that Naruto's capable of making thousands of clones that can use Bijuu Mode and spam Bijuu Bombs. I don't see any chance of victory for Raizel, especially if Naruto uses the abilities of the other Bijuu (such as reflecting attacks on the same scale and alkaline toxics that covers the surrounding area). Furthermore, Raizel apparently loses a lot of power using these techniques which means that he can't spam them and would gradually become weaker as the fight progresses.

Yes raizel can fly,tsb aint gonna do anything.When raizel uses blood wing 10 blood field instantly forms.We have already established raizel is just as fast as naruto if not faster so he isnt dodging anything and shadow clones arent gonna work because raizel can read minds he would know exactly what naruto is planning.Prolonged uses of his powers weakens him because he literally uses his life to use his powers but it took multiple battles before raizel couldnt use his powers anymore so that isnt a factor here.I am gonna post some scans now there is no way naruto is winning this.

 

[Non-Bias]

Post some scans and we'll see. And the speed of someone don't necessarily transfer to the speed of their attacks.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

Alright here we go




In other words its hax








Rai using blood field to erase people from existence and i am not done yet

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

Many blood field show up insantly when he uses blood wings


Rai using blood phoenix






blood phoenix


Blood phoenix



soul departing


Still not done

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

Rai negates an attack


Rai makes igness blood vessels burts just by saying she doesnt have the right to look at him

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

I dont see how naruto is winning this raizel can make blood vessels burst just by saying he doesnt deserve to look at him if he wanted he could easily make organs rupture and he just has to look at you

 

[Non-Bias]

Could you list all the chapters these feats come from?

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

Alright so chapter 234,278-279,307

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

309 if you wanna see more people being erased

 

[Non-Bias]

Thanks. I'll reply once I gather more information.

 

[Zerzavyx98]

My vote remains on Naruto's side.

Naruto has much better versatility than Raizel. Even with Raizel's hax, Naruto still has the upperhand it seems through actual combat rather than flashy hax moves.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

My vote remains on Naruto's side.
Naruto has much better versatility than Raizel. Even with Raizel's hax, Naruto still has the upperhand it seems through actual combat rather than flashy hax moves.

I still say raizel the hax he has is just too much for naruto to handle not only will raizel know exactly what naruto is planning since he can read minds his complete control over blood will allow him by just looking at naruto to cause his organs to rupture.

 

[Blahblah9755]

My vote goes to Raizel for the reasons Celestial Pegasus stated

 

[Aparajita]

My vote goes to Raizel for the reasons Celestial Pegasus stated

Agreed also for the potential 1000 mach speed difference on the High Scale.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

So thats 3 votes for raizel