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I might be remembering game filler, maybe, but I'm pretty sure during the Kakashi v. Obito fight in the Kamui dimension, Obito casts Tsukuyomi on Kakashi to make him see Rin, or something like that.
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Naruto to Boruto General Discussion Thread 52
- Thread starter AstralKing7
- Start date
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Not to mention--wouldn't Tsukuyomi have had to exist before Itachi, if the name of the jutsu is "Infinite Tsukuyomi"? Like, I'm fairly certain that the intent was to portray Tsukuyomi and Amaterasu as standard MS powers, similar to Susano'o.
Whether it makes sense or not, Tobirama definitely stated he'd seen Kagutsuchi/Amaterasu before, even though the Fourth Databook (released prior to the chapter Tobirama said that in) states that Kagutsuchi was invented by Sasuke in the midst of the fight with A, but when the source material contradicts that with Edo Tobirama, I think Tobirama takes precedence as a reliable source.
Whether it makes sense or not, Tobirama definitely stated he'd seen Kagutsuchi/Amaterasu before, even though the Fourth Databook (released prior to the chapter Tobirama said that in) states that Kagutsuchi was invented by Sasuke in the midst of the fight with A, but when the source material contradicts that with Edo Tobirama, I think Tobirama takes precedence as a reliable source.
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Then I remain even less convinced. Visual hallucinations are basic genjutsu level shit. Tsukuyomi is outright submerging the person in a whole mental world controlled at your every whim and with a massive dilation of time perception.
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Sorry for double-posting right before you did--but what then do you have to say considering the origin of "Infinite Tsukuyomi"? A "finite" Tsukuyomi would have to exist for there to be a need for a qualifier, elsewise Madara would have just referred to IT as "Tsukuyomi", since he'd never met Itachi to know there was a Sharingan ability with the name already.LSirLancelotDuLacl said:
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No worry, just try to remember using the Edit button instead.
If things don't make sense, they need to be argued. The Databook directly mentions, before the chapter came out, that Sasuke invented the technique right there with A. On top of that, is makes really no sense that Sasuke invented the name for the technique and coincidentally it ended up being the same as that used by someone else.
Infinite Tsukuyomi was a thing made by Kaguya. Considering the only one that knew of it was sealed and Indra would have had no clue that such a thing existed (unless black Zetsu was being a bitch), it makes little sense. It is another plot hole like Izanami made to deal with Izanagi abusers, which makes no sense with previously given information that it requires Uchiha and Senju power, making Black Zetsu's claims of Madara being the only one to get some Senju DNA to potentially awaken the Rinnegan doubtful and hard to believe if it was that easy, which puts into question the entire plot. Or could simply be chance.
Edit: Forget that edit, I was forgetting badly. Obito does indeed say you need both. And if that was also changed later, still shows the inconsistencies. We can't go off just one off statements and names.
If things don't make sense, they need to be argued. The Databook directly mentions, before the chapter came out, that Sasuke invented the technique right there with A. On top of that, is makes really no sense that Sasuke invented the name for the technique and coincidentally it ended up being the same as that used by someone else.
Infinite Tsukuyomi was a thing made by Kaguya. Considering the only one that knew of it was sealed and Indra would have had no clue that such a thing existed (unless black Zetsu was being a bitch), it makes little sense. It is another plot hole like Izanami made to deal with Izanagi abusers, which makes no sense with previously given information that it requires Uchiha and Senju power, making Black Zetsu's claims of Madara being the only one to get some Senju DNA to potentially awaken the Rinnegan doubtful and hard to believe if it was that easy, which puts into question the entire plot. Or could simply be chance.
Edit: Forget that edit, I was forgetting badly. Obito does indeed say you need both. And if that was also changed later, still shows the inconsistencies. We can't go off just one off statements and names.
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3 things I've always wanted to know about -
1. Momoshike's 3rd eye golden rinnegan and it's abilities
2.Hogoromo's kekkei Mora rinnegan and it's abilities
3. Juubi kaguya's 12 tomoed Rinnesharingan(when she fought sons back then) and it's abilities
Just hope I get the answers
1. Momoshike's 3rd eye golden rinnegan and it's abilities
2.Hogoromo's kekkei Mora rinnegan and it's abilities
3. Juubi kaguya's 12 tomoed Rinnesharingan(when she fought sons back then) and it's abilities
Just hope I get the answers
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To be completely honest, those feels like simple artistic license to make them seem distinct enough. Besides one or 2 things, and maybe not even that much, I really doubt it gives them much of anything.
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Nah I'm sure hogoromo's kekkei Mora rinnegan was something extremely special
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"Infinite Tsukuyomi was a thing made by Kaguya. Considering the only one that knew of it was sealed and Indra would have had no clue that such a thing existed (unless black Zetsu was being a bitch), it makes little sense."
...except Black Zetsu was a bitch, and altered the Sage's stone that the Uchiha kept to detail the plan for the Infinite Tsukuyomi, which Madara mentions multiple times by name...
Also, about Izanagi--Naruto chapter 479, pages 2-4 states that Senju chakra is only needed to make Izanagi last longer than a few seconds at a time during the Sasuke v. Danzo fight.
Also, if Amaterasu ITSELF was a unique power, then why is it never stated nor treated to be such by the series itself? While yes, Sasuke and Itachi are the only two in the series shown to use it, the context of the series itself seems to heavily imply that it's a standard MS ability, as well, given how Sasuke can use it well before acquiring his brother's eyes. Add in Tobirama's statement, which should supercede the databooks as a canon source, and it makes sense.
...except Black Zetsu was a bitch, and altered the Sage's stone that the Uchiha kept to detail the plan for the Infinite Tsukuyomi, which Madara mentions multiple times by name...
Also, about Izanagi--Naruto chapter 479, pages 2-4 states that Senju chakra is only needed to make Izanagi last longer than a few seconds at a time during the Sasuke v. Danzo fight.
Also, if Amaterasu ITSELF was a unique power, then why is it never stated nor treated to be such by the series itself? While yes, Sasuke and Itachi are the only two in the series shown to use it, the context of the series itself seems to heavily imply that it's a standard MS ability, as well, given how Sasuke can use it well before acquiring his brother's eyes. Add in Tobirama's statement, which should supercede the databooks as a canon source, and it makes sense.
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Yes, but we are told what the Stone says last I heard, and it was to manipulate them into acquiring sweet Senju genes (apparently arranged marriages were hard or something). Nothing that, to my knowledge, was related to specific techniques.
I checked two different translations, and the only thing I can see is Obito mentioning Danzo becoming a law rat for the sake of lengthening the duration of his Uchiha eyes, as said duration can vary. He mentions directly in the battle with Conan that you need Senju and Uchiha chakra.
Considering the fact that 1, they are brothers and having similar abilities is not impossible. 2, it still makes little sense that Sasuke coincidently named his ability the same as a past use without knowing about it, and 3, no other single technique is at all shared. 5 Mangekyou users and only 2, who are brothers, have the thing. And even between them, Sasuke can control it and Itachi can't.
I checked two different translations, and the only thing I can see is Obito mentioning Danzo becoming a law rat for the sake of lengthening the duration of his Uchiha eyes, as said duration can vary. He mentions directly in the battle with Conan that you need Senju and Uchiha chakra.
Considering the fact that 1, they are brothers and having similar abilities is not impossible. 2, it still makes little sense that Sasuke coincidently named his ability the same as a past use without knowing about it, and 3, no other single technique is at all shared. 5 Mangekyou users and only 2, who are brothers, have the thing. And even between them, Sasuke can control it and Itachi can't.
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Susano? Obito, Madara, Itachi, and Sasuke's eyes are all capable of doing the Susano.
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The databooks themselves are inconsistent, then, no? According to the Naruto wiki: "The third databook states that the user must first unlock Tsukuyomi and Amaterasu before they can gain Susanoo." As opposed to the Fourth Databook, which states that it only requires two Mangekyou Sharingan.
Add in Tobirama's statement which also contradicts the Fourth Databook, the Fourth's information becomes dubious at best, and the Third Databook becomes more credible.
Add in Tobirama's statement which also contradicts the Fourth Databook, the Fourth's information becomes dubious at best, and the Third Databook becomes more credible.
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Post those scans that call Madara and Obito's Mental scapes "Tsukuyomi" because I don't remember seeing that at all.
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- Thread starter
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I think you guys forgot... Amatarsu is in one eye and the Tsukuyomi is in the other. So it's still true when it's stated that you need two MS.
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The new Boruto episode dropped today and I'm hearing good things about the OP!!
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This wiki needs to add a possibly much stronger in prime for kaguyas profile, considering her 5 dimension time space busting feat was weakened kaguya without prime 10 tails(all beasts in one) and most of her chakra was absorbed by Hagaromo then dispersed to everyone on the planet. Then war arc weakened kaguya combined her rabbit goddess technique and chakra of the Shinobi alliance(which we know is nothing compared to the god tiers chakra), and she was weakened due to the battle with naruto and sasuke and used a lot of chakra to switch dimensions and stuff but was still capable of that ETSB 5 dimension busting feat. This is enough evidence for a possibly much stronger in her prime note added, but as we know this wiki dislikes naruto, there probably dbztards considering they put saibamen at planet level because of a quote about them being strong as Raditz even though Raditz showed no feats of planet level and got wrecked by piccolos moon busting beam lmao.Then Krillin one shotted several with ease so I guess he's large planetary to multi planetary lmao.
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Piccolos moon bust was calced at planet level lol
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Lmao but Toneri threatening to throw the moon at earth and destroy it, then tenseigan stated having enough power to revive a destroyed planet yet he's still moon level, but a simple statement from Nappa of all people puts saibamen at planetary lmao which I'm not buying no Calc to put him at planetary lmao.
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First of all I agree with planet level Naruto lol.
Second of all: Saibamen are superior to the Piccolo that performed the feat, so it's not just Nappa's statement lol. Also pre-training piccolo performed the feat casually with a random ki blast, not even the Makankosapo.
Lastly I personally think Dragon ball is downplayed as well, especially in the speed department.
Second of all: Saibamen are superior to the Piccolo that performed the feat, so it's not just Nappa's statement lol. Also pre-training piccolo performed the feat casually with a random ki blast, not even the Makankosapo.
Lastly I personally think Dragon ball is downplayed as well, especially in the speed department.
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Going by that saibamen statement then Krillin should've beaten/did as good as pre super saiyan goku against Frieza since he got vastly stronger in the nameC arc lol, and dbs practically ruined there speed feats via dyspo so eh. I'll use vs wikis popular excuse saibamen are outliers since going by scaling goku should've been solar system level against cell lol.
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Dude what? Krillin was far below base Goku, even without Kaioken. Especially if you look at the official power levels. Base Goku was 3 million while Krillin was 75k lol.
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But you said saibamen are planetary, Krillin one shotted several. Then got stronger on namek then got potential unlocked, scaling wise he should've been able to put up a better fight than he did considering vs wiki puts full power namek Frieza at small star level so plenty of things are not adding up if saibamen are planetary lol, that would mean saibamen grouped up would give the Ginny force a challenge since Ginyu in namek is only planetary lmao.
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Anyways idc, back to the kaguya thing it's obvious that there should be a much stronger in her prime note added to her profile, unless there saying extremely weakened kaguya is equal to prime lol.
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Krillin never put up any sort of meaningful fight against Freeza tho. He's far weaker than even first form Freeza. Plus the difference between Planet level and Small Star level is huge. I think hundreds of times or more.SinisterShadow703 said:
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All I'm saying is saibamen is planetary and so is Ginyu on this wiki.... that already says a lot. Anyways what you think about the kaguya thing.
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My personal opinion is the Naruto God tiers are at least planet level. Kaguya in particular is obviously much stronger in her prime before losing all that chakra that Hagoromo took away and spread all over the world and created the tailed beasts with. So yeah prime Kaguya should be a lot stronger than her war arc self.SinisterShadow703 said:
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Ye my personal opinion is that prime kaguya is at bare minimum solar system level, but we will see when ishikki goes full power and as the boruto story progresses. Love y'all btw.
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Also considering Toneri was one-shotted by base Naruto LOL... with Toneri already being arguably planet lvl..... the most powerful God tiers being 5-B is far from a stretch imo.SinisterShadow703 said:
Anyway cheers mate!
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Yep and that was pre hokage naruto.
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Eh you can still scale people, since weakened kaguya tier 4 feat can be used to scale people stronger than her weakened state but not prime.
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I wish, but the Boruto writers are actively Nerfing Naruto and Sasuke and restricting or outright ignoring a lot of their abilities for the sake of giving the new generation more screen time and to make them seem stronger. Very disappointing and depressing tbh.UchihaSlayer96 said:
The fact that they pretty much spoiled that At least Sasuke is going to die is also annoying. Possibly Naruto too... just bad decisions overall.
tf u mean sasuke and naruto are gonna die, when did they say that
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Ye boruto is clearly heading into the direction of less focus on destructive capability, and more on hax and speed which is what a ninja anime should be focused on anyways. Naruto has no hax except maybe shadow clones and since naruto don't have hax his only use of his clones are for distraction or overpowering the enemy with brute force and combined jutsus which we know is nulled by absorption, sasuke has izanagi and izanami but I doubt he will sacrifice an eye, and switching places is more of a combat hax. So ye there kinda out of options lol this is why new gen which is going to be hax focused (well the main cast atleast) are the only hope.
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- Thread starter
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It's not a ninja anime
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madara when discussing the moon eye plan (infinite tsukyomi) says when using THIS jutsu (tsukyomi) i can create an ideal world and its possible by using the moon instead of our eyes, at that moment he had obito in the normal version of tsukyomi, and i know its a movie but obito also used it in road to ninja
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You might not know what hax is buddy lol,love you tho.
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Amaterasu, Genjutsu, and Sealing for Sasuke.
Durability Negation, Sealing, Paralysis, and Power Null for Naruto
Both have hax, I think those last two might be discounted for Naruto right now but they both defintely have hax that you didn't point out
Durability Negation, Sealing, Paralysis, and Power Null for Naruto
Both have hax, I think those last two might be discounted for Naruto right now but they both defintely have hax that you didn't point out
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