Naruto to Boruto Discussion Thread

[MinatoSparkle]

Personally I have SM Minato above Rinnegan Obito, MKCM2 Naruto, and Base Hashirama, but below BSM tier characters like EMS Madara, Peak EMS Sasuke, and Kurama

 

[SlendVeny]

Personally I have SM Minato above Rinnegan Obito, MKCM2 Naruto, and Base Hashirama, but below BSM tier characters like EMS Madara, Peak EMS Sasuke, and Kurama

I have Base Minato at roughly Tobirama's level, and I have Tobirama at roughly Base Hashirama's level, so I have SM Minato at roughly SM Hashirama's level.

Hashirama's big wood is stronger tho

 

[MinatoSparkle]

O have Base Minato at roughly Tobirama's level, and I have Tobirama at roughly Base Hashirama's level, so I have SM Minato at roughly SM Hashirama's level.

Hashirama's big wood is stronger tho

I probably have SM Minato at the bottom of the same tier where SM Hashirama's at the top, but def not the same level. If you exclude higher Wood Style jutsu like the Wood Dragon, Wood Golem, and Shinsuu Senju, then maybe.

 

[SlendVeny]

I probably have SM Minato at the bottom of the same tier where SM Hashirama's at the top, but def not the same level. If you exclude higher Wood Style jutsu like the Wood Dragon, Wood Golem, and Shinsuu Senju, then maybe.

I'd say his Sage Rasengan would probably be on par with some of Hashirama's stuff, but probably not the Wood Golem or ShinsuSenju

 

[MinatoSparkle]

5-C+ SM Minato since his Rasengan would've damaged Juubidara

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Physically, SM Minato does really well in that tier.
It's only when you factor in the Megazords and the mountain range sized Jutsu that things get outta hand lmfao.

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Physically, SM Minato does really well in that tier.
It's only when you factor in the Megazords and the mountain range sized Jutsu that things get outta hand lmfao.

I just imagined that thing you did for your shorts with Code and Orochimaru being fraudulent and imagined SM Minato pushing aside Hashirama physically then hiding from the Perfect Susanoo and Shinsuu Senju

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

I just imagined that thing you did for your shorts with Code and Orochimaru being fraudulent and imagined SM Minato pushing aside Hashirama physically then hiding from the Perfect Susanoo and Shinsuu Senju

Don't give me ideas

 

[HelloThere1089]

The inevitable database entry for Prescience might go crazy

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

I just imagined that thing you did for your shorts with Code and Orochimaru being fraudulent and imagined SM Minato pushing aside Hashirama physically then hiding from the Perfect Susanoo and Shinsuu Senju

I just got divine inspiration for a short, and I think you'll love it lmao

 

[HelloThere1089]

Dope idea for a video: What if Naruto was in WW2

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Dope idea for a video: What if Naruto was in WW2

Singlehandedly defeats the Axis Powers, then shows Adolf-Chan visions of what things could've been like if he'd gone to art school as he's delivering the final punch to end the war.

 

[SlendVeny]

Dope idea for a video: What if Naruto was in WW2

"I don't know, you are a... BLONDE HAIR? BLUE EYES? SUPERHUMAN STRENGTH? WHERE HAFF YOU BEEN?"

 

[MinatoSparkle]

I just got divine inspiration for a short, and I think you'll love it lmao

 

[HelloThere1089]

Singlehandedly defeats the Axis Powers, then shows Adolf-Chan visions of what things could've been like if he'd gone to art school as he's delivering the final punch to end the war.

Naruto the type to Blitzkrieg Adolf's ass and then proceed to psychologically break him too before Adolf kills himself anyways.

 

[NeoKingOfLight]

Why?

Iirc, wasn’t it stated he was only Kage because of his hard Counter to Shukaku? As I recall he also has no significant statements. He was weaker than 3rd Kazekage lore I think and Gaara has better feats, even against Deidara (I ngl, I didn’t expect you to say Naruto beats this Gaara Easily).

If Minato was stronger, he could've just attacked himself after Naruto added senjutsu to his Rasengan, so Naruto wouldn't slow him down.

(1) It’s just slamming a Rasengan down. (2) I never said Naruto wasn’t able to keep up. (3) Chakra Strength is the topic of discussion, not “overall” ability, so there is no argument that was made that Naruto wouldn’t be able to keep up or that he would slow down Minato, even if Minato has stronger Chakra.

They're also knocked back comparably by the Rasengan exploding.

Same as above.

Calling Minato support for someone he's stronger than would also be odd.

I think you’re misunderstand the argument. The way I see it (Again, if the One Shot Scaling that i’m a proponent for is acceptable): SM Minato (Chakra Strength) > BSM Naruto (Chakra Strength) >= BM Minato (Additive (Chakra Strength)) > Base Minato (Chakra Strength) >= 100% V2 9 Tails (Chakra Strength) > BM Naruto (Chakra Strength).

So Minato being support is valid and doesn’t change anything.

BM definitely isn't treated as an additive power. If it was, it would be legit useless for SPSM Naruto.

It is. This is the reason why so many people had a hard time accepting that Base Naruto was so strong after gaining Six Paths Chakra. The strength of Kurama’s Chakra is insignificant compared to Hagoromo’s Six Paths Chakra. Hell it was Fodder against even Juubito. Does it have its perks? Yes. Cloaks, Chakra Arms, “Volume” (Which is good for Stamina Reasons), Healing Factor, TBB (Which is AoE perks), etc. But that is amplified by the Six Paths Chakra. The other Biju Chakra + Kurama’s Chakra just gives Naruto extra Six Paths Chakra ontop of what Hagoromo gave him. So let’s be specific about it.

But it (along with a little bit of chakra from the other Bijuu) boosted SPSM Naruto from being reacted to and blocked by Injured Pre-God Tree Juubidara to tangoing with Dual Rinnegan Juubidara.

Refer Above + Base Naruto is still amped by the SPC. Kurama + Biju Chakra Together creates a fraction more SPC, which is negligible to the entire system. Also, idk if you remember but Sasuke w/o MS Activated is still able to tank DR Madara’s strikes without injury. Base Naruto scales to this Sasuke, so being able to tango w/ DR Madara isn’t as big a deal as you’re making it out to be and the fact remains that Kurama’s Chakra Strength and Benefits are negligible to the amp of SPC he has from Hagoromo. It didn’t change anything significantly.

I mean it's kinda just stated (I imagine you're gonna say that it's only about chakra transferring but that's just a specific example given to highlight it and the greater context is chakra; he literally says Minato and Kushina pale in comparison to him which isn't something one would say when he's only better in a very niche trait).

Not true and you’re wrong on the “greater context”. The context of his statements is in regard to Chakra Control, nothing more.

And the narrative is pretty clearly for KCM2 Naruto to rival or surpass Minato, since Kakashi mistakes Naruto's speed for Minato's (which is Minato's best trait) and it's intended to allow Naruto to defeat Obito, who's close to Minato.

The one shot clearly debunks this sentiment unless you think and want to argue that 100% V2’s are less than half the strength of their Biju, which is a notion that is proven wrong in the fight with Bee and Naruto.

So unless you’re willing to say 100% V2 9 Tails is weaker than 50% 9 Tails, then Minato’s feats disprove (Or at Worst Retcons) that previous interpretation. Also, Minato says that Mastering that Chakra gives only a “chance” at beating Obito. It’s not a foregone conclusion. It’s bare-minimum.

Naruto's rapidly growing back is also tied to his arc of catching up to Minato, so his back being indistinguishable from Minato's symbolically completes his arc of reaching that level.

False. This only states Naruto “can”. It doesn’t mean Naruto “has”, and again, the one shot disabuses you of these notions.

Featwise it also doesn't make sense to have Minato above him since KCM2 Naruto could physically damage a stronger Obito than the one that took Minato's Rasengan.

And by how much stronger is this Obito vs YM Obito physically? Minato made him lose an arm and blood shoot from out his back around his spine/ribs. It could be that Obito being stronger is why he isn’t as badly hurt. I also remember a few people arguing he tanked this Naruto’s Rasengan to the face w/o Damage, which would negate your argument.

Ntm, again, the One Shot disproves he is stronger than Minato.

 

[SlendVeny]

Naruto the type to Blitzkrieg Adolf's ass and then proceed to psychologically break him too before Adolf kills himself anyways.

Years later:

"Dont worry, Nagato, I'll make sure the nuclear threat is eliminated."

does nothing

 

[NeoKingOfLight]

Damn… Essay Wars round 2!

 

[NeoKingOfLight]

I mean honestly, this is all finished based on if 100% V2 9 Tails is stronger than 50% 9 Tails.

That’s all that matters here. It doesn’t even have to be a long debate.

 

[SlendVeny]

Kushina beats Pain.

 

[KaydeeX]

Mom beats kid

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Ok I'm not having a full on Essay War P2 but I'm gonna respond to the key points.

The one shot clearly debunks this sentiment unless you think and want to argue that 100% V2’s are less than half the strength of their Biju, which is a notion that is proven wrong in the fight with Bee and Naruto.

So unless you’re willing to say 100% V2 9 Tails is weaker than 50% 9 Tails, then Minato’s feats disprove (Or at Worst Retcons) that previous interpretation.

Even if 100% V2 Kurama is stronger than 50% Kurama, that doesn't mean he's stronger than the Perfect Jinchuriki of 50% Kurama. Perfect Jinchuriki>Bijuu.

Also, Minato says that Mastering that Chakra gives only a “chance” at beating Obito. It’s not a foregone conclusion. It’s bare-minimum.

Sure Minato wouldn't know exactly how strong KCM2 Naruto would be, just that he's stronger than 50% Kurama. But it's pretty obvious narrative intent proven by KCM2 Naruto showing relativity to Rinnegan Obito who's superior to YM Obito.

False. This only states Naruto “can”. It doesn’t mean Naruto “has”, and again, the one shot disabuses you of these notions.

You're missing the point of my argument. I'm not saying that the fact that Naruto can surpass Minato means he did in KCM2, but the fact that his figure grew to be indistinguishable from Minato's means he did, which is what the statement I sent is referring to. And while other things like the greater narrative are debatable, it's just blatant that Kakashi deadass thought he was seeing Minato due to Naruto's feat. That's just straight up equality if anything.

And by how much stronger is this Obito vs YM Obito physically? Minato made him lose an arm and blood shoot from out his back around his spine/ribs. It could be that Obito being stronger is why he isn’t as badly hurt. I also remember a few people arguing he tanked this Naruto’s Rasengan to the face w/o Damage, which would negate your argument.

The actual spot that Minato hit wasn't damaged so badly considering it's a Rasengan as opposed to a simple headbutt. Both caused bleeding, Minato's Rasengan just caused somewhat more.

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Kushina beats Pain.

Beats MKCM Naruto too lowkey

 

[MinatoSparkle]

I have to say, I didn't wake up today expecting to argue against Minato

 

[HelloThere1089]

I have to say, I didn't wake up today expecting to argue against Minato

It's called treason buddy. And the cult is gonna come after you.

 

[MinatoSparkle]

It's called treason buddy. And the cult is gonna come after you.

Joke's on you, I'm the leader of the Minato cult (I quite literally have "the president of the Minato cult" in my Discord about me )

 

[HelloThere1089]

Joke's on you, I'm the leader of the Minato cult (I quite literally have "the president of the Minato cult" in my Discord about me )

Bold of you to assume your subordinates won't turn on you.

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Bold of you to assume your subordinates won't turn on you.

Bold of you to assume I don't have mind control devices in all of them

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Kushina beats Pain.

Kushina is crazy strong and massively underrated. Kurama level speed, barriers, and chains while literally frickin' dying is utterly ridiculous.

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Kushina is crazy strong and massively underrated. Kurama level speed, barriers, and chains while literally frickin' dying is utterly ridiculous.

Idk about speed since Kurama wasn't looking at her when she wrapped him up, but yeah she's broken

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Idk about speed since Kurama wasn't looking at her when she wrapped him up, but yeah she's broken

I'm talking physical speed, she intercepted his claw.

Also pretty insane when you factor in that she knows all sorts of sealing Jutsu, might possibly know the Rasengan (how cool would that be?), may have a decent healing factor (if we assume she's just like Karin), and may or may not have some level of control over Kurama's chakra (would be weird if she has less grasp on it than Part I Naruto imo). Pretty underrated bag if she has all of this shit. Though obviously all of it is 100% speculative sadly.

 

[HelloThere1089]

In light of Prescience, how do y'all think Boruto came accross FTG? I have stated my theory before, but what do y'all think? Boruto even mentioned Minato in chapter 4. And the database confirms Koji's involvement. The Database also says it's a slightly different version of FTG.

 

[MinatoSparkle]

I'm talking physical speed, she intercepted his claw.

Oh sure but that's only 50% Kurama (still fast af just not 100% Kurama level)

Also pretty insane when you factor in that she knows all sorts of sealing Jutsu, might possibly know the Rasengan (how cool would that be?), may have a decent healing factor (if we assume she's just like Karin), and may or may not have some level of control over Kurama's chakra (would be weird if she has less grasp on it than Part I Naruto imo). Pretty underrated bag if she has all of this shit. Though obviously all of it is 100% speculative sadly.

I think what we do know of her is enough to place her very high in the verse. We pretty much get a direct statement of her being above Initial KCM Naruto from the man himself, and she should have most if not all of Minato's sealing jutsu.

 

[Gokukid2005]

I heard something about the novels having a canon love interest for him. Is that legit?

Kakashi Hiden novel iirc
Him and a prisoner but nothing happens cause she's a criminal and he's hokage

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Oh sure but that's only 50% Kurama (still fast af just not 100% Kurama level)

Did I say 100% Kurama? Mb if I did cause that's not what I meant, though I don't think it matters much either way tbh. Insane feat regardless given her state at the time and allat.

I think what we do know of her is enough to place her very high in the verse. We pretty much get a direct statement of her being above Initial KCM Naruto from the man himself, and she should have most if not all of Minato's sealing jutsu.

Quite right.

 

[NeoKingOfLight]

Even if 100% V2 Kurama is stronger than 50% Kurama, that doesn't mean he's stronger than the Perfect Jinchuriki of 50% Kurama. Perfect Jinchuriki>Bijuu.

Sure, but in this case that means the question becomes: Naruto w/ Weaker Chakra and Unquantifiably better CC vs Minato w/ Stronger Chakra and Unquantifiably lesser CC.

Sure Minato wouldn't know exactly how strong KCM2 Naruto would be, just that he's stronger than 50% Kurama. But it's pretty obvious narrative intent proven by KCM2 Naruto showing relativity to Rinnegan Obito who's superior to YM Obito.

Ok… you do realize that even if don’t argue the point and I grant you this, that doesn’t change Kishimoto’s writing of Minato in the One Shot and the new narrative implications that directly conflict with the previous narrative intent about Naruto/Minato dynamic. Right or wrong? It would be a retcon at worst. You cannot ignore the One Shot.

You're missing the point of my argument. I'm not saying that the fact that Naruto can surpass Minato means he did in KCM2, but the fact that his figure grew to be indistinguishable from Minato's means he did

You are inflating the significance of that scene far too much. Yes, it emphasized Naruto’s speed but dude was mistaken due to Kakashi’s visage being obscured by Dust and Debris. The anime portrayal is not the same as the manga’s. It doesn’t carry the connotation you are trying to give it.

And while other things like the greater narrative are debatable, it's just blatant that Kakashi deadass thought he was seeing Minato due to Naruto's feat. That's just straight up equality if anything.

Refer above + It’s really not though. You are, as they say, “Putting dubs on it” or, “Gassing it”…

The actual spot that Minato hit wasn't damaged so badly considering it's a Rasengan as opposed to a simple headbutt. Both caused bleeding, Minato's Rasengan just caused somewhat more.

Bro… you clearly see blood shooting through the skin from around the rib cage/spine, as well as bruising. Are we really saying that EVERYTHING that happens to Obito is > Minato? Is Kakashi now > Minato’s Rasengan? Kakashi’s Punch to the face > BM Naruto’s Headbutt > Minato’s Rasengan?

Come on…