• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.
Could Orochimaru at ANY point in the series, before gaining a Zetsu Body, “actually” react to Minato’s Shunshin Blitz?

Does his feats support that?
 
Could Orochimaru at ANY point in the series, before gaining a Zetsu Body, “actually” react to Minato’s Shunshin Blitz?

Does his feats support that?
Oddly specific question, but if you mean Hokage Minato, no. Shunshin Minato>>FP Kurama~Madara's Susanoo~/>Rinnegan Obito~KCM2 Naruto>>>KCM Naruto>>PA SM Naruto>SM Jiraiya~/>P1 Orochimaru>Any other pre-WA Orochimaru
 
feNVc8F.png
 
I don't like the implication here

Wdym?
The Method of Genjutsu Negation he taught Naruto, “Stoping the Flow of Chakra then Ramping it up again”, that is only able to break Genjutsu that is lower on the totem pole than MS level Genjutsu, right?

Obviously Naruto wasn’t able to break Itachi’s because Itachi had SIGNIFICANTLY better CC than him at that time, but still. A general principle if you will.
 
Emoji Mad GIFs | Tenor

The Method of Genjutsu Negation he taught Naruto, “Stoping the Flow of Chakra then Ramping it up again”, that is only able to break Genjutsu that is lower on the totem pole than MS level Genjutsu, right?

Obviously Naruto wasn’t able to break Itachi’s because Itachi had SIGNIFICANTLY better CC than him at that time, but still. A general principle if you will.
I think it can theoretically work against MS genjutsu, it's just significantly harder, at least outside of specific techniques like Tsukuyomi and Kotoamatsukami
 
The future is looking good though imo. Koji has to have seen some good news. Konoha has:
  1. Boruto
  2. Kawaki
  3. Amado Tech
  4. Kurama-Hima
  5. Daemon/Eida
  6. Sarada’s MS
Depending on Sarada’s abilities with MS, if Koji brings Shikamaru/Amado into the fold, explain the situation and organize a response with all of these things at their disposal (And Eida/Daemon can be negotiated with) with prep-time, I find it EXTREMELY HARD for Jura and co to win unless they other broken abilities not yet revealed.
 
The future is looking good though imo. Koji has to have seen some good news. Konoha has:
  1. Boruto
  2. Kawaki
  3. Amado Tech
  4. Kurama-Hima
  5. Daemon/Eida
  6. Sarada’s MS
Depending on Sarada’s abilities with MS, if Koji brings Shikamaru/Amado into the fold, explain the situation and organize a response with all of these things at their disposal (And Eida/Daemon can be negotiated with) with prep-time, I find it EXTREMELY HARD for Jura and co to win unless they other broken abilities not yet revealed.
What if they were smart and collected shinju from weaker villages before attacking Konoha again. I'm talking dozens.
 
Emoji Mad GIFs | Tenor


I think it can theoretically work against MS genjutsu, it's just significantly harder, at least outside of specific techniques like Tsukuyomi and Kotoamatsukami
I see, because I was thinking that it’s fair to assume that when it comes to the basics, Jiraiya taught Naruto/Minato/Nagato the same things, Genjutsu Dispelling among them. And if this is the case, going along with what you said, if this method is only good for non-special MS techs, then based on what we have from Minato rn, he’d get cooked by higher Genjutsu, Tsukoyomi or higher.
 
Jiraiya’s method of Genjutsu Negation only works on Genjutsu that is lower than MS Genjutsu, huh?
It doesn't work against Sharingan genjutsu in general, not just MS genjutsu.
Remember the whole "if it's 1 on 1 against the Sharingan, you run" stuff? You need to have someone else break you out cause the normal method doesn't work.
 
I see, because I was thinking that it’s fair to assume that when it comes to the basics, Jiraiya taught Naruto/Minato/Nagato the same things, Genjutsu Dispelling among them. And if this is the case, going along with what you said, if this method is only good for non-special MS techs, then based on what we have from Minato rn, he’d get cooked by higher Genjutsu, Tsukoyomi or higher.
Sure if Tsukuyomi landed Minato would be cooked

It wouldn't tho
It doesn't work against Sharingan genjutsu in general, not just MS genjutsu.
Remember the whole "if it's 1 on 1 against the Sharingan, you run" stuff? You need to have someone else break you out cause the normal method doesn't work.
It's clearly not the case that it's just an instant gg no matter what, otherwise Hashirama wouldn't have won all those battles against Madara, and we see Danzo dispel Sasuke's genjutsu (you could argue it's just cause of the seal but how'd he activate it if he was under genjutsu?). Obito also says Sasuke's genjutsu has no staying power and he wasn't sure if he could place Danzo under genjutsu in the first place.
 
Sure if Tsukuyomi landed Minato would be cooked

It wouldn't tho

It's clearly not the case that it's just an instant gg no matter what, otherwise Hashirama wouldn't have won all those battles against Madara,
If you can prove that Madara managed to trap Hashirama in a genjutsu and he successfully broke out, then sure. Otherwise, I think I'll stick to what's explicitly stated.
and we see Danzo dispel Sasuke's genjutsu (you could argue it's just cause of the seal but how'd he activate it if he was under genjutsu?). Obito also says Sasuke's genjutsu has no staying power and he wasn't sure if he could place Danzo under genjutsu in the first place.
Danzo had the Sharingan, which allows you to dispel genjutsu, even that of another Sharingan.
 
Is Jiraiya’s method widely known? Iirc, Chiyo’s statement wouldn’t apply to Jiraiya’s method if his method isn’t widely known (Sounds Crazy, Ik).

The reason I ask is because when Itachi rebounded Kurenai’s Genjutsu, she didn’t employ the same method, instead she used pain (Ala, Shikamaru) and outside of Itachi and Shisui, SHE was the worlds greatest Genjutsu user.
 
If you can prove that Madara managed to trap Hashirama in a genjutsu and he successfully broke out, then sure.
Let's be fr, they fought for well over a decade, it's not realistic at all to say he would've never used genjutsu in their hundreds of battles
Otherwise, I think I'll stick to what's explicitly stated.
This doesn't mean that it's the case for absolutely everyone, it can just be referring to a general rule of thumb, which is supported by the raws (二対一で挑むのが原則。一人が術に堕ちたら、仲間が術者を攻撃し解く。)
Danzo had the Sharingan, which allows you to dispel genjutsu, even that of another Sharingan.
He had the Sharingan covered, and Sasuke didn't even know about it and was still uncertain about being able to trap him.
 
Is Jiraiya’s method widely known? Iirc, Chiyo’s statement wouldn’t apply to Jiraiya’s method if his method isn’t widely known (Sounds Crazy, Ik).

The reason I ask is because when Itachi rebounded Kurenai’s Genjutsu, she didn’t employ the same method, instead she used pain (Ala, Shikamaru) and outside of Itachi and Shisui, SHE was the worlds greatest Genjutsu user.
Shit, questioned > answered. But that begs the question… would the ability to absorb Nature Energy count towards the two person rule? 🤔

It’s not necessary to absorb enough to go into Sage Mode.
 
Let's be fr, they fought for well over a decade, it's not realistic at all to say he would've never used genjutsu in their hundreds of battles

This doesn't mean that it's the case for absolutely everyone, it can just be referring to a general rule of thumb, which is supported by the raws (二対一で挑むのが原則。一人が術に堕ちたら、仲間が術者を攻撃し解く。)

He had the Sharingan covered, and Sasuke didn't even know about it and was still uncertain about being able to trap him.
I perfer this version of it instead.
sddefault.jpg

Which is kinda canon.
ZANcT9X.png
 
Let's be fr, they fought for well over a decade, it's not realistic at all to say he would've never used genjutsu in their hundreds of battles
Okay, so all I'm hearing is that you have no support for your claim.
And if we're being fr, the guy who spent his entire life fighting the Uchiha Clan probably knows not to look them in the eye...
I never claimed Madara never used genjutsu, but you need to prove that Hashirama fell victim to it AND broke out of it. Otherwise, your claim is completely baseless.
This doesn't mean that it's the case for absolutely everyone, it can just be referring to a general rule of thumb, which is supported by the raws (二対一で挑むのが原則。一人が術に堕ちたら、仲間が術者を攻撃し解く。)
What do you think a general rule of thumb means, exactly?
And the statement is very conclusive. It's literally an objective source explaining all the ways to deal with genjutsu, and makes a point of differentiating between ocular and non-ocular genjutsu. Stop grasping at straws and just take the statements for what they clearly are.
He had the Sharingan covered, and Sasuke didn't even know about it and was still uncertain about being able to trap him.
He had Shisui's Sharingan covered, not the 69 other ones he had out.
 
Okay, so all I'm hearing is that you have no support for your claim.
And if we're being fr, the guy who spent his entire life fighting the Uchiha Clan probably knows not to look them in the eye...
I never claimed Madara never used genjutsu, but you need to prove that Hashirama fell victim to it AND broke out of it. Otherwise, your claim is completely baseless.

What do you think a general rule of thumb means, exactly?
And the statement is very conclusive. It's literally an objective source explaining all the ways to deal with genjutsu, and makes a point of differentiating between ocular and non-ocular genjutsu. Stop grasping at straws and just take the statements for what they clearly are.

He had Shisui's Sharingan covered, not the 69 other ones he had out.
Let's be fr, they fought for well over a decade, it's not realistic at all to say he would've never used genjutsu in their hundreds of battles
 
Back
Top