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Naruto: Sub-Relativistic Upgrade
- Thread starter Wrath_Of_Itachi
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After ofc
Boruto isn't that much of a genius to be fighting on par with people like Ao and Part 2 Kakashi
Boruto isn't that much of a genius to be fighting on par with people like Ao and Part 2 Kakashi
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- #84
Lets not discuss AP upgrades on this thread please.
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I can't fully get into the discussion until I get home, but to try and explain briefly my thought process in bringing up calc-stacking, this is what the page on calc-stacking says:
> Calc stacking refers to the practice of using results from one calculation in order to calculate other feats.
The Calc Stacking page also says this:
> Usually people try to use it for calculating characters speed.
Now, we basically have two calcs going on here - and they are calcs even if they are pretty simple calcs:
1) The speed of Kirin; based on a given timeframe and an assumed distance. (Yes, I know the distance is given roughly by saying it comes from a certain type of cloud, but that isn't an exact distance)
2) The speed of Sasuke dodging Kirin.
Now, the result of the 2nd calc is dependant in the result of the 1st calc. Maybe this scenario doesn't exactly actually count as calc stacking, but can people see why I would bring it up?
> Calc stacking refers to the practice of using results from one calculation in order to calculate other feats.
The Calc Stacking page also says this:
> Usually people try to use it for calculating characters speed.
Now, we basically have two calcs going on here - and they are calcs even if they are pretty simple calcs:
1) The speed of Kirin; based on a given timeframe and an assumed distance. (Yes, I know the distance is given roughly by saying it comes from a certain type of cloud, but that isn't an exact distance)
2) The speed of Sasuke dodging Kirin.
Now, the result of the 2nd calc is dependant in the result of the 1st calc. Maybe this scenario doesn't exactly actually count as calc stacking, but can people see why I would bring it up?
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It's not really calc stacking much less a multiple step based calculation. Example of calc stacking is assuming that a Low 7-B striking strength feat grants a Relativistic+ speed rating by dividing the energy yield by the mass of the fist and Multiplying it by 2 and taking the square root of that number. The distance Sasuke moved is calcable on panel feat, and the timeframe given is legit.
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The calc is wrong in utilizing the 2km cloud-to-ground distance, they're standing on top of a mountain so logically you should substract that from the cloud height to get a proper distance for the lightning to travel.
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No. The distance is not presumed. It is said where it comes from, and the "assumed" distance is the standard of a cumuloninbus. Here, you can simply increase it or ... Increase it, since the cumuloninbus standard is around 2000 to 4000m, at least.
It's not a asumption where the lightning is, it's a question of which distance to use. But the distance still comes from a cumuloninbus, so a average calculation (w/ pixel scaling, angsize e cia) is not necessary. The distance we're told! We just need to decide which distance to use and the one used in calc is as consistent as possible.
Therefore, it is not a calc stacking. There is no calculation made, since the author himself gives us the calculation. It is quite different, for example, from the calculation of Pain. Where we have a calculation made to find the distance, although we have a "supposed" time said.
It's not a asumption where the lightning is, it's a question of which distance to use. But the distance still comes from a cumuloninbus, so a average calculation (w/ pixel scaling, angsize e cia) is not necessary. The distance we're told! We just need to decide which distance to use and the one used in calc is as consistent as possible.
Therefore, it is not a calc stacking. There is no calculation made, since the author himself gives us the calculation. It is quite different, for example, from the calculation of Pain. Where we have a calculation made to find the distance, although we have a "supposed" time said.
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If anyone has a prob with the calc make a crt for it since it's already accepted
This thread is for find the scaling and it's kinda running of track
This thread is for find the scaling and it's kinda running of track
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Okay. I've been meaning to analyse lightning style jutsu in Naruto for a while and I'll take my concerns to a new thread I'll create (probably tomorrow).
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Why are u bringing up chunins and new gen here??? This thread is for who scales to Sub rel. no chunin level character scales to that at all cause you would have to be comparable to Sasuke or Akatsuki and Kakashi level ninja
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cuz of this bolds
imade wrote
>Best speed feat for old generation before power creep was a tired and damaged Pain at Mach 3k.
That looks like an outlier right now.
i meant that old gen genin=new gen genin in speed
if part one chunin = to new gen genin in speed than old gen genin should scale to them
if they scale then it wont be outlier
and never said chunin level character scales to this
imade wrote
>Best speed feat for old generation before power creep was a tired and damaged Pain at Mach 3k.
That looks like an outlier right now.
i meant that old gen genin=new gen genin in speed
if part one chunin = to new gen genin in speed than old gen genin should scale to them
if they scale then it wont be outlier
and never said chunin level character scales to this
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- Thread starter
- #97
Lets talk about who scales to the calc. What's everyone's opinion of my list in the OP?
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^Damage3245 said:
This. So much this. I was thinking on making a thread on it before I saw this comment. I've seen things go through solely because the math looked right. If it looks right, and enough people say it's mathematically accurate, it goes through, as context isn't needed.
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If Ao scales wouldn't it scale to Boruto??
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@Damage
If I were you, I just would not waste my time.
The Raiton in Naruto has more than 5 real features of lightning, being agreed by Kep, Tata and other members.
You will need a very good reason for this, which I find very difficult (I even looked for some things that disapprove of Raiton in Naruto not being real and I did not find it).
In any case, good luck and I hope so!
If I were you, I just would not waste my time.
The Raiton in Naruto has more than 5 real features of lightning, being agreed by Kep, Tata and other members.
You will need a very good reason for this, which I find very difficult (I even looked for some things that disapprove of Raiton in Naruto not being real and I did not find it).
In any case, good luck and I hope so!
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- Thread starter
- #102
That was suppose to be sage kabuto not base.
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The context of the scene is correct. Do not do anything wrong with it.
There is no outlier.
There are consistencies with others made of slower characters.
Anyway, the more PoV, the better it will be to rate this feat.
There is no outlier.
There are consistencies with others made of slower characters.
Anyway, the more PoV, the better it will be to rate this feat.
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- Thread starter
- #104
I'm iffy on Ao scaling or not, he has feats for it, but Boruto scaling would be an issue.Sigurd Snake in The Eye said:
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I'm sorry but I doubt that there's no lack of context. I've seen a good amount of people on the calc saying that Sasuke didn't dodge at all, which is a point I have yet to see addressed in this thread. Just on whether it's an outlier or not. And in order for t to be an outlier, it needs to be a legit feat in the first place.
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About Sasuke not having dodged, was addressed in the blog of the calc itself. He has motive and was shown explicitly in the manga, not being in the place where it should be and not being seen in the scan and could not even be there, thanks to the lightning being almost as thick as the mountain..
Unless they simply ignore the manga or make up some assumption that sweeps it, it is simply impossible for it not to have dodge.
Unless they simply ignore the manga or make up some assumption that sweeps it, it is simply impossible for it not to have dodge.
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In case anyone is confused as to why people would say Sasuke did not dodge, I think I can shed some light:
In the middle panel of this page we can see the initial distance between Sasuke and Itachi. It's not very high.
Here is the page where the lightning strikes directly on top of Itachi. As we can see the main bolt of lightning wouldn't have hit Sasuke even if he didn't move from the stone pillar he was standing on.
This is the next time we see Sasuke - he appears to just be standing in the rubble.
And this is the distance separating him and Itachi.
So, at no point do we actually see Sasuke travelling 600+ meters to get away from the lightning before it hits the building; and we don't actually see him travelling back from that far distance either. All in all he does not appear to be much further away from Itachi than he was at the beginning of the chapter.
In the middle panel of this page we can see the initial distance between Sasuke and Itachi. It's not very high.
Here is the page where the lightning strikes directly on top of Itachi. As we can see the main bolt of lightning wouldn't have hit Sasuke even if he didn't move from the stone pillar he was standing on.
This is the next time we see Sasuke - he appears to just be standing in the rubble.
And this is the distance separating him and Itachi.
So, at no point do we actually see Sasuke travelling 600+ meters to get away from the lightning before it hits the building; and we don't actually see him travelling back from that far distance either. All in all he does not appear to be much further away from Itachi than he was at the beginning of the chapter.
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@Damage
Nope.
• We see in the image itself, that Sasuke was on top of that wall .
• In the next image, it is no longer while the lightning bolt has just hit the mountai .
• In the next image we see that the lightning was large enough to completely cover the mountain width , which completely debunks the fact that it was on the mountain when the lightning struck.
• In the next scene, we see that Sasuke returned to the place where he was , while there was no more flying debris (it was shown that flew away) and only small crumbs were falling. What shows that he only returned to the place, when the feat had already materialized almost completely. Otherwise, there should be gigantic debris falling off, since we can see several of them still in the air.
That is, his argument simply ignores that the lightning was large enough to encompass the whole mountai and the image itself.
Although we say that Sasuke simply jumped to avoid being hit by lightning and fall on the same place...He would have to jump several hundred meters to escape the panel and remain in the air for several seconds, falling intact. This is the only other possible option to justify what we see in the manga.
Nope.
• We see in the image itself, that Sasuke was on top of that wall .
• In the next image, it is no longer while the lightning bolt has just hit the mountai .
• In the next image we see that the lightning was large enough to completely cover the mountain width , which completely debunks the fact that it was on the mountain when the lightning struck.
• In the next scene, we see that Sasuke returned to the place where he was , while there was no more flying debris (it was shown that flew away) and only small crumbs were falling. What shows that he only returned to the place, when the feat had already materialized almost completely. Otherwise, there should be gigantic debris falling off, since we can see several of them still in the air.
That is, his argument simply ignores that the lightning was large enough to encompass the whole mountai and the image itself.
Although we say that Sasuke simply jumped to avoid being hit by lightning and fall on the same place...He would have to jump several hundred meters to escape the panel and remain in the air for several seconds, falling intact. This is the only other possible option to justify what we see in the manga.
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Boruto doesn't scale to Ao besides probably with reaction speed but that's it. Karma Seal Boruto May scale tho not too sure.
Tho I'm not sure if Ao would scale so I'd take him off that list for now
Tho I'm not sure if Ao would scale so I'd take him off that list for now
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The real cal howard said:
We've addressed this too many times and on the calc Kep made the first time we addressed this as well. Time after time again. It was accepted that Sasuke dodged back when Kep made his first calc which is what makes this annoying when it's already been debated before over a lot of comments
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I'd also like to note that earlier people was saying that Sasuke was merely being hyperbolic when he suggested that no one could dodge Kirin.
However Black Zetsu seemed to agree with him; specifically noting the speed of natural lightning and why it cannot be evaded for that reason.
That would definitely seem to indicate to me that the result that puts Sasuke almost four times higher than the speed of Kirin is a potential outlier.
However Black Zetsu seemed to agree with him; specifically noting the speed of natural lightning and why it cannot be evaded for that reason.
That would definitely seem to indicate to me that the result that puts Sasuke almost four times higher than the speed of Kirin is a potential outlier.
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2 hyperboles do not make it right.
The Manga contradicted what they both said, with Sasuke EXPLICITLY not being in the picture and having reasons not to be there (and could not be).
And as has been said, there is a consistency behind the feat, much slower characters than Sasuke Hebi, achieving only a few minor feats. So it's not outlier.
The Manga contradicted what they both said, with Sasuke EXPLICITLY not being in the picture and having reasons not to be there (and could not be).
And as has been said, there is a consistency behind the feat, much slower characters than Sasuke Hebi, achieving only a few minor feats. So it's not outlier.
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Potential outlier?? Dude we got calcs that don't even make that an outlier
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Sasuke is not visible on the panel, that is correct, but that doesn't mean he had to leave the borders of the panel. There's a huge sound effect, various debris, etc. Sasuke could even be behind that wall for all we know instead of on top of it. Not seeing him does not mean he had to travel all the way offscreen.
Also, the whole point of the jutsu is for Sasuke to direct the Kirin at his target; why would Sasuke be included in that? We can see where the lightning bolt itself lands and the width of the lightning bolt on this panel is not the entire Uchiha Hideout.
The manga only contradicted Sasuke's claim that it could not be blocked (because he was unaware of Susano'o). It didn't contradict that it could not be evaded.
Also, the whole point of the jutsu is for Sasuke to direct the Kirin at his target; why would Sasuke be included in that? We can see where the lightning bolt itself lands and the width of the lightning bolt on this panel is not the entire Uchiha Hideout.
The manga only contradicted Sasuke's claim that it could not be blocked (because he was unaware of Susano'o). It didn't contradict that it could not be evaded.
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The wall got destroyed man all of it. Also Sasuke was about to use it agaisnt Team 7. He had to dodge Kirin back then as well because of its AOE
The whole hideout was destroyed again
The whole hideout was destroyed again
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what does the anime show?
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Even assuming Sasuke dodged, which is reasonable enough, there is no reason to use the mountain's radius. That is stacking two assumptions on top of another.
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Damage3245 said:
Dude the manga showed the same thing literally. Did u read the manga cuz the same panel is shown
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It also shows in the anime clip that Sasuke isn't on top of the mountain when Kirin hit the mountain.
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