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Naruto blocking Toneri's Moon-cutting extending sword?

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Antvasima

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Does anybody remember what happened to this calculation, and what the result was?

I vaguely remember that it was sub-relativistic or somesuch, and that we accepted it, but now it seems to have disappeared from Naruto's profile.

I would appreciate if somebody could help to straighten out this issue. Thank you.
 
Well, there have been so many hundreds of issues to deal with here for me that I have a hard time remembering.
 
Well I know about two calcs that put Naruto at sub-relativistic.

This calc . "It's to short to even do a blog on really. Toneri's sword length > moon diameter. Takes about 1 second to extend to full length. Moon = 3475km. 3475km/s = mach 10,131.2. Little lower than I thought. Meh, whatever."

And this calc .

The feat was really straightforward in my opinion. Toneri's pointed his sword at Naruto and shot it at Naruto, who managed to block the sword despite how fast it was.
 
I'm glad you found that because I couldn't. IIRC there was about an equal amount of people who agreed and disagreed with it and everything wasn't taken into consideration apparently. The beam reached Naruto and passed him so fast that it didn't immediately register that it was blocked by him.
 
i still believe its an abuse of cinematic time and that we cannot measure proper measurements via screen time, especialy if in one ocasion it takes the beam 1-1.5 seconds to extanded, and in another one its over 2.5 seconds, too inconsistent, not to mention its an ability activasion which is considered instantanious anyway and does not convey anything about a character's actuall speed...
 
Illuminati478 said:
i still believe its an abuse of cinematic time and that we cannot measure proper measurements via screen time, especialy if in one ocasion it takes the beam 1-1.5 seconds to extanded, and in another one its over 2.5 seconds, too inconsistent, not to mention its an ability activasion which is considered instantanious anyway and does not convey anything about a character's actuall speed...
Click to expand...
I'm not following what you mean. There was a scene of Toneri's hand focusing on the Goudama and next thing you know he's holding a weapon that traveled 2,000 + miles. It's hardly abusing the cinematic when that's what happened. And the second time he used it was a slow motion effect for about 5-6 seconds but you can clearly see that it was going the same speed as the first time he used it by the way it immediately sped up after all the slow motion effect was over with. I wouldn't call that inconsistent.
 
well if you are sure, (i am still positives we cannot judge cinematic screen time with speed calcs), then meassure the amount of frame takes, from there get an exact time frame (just because the screentime counter changed once doesn't it was only one second, could be anywhere from 1 to 2 seconds) and get it properly done, after that we can discuss whether its applicable to his speed stats...
 
hmmm... Now as someone that didn´t watch the movie maybe I shouldn´t involve myself, but a 1 second difference in he speed of the technique isn´t such a large inconsistency in my opinion.

But about this scene. From what do we know that the sword extended itself to full length in 1 second? We don´t really see the end of the sword, so we only know that it extended to the length of the diameter of the moon at the point it pointed straight down/has sliced half way through the moon. Couldn´t it have been growing the whole time to that point?
 
DontTalk said:
hmmm... Now as someone that didn´t watch the movie maybe I shouldn´t involve myself, but a 1 second difference in he speed of the technique isn´t such a large inconsistency in my opinion.
But about this scene. From what do we know that the sword extended itself to full length in 1 second? We don´t really see the end of the sword, so we only know that it extended to the length of the diameter of the moon at the point it pointed straight down/has sliced half way through the moon. Couldn´t it have been growing the whole time to that point?
Click to expand...
Given how fast the sword extended from Toneri's hand it's very likely that it was as long as the Moon's diameter the moment he activated the technique.
 
@ non-Bias, after seeing the feat (again), this is clearly an ability activation, there are dozen of examples such as this one, like doflamingo's strings, khalifa soap armor thingy, as well as zommari resurecioun ability, regardless, it doesn't amount to any speed by any means, not to mention that after looking at the "feat" it seems more like 1.5 seconds which would put your number back MHS+ anyway.
 
IIRC, Naruto reacted to Toneri swinging the blade down (which was MHS+), not to it extending.
 
Illuminati478 said:
@ non-Bias, after seeing the feat (again), this is clearly an ability activation, there are dozen of examples such as this one, like doflamingo's strings, khalifa soap armor thingy, as well as zommari resurecioun ability, regardless, it doesn't amount to any speed by any means, not to mention that after looking at the "feat" it seems more like 1.5 seconds which would put your number back MHS+ anyway.
Click to expand...
An ability activation that happens to have traveled 2000 instantly you mean. It would be the same as Gin's Bankai except vastly superior in speed and range. To clarify, this would simply make Naruto sub-relativistic in reaction speed, not movement speed.

@Sheoth: Toneri pointed that Goudama directly at Naruto and extended it and Naruto reacted to it.
 
gin's bankai was defind to have speed as an ability, this doesn't, its just big chunk of enregy forming in a straight line, nothing more, the only reason this is even brought up as an argument is due to the fact that is a part of a film and not a manga, in which case its abuse of cinamtic time, since it will look less pretty if it didn't the beam sword thingy just apeared out of nowhere, much like many other abuses of cinematic time in many action movies, and by the way it still seems more like 1.5 seconds the just a second...
 
I've watched the video and I'm not convinced Naruto has sub relativistic speed, Naruto was already running towards toneri with a rasengan in his hand when the sword formed
 
Gin lied about his Bankai's speed though, but that doesn't stop the fact that it was very fast in activating. And I really don't understand what you mean by saying that it's not a ability noted for its speed. It doesn't have to be a stated "speed technique" in order for it to be fast does it? Even if you say it's just a big chunk of energy forming in a straight line, it still doesn't change the fact it travelled 2,000+ miles in a second. It was a second by the way. You can see that in the video.
 
@Sheoth I know I'm referring to his hand reaction after Toneri pointed the blade at him at 7:08 he was running towards him before never denied that but that really wasn't the point in the first place
 
second an a half from the begining of 5:16 to the middle of 5:17

regardless that is not what i meant, gin lied about his bankai, thats true, but its still based on speed, range and and cell disolving poison, thats the reason we can say it takes time and not instant, but abilities that aren't stated to have speed element to their characteristic are considered to have instant activation. and this won't be the exception, if we let this one go, it would be double standard.

its also seems eariliy suspicious that another HST verse suddenly becomes the fastest out of them, and suddenly everybody starts to bring long and forgotten (naruto) topics that we have already discussed. honestly, its annoying, even if this is one of the closer to legit reasons, we still have dissmised it already, months ago.
 
The sword was already fired at him and then naruto raised his hand,if you watch it frame by frame its pretty clear.
 
Illuminati478 said:
second an a half from the begining of 5:16 to the middle of 5:17
regardless that is not what i meant, gin lied about his bankai, thats true, but its still based on speed, range and and cell disolving poison, thats the reason we can say it takes time and not instant, but abilities that aren't stated to have speed element to their characteristic are considered to have instant activation. and this won't be the exception, if we let this one go, it would be double standard.

its also seems eariliy suspicious that another HST verse suddenly becomes the fastest out of them, and suddenly everybody starts to bring long and forgotten (naruto) topics that we have already discussed. honestly, its annoying, even if this is one of the closer to legit reasons, we still have dissmised it already, months ago.
Click to expand...
Let me see if I follow what you're saying. Even though Gin lied about the speed of his Bankai, it's still considered a "speed technique" because of how fast it can extend right? That's already double standards right there because he lied about it and it's still apparently a noted speed technique that really has nothing to do with speed by Gin's own admission.

As for what you're saying about the HST, that sounds like a rather personal opinion. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it wasn't until recently (like a week or two ago) that the whole Mimihagi calc got accepted despite the fact it wasn't accepted months ago when the feat happened. What changed? Apparently new evidence. Surely this doesn't apply for Bleach only right? Even on Toneri's profile his attack speed is sub-relativistic so I really don't see the problem with Naruto, who reacted to his attack, having sub-relativistic reactions.
 
Well, I don't tend to make decisions unilaterally, especially ones that I have no set opinion about. I tend to check what other sensible people think?
 
Basically, let's wait to see what the calculation group thinks?
 
Yes, but after just quickly skimming through my replies in the old thread, it seems like the question is that Naruto stood a certain distance away from Toneri, which gave him a considerably greater time to react to the sword extension, which in effect does not rate his speed any higher. If he had stood 1 meter or less away from Toneri's sword, that would have been another matter entirely.
 
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