My Hero Academia General Discussion Thread #18

[Mapl3Sy4up]

So re read it again Endeavor was entirely shocked of All Might’s performance of taking nearly all of them out and barely was able to react to him diving down. So I think we can say peak human reaction is a decent timeframe?

Nah, you can make it just give the picture and the source for the 11km height of clouds, I have the confidence of a wet noodle so I ain’t gonna be making shit
(though if you want to include more in there mention how Enji and burnin Could dodge even if slightly, so superhuman couldn’t be used because the superhumans weren’t completely blitzed, but if you use the 1km Nagant shot and use superhuman for that you get over baseline Mach 100)

Quick google search for average height of clouds gives 10,000 to 60,000 so the average is 10.668km or 35000 feet correct my mistake please, it’s Mach 388 now

or just round up cause he came from above them you do you

If anyone wants to try and calc this / make a small thing for it to get added be my guest. I’m dumb so I’m probably wrong and I have the confidence of a dying opossum so I wouldn’t post it anyways

 

[Mazdoesstuff]

If anyone wants to try and calc this / make a small thing for it to get added be my guest. I’m dumb so I’m probably wrong and I have the confidence of a dying opossum so I wouldn’t post it anyways

U can request it on the calc thread

 

[Earthyboy]

So re read it again Endeavor was entirely shocked of All Might’s performance of taking nearly all of them out and barely was able to react to him diving down. So I think we can say peak human reaction is a decent timeframe?

I don't think peak-human serves as a decent reaction time for a guy who can swap hands with supersonic characters and live to tell a tale.

I get it, this wiki wants to be conservative a lot of the time when it comes to a feat like this but... narratively, Endeavor's reaction time should be treated as a supersonic, bare minimum. You don't even need any sort of calculation or blog to confirm that, it's just explicitly shown in the series that he's a threat to multiple characters who are shown to be capable of moving at Mach speeds, even in reaction time. It makes no sense for someone like that to have "peak-human" statistics. At the very least, the shit that Endeavor has showcased throughout the series has put him far above a reaction time of ~80 milliseconds.

Yes, this is a hill I'm willing to die on.

 

[Mazdoesstuff]

I don't think peak-human serves as a decent reaction time for a guy who can swap hands with supersonic characters and live to tell a tale.

I get it, this wiki wants to be conservative a lot of the time when it comes to a feat like this but... narratively, Endeavor's reaction time should be treated as a supersonic, bare minimum. You don't even need any sort of calculation or blog to confirm that, it's just explicitly shown in the series that he's a threat to multiple characters who are shown to be capable of moving at Mach speeds, even in reaction time. It makes no sense for someone like that to have "peak-human" statistics. At the very least, the shit that Endeavor has showcased throughout the series has put him far above a reaction time of ~80 milliseconds.

Yes, this is a hill I'm willing to die on.

It’s not even a calc lol, Endeavor is capable of creating sonic booms meaning he IS supersonic, so there’s not a point in using conservative estimates

 

[CloverDragon03]

I don't think peak-human serves as a decent reaction time for a guy who can swap hands with supersonic characters and live to tell a tale.

I get it, this wiki wants to be conservative a lot of the time when it comes to a feat like this but... narratively, Endeavor's reaction time should be treated as a supersonic, bare minimum. You don't even need any sort of calculation or blog to confirm that, it's just explicitly shown in the series that he's a threat to multiple characters who are shown to be capable of moving at Mach speeds, even in reaction time. It makes no sense for someone like that to have "peak-human" statistics. At the very least, the shit that Endeavor has showcased throughout the series has put him far above a reaction time of ~80 milliseconds.

Yes, this is a hill I'm willing to die on.

Thing is, I don't think you're wrong on this, but that's just how it is.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

I don't think peak-human serves as a decent reaction time for a guy who can swap hands with supersonic characters and live to tell a tale.

I get it, this wiki wants to be conservative a lot of the time when it comes to a feat like this but... narratively, Endeavor's reaction time should be treated as a supersonic, bare minimum. You don't even need any sort of calculation or blog to confirm that, it's just explicitly shown in the series that he's a threat to multiple characters who are shown to be capable of moving at Mach speeds, even in reaction time. It makes no sense for someone like that to have "peak-human" statistics. At the very least, the shit that Endeavor has showcased throughout the series has put him far above a reaction time of ~80 milliseconds.

Yes, this is a hill I'm willing to die on.

Yeah that’s how I want it to be as well, but if we want to start doing high levels of scaling like that, then we need to get lower levels first that can fit the chain we currently have.
Like how Nagant’s bullets nearly blitzing Izuku’s reaction time we can treat as superhuman because it’s Mach 100 for that time frame, and thus lines up if we add this feat and his other usage of (near) 100% in the Nagant fight.

by other usage I meant the time he jumped from the base floor of a building before Nagant could properly react. The important part about that is because she has a gun attached to her arm and the like (it’s literally her superpower) we can assume she has super Sonic reactions. So the height of the building is likely a skyscraper, and she seems to be near double the tallest building we seen in the shot where she overlooks the entire city blook. This means that the lowest end (150m) middle end (300m) and higher end (450m) could be used.
assuming Nagant as supersonic reaction times and the feat can range anywhere from Mach ~Mach 300 to Mach 770 to Mach 1155.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Thing is, I don't think you're wrong on this, but that's just how it is.

You wanna try calcing this stuff (like the all might dive bomb from the stratosphere) Youre a calc group member so I don’t think you have the same lack of confidence I do, and also your likely smarter so you can fix any mistakes I made

 

[CloverDragon03]

I haven't seen much of the discussion about the feat. What is it? I know it has to do with All Might and clouds

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

I haven't seen much of the discussion about the feat. What is it? I know it has to do with All Might and clouds

All Might dive bombed from above the clouds (which on average are 10.668 km in the sky so we rounded up to 11) and given that Endeavour and Burnin who are superhuman barely reacted, I used peak human for a conservative estimate. This is 137500 m/s or over Mach 400

my second one was using Superhuman for Deku‘s reaction time (should make sense). Because Nagant’s bullet travelled 1km before he could even react properly (even after the first shot), so using 1km and the superhuman reaction of .0291 we get barely over Mach 100.

I’ll talk about my ideas for the skyscraper and him yeting himself at Nagant if you want but the ideas stupid anyways so don’t worry

 

[CloverDragon03]

Okay, give me pics and I'll take a crack at it

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Okay, give me pics and I'll take a crack at it

I’m on my iPad so can’t do pics but you can easily find all might here https://www.viz.com/shonenjump/my-hero-academia-vigilantes-chapter-122/chapter/24156?action=read

The end of chapter 311 of the main manga has Nagant’s bullet blitzing Deku, which moves into 312, me no have subscription to VIZ so can’t get those pics

 

[Earthyboy]

Thing is, I don't think you're wrong on this, but that's just how it is.

What's wrong with having Endeavor's reaction time being supersonic? That's common sense with half of the feats he's able to pull off. Calculations and VS Battle Wiki aside and all, he's blatantly shown to be superior to like, several different people who should be capable of traveling faster than sound.

Simply being conservative and playing it safe doesn't work when you're essentially low-balling what a character is shown to be capable of. Let me paint a picture of how ridiculous a reaction time peak-human Endeavor truly is.

If the speed of sound travels at roughly 340 m/s, Endeavor would've already crossed nearly 30 meters before he's even capable of reacting. At that level of speed, he'd be running into buildings before he would even get the chance to dodge out of the way.

Or, let's recall the time when Endeavor caught Shigaraki's arm MID LUNGE, centimeters before it touches his body...

With his bare ******* fingers... That is the rough equivalent of Endeavor dodging bullets from point-blank range.

For the record, Shigaraki is explicitly stated to be capable of moving faster than the speed of sound. It's just common sense that any degree of reaction time that he'd have would be far more impressive than even 1/1000th of a second.

Yeah, I don't think peak-human reaction time would work...

 

[Gitagon]

Yeah that’s how I want it to be as well, but if we want to start doing high levels of scaling like that, then we need to get lower levels first that can fit the chain we currently have.
Like how Nagant’s bullets nearly blitzing Izuku’s reaction time we can treat as superhuman because it’s Mach 100 for that time frame, and thus lines up if we add this feat and his other usage of (near) 100% in the Nagant fight.

by other usage I meant the time he jumped from the base floor of a building before Nagant could properly react. The important part about that is because she has a gun attached to her arm and the like (it’s literally her superpower) we can assume she has super Sonic reactions. So the height of the building is likely a skyscraper, and she seems to be near double the tallest building we seen in the shot where she overlooks the entire city blook. This means that the lowest end (150m) middle end (300m) and higher end (450m) could be used.
assuming Nagant as supersonic reaction times and the feat can range anywhere from Mach ~Mach 300 to Mach 770 to Mach 1155.

Actually Deku never jumped from the base of that building to blitz Nagant. Wish Horikoshi had explained it in the manga chapters themselves but in the Volume extras for volume 32, he explains how that happened and Deku's entire strategy.

First he threw the clothes/apparatus to at 4 different sides of his smokescreen to attract Nagant right above the building he was attacking from. She had to be at the center to see all 4 sides. Then he got into the building cause even if he just went straight up, she would have spotted him (this at least shows that without multiple distractions, Deku felt it was impossible for him to blitz Nagant).

Then he RAN up the building. This is the part that basically everyone assumes he jumped from the floor of the building with Fa Jin but the Volume extras have him actually running up the stair case and only jumping to burst through the building when he is on the final floor.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Actually Deku never jumped from the base of that building to blitz Nagant. Wish Horikoshi had explained it in the manga chapters themselves but in the Volume extras for volume 32, he explains how that happened and Deku's entire strategy.

First he threw the clothes/apparatus to at 4 different sides of his smokescreen to attract Nagant right above the building he was attacking from. She had to be at the center to see all 4 sides. Then he got into the building cause even if he just went straight up, she would have spotted him (this at least shows that without multiple distractions, Deku felt it was impossible for him to blitz Nagant).

Then he RAN up the building. This is the part that basically everyone assumes he jumped from the floor of the building with Fa Jin but the Volume extras have him actually running up the stair case and only jumping to burst through the building when he is on the final floor.

That would make the speed more impressive then no?
cause he now essentially had to travel the width multiple times and the height (or the total area I guess, me dumb) and then yet himself out.
im thinking of those big stair cases that are on one side and then the other. Me thinks I’ve been playing to much outer worlds

 

[Gitagon]

Here is the extra's translation. I don't know how to post images since Imgur seems to have stopped working for me completely. Anyway, the images are a Google search away.

Deku’s Movements
1. Deku has an advantage over Lady Nagant the closer he is to her! He spreads Smokescreen to its limit and baits her into closing in.

2. He throws decoys in all four directions. From how they were all shot at in the same timing, he now knows that Lady Nagant is in the sky above Smokescreen.

3. He doesn’t know her exact location since he hasn’t confirmed her visually yet! There’s a chance that he can create a blindspot for himself if he jumps up just like that! Even a slight error in orientation can mean the end for him! And that’s why-

Deku: Huh?

4. He enters the building next to Smokescreen and runs up! This way, even if Deku can enter Nagant’s blindspot, there is no chance Nagant can enter Deku’s!

Deku: Wah!
Nagant: Wah!

Every decision Deku made was very strategic. Deku more or less eliminated his own Blindspot while taking advantage of Nagant's Blindspot.

I kinda wish all this was in the actual manga chapter even if Hori employed a narrator.

 

[Earthyboy]

Then he RAN up the building. This is the part that basically everyone assumes he jumped from the floor of the building with Fa Jin but the Volume extras have him actually running up the stair case and only jumping to burst through the building when he is on the final floor.

That's actually pretty impressive, to be honest. In terms of both strategy and speed.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Here is the extra's translation. I don't know how to post images since Imgur seems to have stopped working for me completely. Anyway, the images are a Google search away.

Deku’s Movements
1. Deku has an advantage over Lady Nagant the closer he is to her! He spreads Smokescreen to its limit and baits her into closing in.

2. He throws decoys in all four directions. From how they were all shot at in the same timing, he now knows that Lady Nagant is in the sky above Smokescreen.

3. He doesn’t know her exact location since he hasn’t confirmed her visually yet! There’s a chance that he can create a blindspot for himself if he jumps up just like that! Even a slight error in orientation can mean the end for him! And that’s why-

Deku: Huh?

4. He enters the building next to Smokescreen and runs up! This way, even if Deku can enter Nagant’s blindspot, there is no chance Nagant can enter Deku’s!

Deku: Wah!
Nagant: Wah!

Every decision Deku made was very strategic. Deku more or less eliminated his own Blindspot while taking advantage of Nagant's Blindspot.

I kinda wish all this was in the actual manga chapter even if Hori employed a narrator.

Ah yes, Deku casually outsmarting and outplanning one of the best fighters in his world

 

[Gitagon]

Deku vs Gentle & Deku vs Nagant are definitely 2 of Deku's most strategic fights. Although I do like the "raw" moments of pure rage and spamming 100% to overwhelm opponents, these 2 fights are in my top 5 Deku fights solely cause of how he approached them mentally.

 

[LaserPrecision]

For the record, Shigaraki is explicitly stated to be capable of moving faster than the speed of sound. It's just common sense that any degree of reaction time that he'd have would be far more impressive than even 1/1000th of a second.

I'm pretty sure if someone's speed is explicitly stated, you're allowed to use calcs assuming they have that reaction speed. I saw a profile with a calc that was allowed because their speed was stated:

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:LIFE_OF_KING/Mash_finally_becomes_truly_fast

So if they can do it, you can also do it. It would be hypocrisy for them to deny it.

 

[Metalballrun]

...I don't think there was ever an issue about not being allowed to calculate speed based on speed stated in canon.

In fact as long as there aren't any inconsistencies or outliers, having an explicit stated speed is very helpful in producing more legitimate results.

 

[Earthyboy]

I'm pretty sure if someone's speed is explicitly stated, you're allowed to use calcs assuming they have that reaction speed. I saw a profile with a calc that was allowed because their speed was stated:

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:LIFE_OF_KING/Mash_finally_becomes_truly_fast

So if they can do it, you can also do it. It would be hypocrisy for them to deny it.

That seems to be the case here.

I mean, with Shigaraki being explicitly implied, if not outright shown to generate shock waves with sheer movement... I'd honestly think it'd be hard to argue against Endeavor's reaction time being, for all intents and purposes, supersonic.

 

[Emerald]

So if we use Supersonic reactions for Endeavor, how fast would AM be for blitzing him?

 

[TheRustyOne]

Can you please explain where it was stated that Endeavor wasn't able to react? Peak human reactions is not a decent timeframe whatsoever.

Especially when Endeavor and Tsukauchi reacted to All Might before he hit the ground. Also a slower All Might blitzing Endeavor makes zero sense, when other characters that are slower or on Endeavor's level in terms of speed are keeping up with someone who is equal to Prime All Might in speed.

Regardless, nothing was stated or shown that Endeavor was blitz or couldn't even perceive him. I have no doubt that was faster than him, but not to a blitzing degree.

Someone provide any evidence or facts of a blitz occurring please.

I find it funny that we're saying All Might blitz him, while scaling him to a All Might level character at the same time.

 

[AtomicSekiro]

Endeavor was able to ”sense” All Might parting the clouds but didn’t turn around in the time it took All Might to fly past Endeavor, only turning their heads after All Might flew past.

Is that not blitzing?

 

[TheRustyOne]

Endeavor was able to ”sense” All Might parting the clouds but didn’t turn around in the time it took All Might to fly past Endeavor, only turning their heads after All Might flew past.

Is that not blitzing?

No, not at all. Tsukauchi turned to look at him before he passed Endeavor, guess that means he's faster than Endeavor?

Provide evidence please of him being unable to react. Do you know what the means? Any visual that shows he was trying and failing to react, or a statement that said he was too fast for his eyes to track or something... do you have anything whatsoever besides nothing?

 

[AtomicSekiro]

No, not at all. Tsukauchi turned to look at him before he passed Endeavor, guess that means he's faster than Endeavor?

Provide evidence please of him being unable to react. Do you know what the means? Any visual that shows he was trying and failing to react, or a statement that said he was too fast for his eyes to track or something... do you have anything whatsoever besides nothing?

All Might was able to get to the battle faster than Endeavor could, from several cities away compared to Endeavor’s hundred metres.

Tsukauchi just built different. Or cinematic timing. He’s also further away from a different angle on the ground.

 

[TheRustyOne]

Can you tell me when Endeavor turned his head? You know his head could've been following All Might pass by you know. There is nothing to suggest he couldn't keep up with him. It seems like you're all speculating that he did so this can be a feat or something.

However I do not understand why that would be a blitz. He is clearly reacting to him before he passed him, and is shown looking at him after he passed him. All Might didn't pass him and Endeavor was looking where he use to be. He is clearly following his path.

Actually wait, it looks like he had to move his hand out of All Might's path.

Also my apologies for what I said in the above comment, I'm agitated by something else and didn't mean to take that out on you.

 

[AtomicSekiro]

You’re making the claim, so show me where Endeavor turned his head completely around to view All Might coming.

Endeavor didn’t move his hand out of the way, he’s just reacting to the shockwave that blows his mask off.

 

[TheRustyOne]

You’re making the claim, so show me where Endeavor turned his head completely around to view All Might coming.

Endeavor didn’t move his hand out of the way, he’s just reacting to the shockwave that blows his mask off.

No, you're making the claim that All Might blitz Endeavor. When that wasn't stated, so you need to provide proof of your claim.

I'm asking you to show me where in that picture that shows a blitz. No he isn't reacting to the shockwave, he's looking down at where All Might is at.

I'm sorry but you are wrong here, Endeavor wasn't blitz. A blitz is when someone moves so fast that it's impossible to react to them. This isn't happening in the scan above, nothing showing he can't react to All Might.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Tf did I wake up to

 

[AtomicSekiro]

So we need statements to prove a character was blitzed now?

A blitz is moving faster than someone else to the point they couldn’t keep up or react. All Might crosses several hundred metres after Endeavor sensed him before Endeavor could even turn around.

All Might ran across SEVERAL CITIES before Endeavor could even reach the battle a few metres below him. Lmao.

 

[TheRustyOne]

A blitz is moving faster than someone else to the point they couldn’t keep up or react. All Might crosses several hundred metres after Endeavor sensed him before Endeavor could even turn around.

All Might ran across SEVERAL CITIES before Endeavor could even reach the battle a few metres below him. Lmao.

That doesn't mean a blitz. Where he came from means nothing..

You need to provide evidence, proof that Endeavor couldn't react to him. His movements mean nothing... especially when he was just falling.

He is looking down at All Might as he passes by, and reacts to him before he even passes by him.

We don't need a statement, just facts. Show a panel of him looking up at where All Might was, but in fact he had already past him. Instead we have a panel of him passing Endeavor and Endeavor being blown back by his air pressure. But his eyes still looking at All Might's direction.

Endeavor scales to Shigaraki who is All Might level fast. Yet apparently a slower All Might can blitz him, where is the logic here?

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

So we need statements to prove a character was blitzed now?

A blitz is moving faster than someone else to the point they couldn’t keep up or react. All Might crosses several hundred metres after Endeavor sensed him before Endeavor could even turn around.

All Might ran across SEVERAL CITIES before Endeavor could even reach the battle a few metres below him. Lmao.

I thought we were considering endeavor superhuman for the purposes of this? Like how other heroes didn’t know shit and endeavor was seen to react and burnin (who is right next to him) looks blown entirely off course?

Endeavor scales to Shigaraki who is All Might level fast. Yet apparently a slower All Might can blitz him, where is the logic here?

i thought vigilantes took place like 5 years before the main story? I think that gives us some gap time for speed and strength

 

[TheRustyOne]

i thought vigilantes took place like 5 years before the main story? I think that gives us some gap time for speed and strength

No, Endeavor reached his peak a long time ago.

He had Shoto because he realized he couldn't surpass All Might. Endeavor's stats should be exactly the same.

Also they're arguing Supersonic reactions, not Superhuman with Endeavor. Because he reacted to Shigaraki, who is Supersonic.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

No, Endeavor reached his peak a long time ago.

He had Shoto because he realized he couldn't surpass All Might. Endeavor's stats should be exactly the same.

Also they're arguing Supersonic reactions, not Superhuman with Endeavor. Because he reacted to Shigaraki, who is Supersonic.

O.
I mean you good with using superhuman for endeavor and but peak human for the other heroes? I knew endeavor wasnt blitzed, it’s clearly obvious that even if minuscule to see he has proper reactions. I more thought peak human but most other heroes and even the clones of six, while they don’t really have a mind I think they have basic capability to dodge, didn’t know the **** was going on

 

[TheRustyOne]

I don't know.

Since Number 6 clones are very vague on their speed. Human reactions by itself should be fine I believe. While anything higher is a little iffy for me, I won't complain.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

I don't know.

Since Number 6 clones are very vague on their speed. Human reactions by itself should be fine I believe, but anything higher is a little iffy for me but I won't complain.

I’m mostly saying peak human because the other heroes didn’t know and didn’t seem to react until he had finished his combo

Also how would Nagant’s bullet passing by Deku for most of the fight work? Like her first 1km shot and the next few which made rounds around buildings and stuff so they should still have the same (or a similar) distance. Would superhuman work for that because we know Deku directly says that danger sense is the only thing letting him properly dodge for most of the fight

 

[TheRustyOne]

Also how would Nagant’s bullet passing by Deku for most of the fight work? Like her first 1km shot and the next few which made rounds around buildings and stuff so they should still have the same distance. Would superhuman work for that because we know Deku directly says that danger sense is the only thing letting him properly dodge for most of the fight

Isn't that a low ball? Her bullets shouldn't be any slower than actual sniper shot. Superhuman reactions from that distance would make her shots slower right? Also Izuku started moving a lot, so the distance between them without a doubt changed. I'd have to see a calc first, since I'm not sure.

Also I assume that Izuku is talking about locating the bullets, considering the time of day it is and Danger Sense is the only reason he know they're coming

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Isn't that a low ball? Her bullets shouldn't be any slower than actual sniper shot. Superhuman reactions from that distance would make her shots slower right? Also Izuku started moving a lot, so the distance between them without a doubt changed. I'd have to see a calc first, since I'm not sure.

Also I assume that Izuku is talking about locating the bullets, considering the time of day it is and Danger Sense is the only reason he know they're coming

uuuuuuuuuh, I mostly say that because with superhuman reactions and her first shot (the one even danger sense failed to warn him of) it’d be 1000 meters in the superhuman reaction time frame. But I also have my doubts because it was a surprise attack (we have seen danger sense work with them before, but I’m still iffy)

 

[TheRustyOne]

uuuuuuuuuh, I mostly say that because with superhuman reactions and her first shot (the one even danger sense failed to warn him of) it’d be 1000 meters in the superhuman reaction time frame. But I also have my doubts because it was a surprise attack (we have seen danger sense work with them before, but I’m still iffy)

I believe that Danger Sense didn't activated there, since she wasn't intending to harm him just warn him. However Izuku did state that first shot, had it not been a warning shot, could've taken him down instantly. So basically even with Danger Sense he wouldn't be able to avoid that shot.

Though it being a surprise attack does mean his guard was down, and reaction time does decrease when someone is more "relaxed".

So I don't know.