My Hero Academia General Discussion Thread #18

[Earthyboy]

So how is it that Deku was able to heavily injure Shigaraki with 100% only on his arm if there is this huge difference between these forms? Why he claimed he used everything he had against Shigaraki?

I think it's already been established Deku didn't use "everything he had" against Shigaraki. Otherwise, he would've gone 100% Full Cowling. That would put his reaction time a lot higher than Shigaraki's.

In real life using back and torso muscles will never make your punches hundreds of times stronger, your arguments are ridiculous because the difference in power between feats is simply too big to justify this train of logic.

They don't make your punches hundreds of times stronger because your body isn't accelerating at Mach speeds to do so. If Deku is already punching with several Gigatons worth of force, and then accelerates his body with the same amount of force at Full Cowling 100%, the result is obviously going to be much greater. This is basic physics, this isn't hard to understand.

All Might to this day is still a top tier compared to Nine and Full Cowl 100% Deku from the movie.

Really? Why don't you prove so? The last time I checked, Deku completely tore Shigaraki's jaw off despite the latter easily injuring someone who could tank attacks from someone higher than U.S.J Nomu, AKA, Endeavor.

Muscular got stomped, there's literally no way he'd be Small Country level. Lady Nagant's arm got destroyed when Deku landed a hit on hit so she should not scale either.

Muscular isn't Small Country level, to begin with. He's only comparable to 100% Deku, not Full Cowling 100% Deku. If you're confident in the idea that 100% and 100% Full Cowl are at the same level of strength? Why don't you prove so yourself instead of claiming Therefir's just right?

 

[ÆONS]

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Muscular isn't Small Country level, to begin with. He's only comparable to 100% Deku, not Full Cowling 100% Deku. If you're confident in the idea that 100% and 100% Full Cowl are at the same level of strength? Why don't you prove so yourself instead of claiming Therefir's just right?

I never said/agreed that they were the same level of strength. In fact, I do agree with you that they are completely different in terms of AP. The only thing I claimed is that Shigaraki should, perhaps, scale to Deku/Bakugo's TFA feat simply due to him being a "stronger version" of Nine—which was actually what Therefir said. However, upon further critical reflection, I realized that I missed additional context behind the scaling between them and that my position is likely incorrect. I'll take a neutral stance in this for now until I'm fully confident about it.

Sorry if what I said caused misunderstandings or if I spoke out of turn.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Your entire argument is mut considering Nine himself is but an inferior version of Shigaraki, as both were amped and modified by the same person, Doctor Garaki.

So how is it that Deku was able to heavily injure Shigaraki with 100% only on his arm if there is this huge difference between these forms? Why he claimed he used everything he had against Shigaraki?

In real life using back and torso muscles will never make your punches hundreds of times stronger, your arguments are ridiculous because the difference in power between feats is simply too big to justify this train of logic.

All Might to this day is still a top tier compared to Nine and Full Cowl 100% Deku from the movie.

Except they AREN’T the same scenario.

Nine did not get the same enhancements Shigaraki got. That is clearly shown from his reliance on the tubes, his body itself being weaker, his quirk being different, and that he was the last test subject before Shigaraki. At best you could claim that the tubes he injected himself with were his replacement for the enhancements Shigaraki got, but even then, you would have to prove a lot of things done to Nine were the same as what Shigaraki went through.

Deku can heavily hurt Shigaraki with 100% on his arms but not overcome Nines power because of two reasons.

One, Shigaraki isn’t MEANT to be that strong. The Doctor literally says that he didn’t put as much strength enhancers into Shigaraki to not overburden his brain, something we see happen with Nine when his eyes go white and he loses basically all his thinking other than attack. Shigaraki is INTENTIONALLY not as strong as Prime All Might BECAUSE of Nine, not the other way around.

Two, Nine is flat out stronger with his quirks demonstrably. He’s the last test subject, so logically, he would be the baseline for Shigaraki’s final state. And even then, he doesn’t exactly survive for long, it’s a temporary amp that literally kills him in like 4 minutes. He can temporarily become ridiculously strong, but that’s it, he’s dead after that. The rest of the time? Nine would get stomped by 75% Shigaraki.

If he used everything he had against Shigaraki, why did he not use 100% Full Cowl? Unless your argument is that 45% is the same speed and strength as 100%, which is clearly wrong, there is no reason he shouldn’t have used Full Cowl 100% there. It doesn’t even have to be tier 6, that doesn’t matter. It is stronger than 45% so he should’ve used it if he was really going all out, but he didn’t, so something is simply limiting his usage of it.

Yes, in real life, using your back, torso, hips, legs, EVERYTHING into a punch will increase the force a lot. Will it be by hundreds of times? Of course not.

That’s where the literal fiction aspect comes in. We aren’t talking about a body builder, we’re talking about someone who creates whirlpools with finger flicks. Obviously, for Deku, increasing his base body to 100% would make his punches at 100% ridiculously stronger, because he just went from somewhat normal strength to being able to cleave a city in half.

Name anyone who has compared Nine or FC 100% to All Might.

 

[Earthyboy]

I never said/agreed that they were the same level of strength. In fact, I do agree with you that they are completely different in terms of AP. The only thing I claimed is that Shigaraki should, perhaps, scale to Deku/Bakugo's TFA feat simply due to him being a "stronger version" of Nine—which was actually what Therefir said. However, upon further critical reflection, I realized that I missed additional context behind the scaling between them and that my position is likely incorrect. I'll take a neutral stance in this for now until I'm fully confident about it.

Sorry if what I said caused misunderstandings or if I spoke out of turn.

That's fine I suppose.

 

[Therefir]

I think it's already been established Deku didn't use "everything he had" against Shigaraki. Otherwise, he would've gone 100% Full Cowling. That would put his reaction time a lot higher than Shigaraki's.

Deku didn't use Full Cowl 100% because he isn't an idiot, as using 100% on his entire body will greatly reduce the amount of time he can keep fighting.

They don't make your punches hundreds of times stronger because your body isn't accelerating at Mach speeds to do so. If Deku is already punching with several Gigatons worth of force, and then accelerates his body with the same amount of force at Full Cowling 100%, the result is obviously going to be much greater. This is basic physics, this isn't hard to understand.

Acceleration? Deku and Bakugo performed the Small Country level feat while standing completely still, all they did was raise their arms, what acceleration are you talking about?

Really? Why don't you prove so? The last time I checked, Deku completely tore Shigaraki's jaw off despite the latter easily injuring someone who could tank attacks from someone higher than U.S.J Nomu, AKA, Endeavor.

That's easy to prove, Shigaraki, a superior of version of Nine, was stated that to be as strong as All Might and USJ Nomu, and you can't just the several, if not dozens of times Deku punched Shigaraki, not to mention that a punch hundred times stronger than Shigaraki would have obliterate his body, not just dislocate his jaw.

 

[Therefir]

And now you claim that Dr. Garaki put more power and durability into a mere guinea pig like Nine, than in his perfect, final masterpiece which is AFO Shigaraki? It's hard to take that seriously, considering Shigaraki went through hell to withstand Doctor Garaki's medical surgery, all that just to make him as powerful as All Might.

 

[TheRustyOne]

Full Cowl does not make you massively stronger than a normal use in a single arm. "Shigaraki now possess All For One... and One For All is a power passed down for the sole purpose of beating All For One! He has to go down here! Now's the moment to let it all out! Everything that One For All has to offer! No matter what happens to me!"

Guess he's just lying to himself, and that Horikoshi forgot that Full Cowl is suppose to be massively stronger than a single limb use of OFA?

Izuku sends 100% of OFA's energy into a single limb vs sending 100% of the energy across his entire body. NO extra energy is being created here, the same power he puts into his single limb is the same power he spreads around his entire body. Which means the only difference in energy would be from Izuku's base strength, which is so vastly inferior to 100% that the differences wouldn't matter.

While it's possible that using Full Cowl would make it stronger than a single limb due to how muscles work (Even though it has to be stated in universe for that to be accepted, since Izuku's power comes from fictional Quirk not real life physics), the difference would not be as massive as you're trying to claim it to be.

Izuku uses 100% against Nine in the movie with only one arm, after being blown away he was correct that they needed the power of two OFA to defeat him. Despite not even trying 100% Full Cowl, which means Izuku saw no reason to try because it wouldn't change anything. Which implies Izuku is very knowledgeable about how strong Full Cowl makes him, which means his statement, during the fight with Shigaraki, means Full Cowl is not superior at all to a single limb use of 100%.

Izuku didn't care what would happen to him during that fight, and was filled with rage and was even ready to die to take out Shigaraki. Izuku can use 100% Full Cowl without killing himself, is aware of how strong Full Cowl is, and states he was using everything OFA had to offer.

There is no reason for him to lie or be incorrect in this moment and there is nothing in universe to suggest why he'd say that if it wasn't true. In order to stand against that you need to provide clear evidence against it. Not vague assumptions based on the AOE of feats which mean almost nothing by themselves, especially when said feat come from secondary canon. Izuku clearly states, no vagueness, that he was using the Full Power of OFA at that moment. Regardless of what happens to him.

I will not be reading any further comments on this thread until the next chapter releases. So do not take any offense when I do not respond, there are situations going on that make it difficult for me to focus on this forum. I'll try to respond to anyone later, though if you've already come to an agreement I will not bring this up regardless of the outcome.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Deku didn't use Full Cowl 100% because he isn't an idiot, as using 100% on his entire body will greatly reduce the amount of time he can keep fighting.

Acceleration? Deku and Bakugo performed the Small Country level feat while standing completely still, all they did was raise their arms, what acceleration are you talking about?

That's easy to prove, Shigaraki, a superior of version of Nine, was stated that to be as strong as All Might and USJ Nomu, and you can't just the several, if not dozens of times Deku punched Shigaraki, not to mention that a punch hundred times stronger than Shigaraki would have obliterate his body, not just dislocate his jaw.

So now you’re claiming it’s a time thing? It’s if 45% with 100% spam isn’t ALSO a timed state? There is 0 reasons for him to not go full Cowl 100% there since he, as you yourself have stated, DID NOT CARE.

Shigaraki being superior to Nine is true excepting the tubes. Which Nine broke to gain the power he got. Nine is incredibly inferior to Shigaraki in every way except strength after his tubes are broken.

And now you claim that Dr. Garaki put more power into a mere guinea pig like Nine, than in his final, perfect masterpiece which is AFO Shigaraki? It's hard to take that seriously.

You mean the super tubes that keep him alive and pump him full of stat enhancements? Vs Shigaraki who is directly stated to NOT have the max stat enhancements specifically because of the tax they would take on his brain? Are you attempting to claim Garaki would rather have someone at Nine’s level for 5 minutes then dies as a leader rather than someone at beyond USJ Nomu level with perfect mastery of AFO and all the quirks?

His masterpiece isn’t just based on strength, they’re based on destroying society. Nine would never accomplish that dream, he was fodder to see how far the AFO fusing and strength could go at best, at worst he was a dump for whatever Garaki wanted to see would stick for Shigaraki with an emergency button to kill people then die minutes after.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Will be responding soon, lot to type apparently.

 

[Earthyboy]

Deku didn't use Full Cowl 100% because he isn't an idiot, as using 100% on his entire body will greatly reduce the amount of time he can keep fighting.

Okay, then that would technically mean Deku's wrong here. He's not using everything he has. Even if it's just for the sake of his safety, (as far gone as it was at that point).

Acceleration? Deku and Bakugo performed the Small Country level feat while standing completely still, all they did was raise their arms, what acceleration are you talking about?

Do you not know what I was talking about? I wasn't referring to acceleration in terms of running, I'm talking about acceleration in terms of their body movement. They obviously did way more than move their arms. You can clearly see how they raised their back to maximize the amount of force they'd produce.

That's easy to prove, Shigaraki, a superior of version of Nine, was stated that to be as strong as All Might and USJ Nomu, and you can't just the several, if not dozens of times Deku punched Shigaraki, not to mention that a punch hundred times stronger than Shigaraki would have obliterate his body, not just dislocate his jaw.

That literally doesn't prove shit. Shigaraki's stronger than All Might and the U.S.J Nomu, sure, but that wouldn't make All Might superior to 100% Full Cowl Deku. Not in the slightest bit.

And the only reason Shigaraki's jaw wasn't dislocated was that it wasn't even a direct hit. Deku could've hit Shigaraki directly in the head, and it probably would've been way more effective. And you're forgetting that this is only Deku's 100%, which isn't on the level of 100% Full Cowl. I thought we already proved this to you?

Full Cowl does not make you massively stronger than a normal use in a single arm. "Shigaraki now possess All For One... and One For All is a power passed down for the sole purpose of beating All For One! He has to go down here! Now's the moment to let it all out! Everything that One For All has to offer! No matter what happens to me!"

Guess he's just lying to himself, and that Horikoshi forgot that Full Cowl is suppose to be massively stronger than a single limb use of OFA?

He's not lying per see, it's just that he's using everything he's capable of using that wouldn't immediately kill him most likely. The fact remains that he still could've used Full Cowling 100%, and didn't. Proving that he really wasn't at max power.

Izuku sends 5% of OFA's energy into a single limb vs sending the 5% energy across his entire body. NO extra energy is being created here, the same power he puts into his single limb is the same power he spreads around his entire body. Which means the only difference in energy would be from Izuku's base strength, which is so vastly inferior to 100% that the differences wouldn't matter.

That's not the argument Rusty. No one is claiming Full Cowl gives Deku a stat boost due to extra energy. What I and Wolves are trying to say is that Deku receives a stat boost in 100% Full Cowl because he can use more of his muscle groups to accelerate his mass and generate more force/power. That's just how basics physics work.

If we're wrong? Why don't you disprove something which is backed up by scientists and boxers all around the world.

Izuku uses 100% against Nine in the movie with only one arm, after being blown away he was correct that they needed the power of two OFA to defeat him. Despite not even trying 100% Full Cowl, which means Izuku saw no reason to try because it wouldn't change anything. Which implies Izuku is very knowledgeable about how strong Full Cowl makes him, which means his statement, during the fight with Shigaraki, means Full Cowl is not superior at all to a single limb use of 100%.

Funny, because that would imply that Full Cowling 100% is far stronger then Deku's regular 100%. Even Full Cowling 100% would've done something to Nine's storm, even if it was only temporary. 100% did almost jack-shit.

There is no reason for him to lie or be incorrect in this moment and there is nothing in universe to suggest why he'd say that if it wasn't true. In order to stand against that you need to provide clear evidence against it. Not vague assumptions based on the AOE of feats which mean almost nothing by themselves, especially when said feat come from secondary canon. Izuku clearly states, no vagueness, that he was using the Full Power of OFA at that moment. Regardless of what happens to him.

True, there is no reason for Deku to lie here, but you still have evidence suggesting that he's wrong. Whether you want to accept it or not, Deku is not going all out against Shigaraki. He's not using Full Cowling 100%, simple as that. Unless we're saying Full Cowling 100% is weaker than 100%? You're wrong.

 

[Damage3245]

Funny, because that would imply that Full Cowling 100% is far stronger then Deku's regular 100%. Even Full Cowling 100% would've done something to Nine's storm, even if it was only temporary. 100% did almost jack-shit.

How do you get that from what Rusty said?

 

[Gitagon]

Funny thing is that Deku has only used Full Cowl 100% once but because Heroes Rising used the same design as the anime people labelled that Full Cowl 100% too despite Deku and Bakugo both breaking their arms whenever they used 100% punches.

People's assertions, in this case based on character design, clearly go against what happened in the film.

If Deku & Bakugo were using Full Cowl 100%, their bodies would have broken the same way as their arms did. They would literally become broken meatbags.

Deku cannot use Full Cowl 100%. This is fact. So him using his all against Shigaraki is obviously 45% Full Cowl + 100% punches.

Against Nine, while Katsuma activated their cells, we can't guess the exact boost and it might have allowed them to go further than 50% Full Cowl but again if it was 100% they wouldn't have broken their arms.

 

[Earthyboy]

How do you get that from what Rusty said?

If 100% wasn't even capable of doing anything to Nine's storm, despite it supposedly being comparable to Full Cowling 100%, that would imply that it's a lot weaker than Full Cowling 100%, because even if Deku only scales to half the storm's dispersed, he still would've been able to do something to the storm if 100% and Full Cowling 100% are the same Tiers.

 

[Ultimate_Invader_Pendulum]

hello guys, I've been reading to you from time to time for a while, but I didn't speak because my English isn't perfect, but seeing you arguing lately, I decided that I should speak.

First of all, unfortunately the All might feat is an air pressure feat, not KE's, because in the OFFICIAL databook it is said that it made it rain with an ascending air current.



But please, making keys for anime and movies is not a good idea, first of all, movies are canon for the manga according to Horikoshi himself. If you guys make separate keys it would only help the general misinformation in the fandom, and all for what? just because some don't like movies? Because "They are irrelevant", and? Toru is canon and is more irrelevant. Because "They are not referred to in the manga except with a few panels" and? Mention the last time Gentle Criminal was mentioned in more than one panel.

So what ? Why change something so important for such superfluous complaints ? The canon of MHA is in the hands of horikoshi, not the fandom.

BUT, I understand the idea that some of the feats in the movies can be considered outliers, and there is nothing wrong with doubting the power with which they are represented. But that is the point, that something has a couple of outliers does not make the whole product something non-canon.

Personally I think that most of the feats in the movies are usable, but those that look very out of place should have lower priority than the ones in the manga. Because the manga comes from the hand of horikoshi himself, while the movies are something drawn by someone else but with the approval of horikoshi.

For example, Nine must have had holes in his hands according to Horikoshi's designs, but those who animated the film did not put it that way.

 

[Gitagon]

I think the "ascending air current" is followed by "according to one theory" which implies there's more theories on how exactly he changes the weather with raw super-strength.

Anyway I'm not arguing for or against it, just pointing that out.

 

[Gitagon]

And the anime itself even forgot AFO's stigmata holes in Kamino so it's not the movies alone that are inconsistent.

 

[Earthyboy]

hello guys, I've been reading to you from time to time for a while, but I didn't speak because my English isn't perfect, but seeing you arguing lately, I decided that I should speak.

First of all, unfortunately the All might feat is an air pressure feat, not KE's, because in the OFFICIAL databook it is said that it made it rain with an ascending air current.

But the problem is that the vortex made the storm spin, implying he somehow brought the clouds in from a great distance. You could say that he created the clouds, that's fine, but most likely he also brought them in over a large distance thanks to the cyclone he created.

You're pretty much dead accurate on your take about the movies being canon though.

 

[Ultimate_Invader_Pendulum]

But the problem is that the vortex made the storm spin, implying he somehow brought the clouds in from a great distance. You could say that he created the clouds, that's fine, but most likely he also brought them in over a large distance thanks to the cyclone he created.

You're pretty much dead accurate on your take about the movies being canon though.

I understand your point, but until now it seemed that you chose the KE explanation because the anime better showed the process of creating the storm with the vortex while the manga did not, the manga only had the speculation of someone random. But ... Now there is that page of the databook that more directly confirms that speculation, and since the manga does not show clouds being bring up, it should be more reliable, with the priority of the canon being: Manga = Movies> Anime only, i think

 

[Metalballrun]

But please, making keys for anime and movies is not a good idea, first of all, movies are canon for the manga according to Horikoshi himself. If you guys make separate keys it would only help the general misinformation in the fandom, and all for what? just because some don't like movies? Because "They are irrelevant", and? Toru is canon and is more irrelevant. Because "They are not referred to in the manga except with a few panels" and? Mention the last time Gentle Criminal was mentioned in more than one panel.

While nobody is going to separate the manga from the anime movies, these reasonings makes no sense and does not represent the train of thought of why the split was even considered in the first place.

Pretty much most of the users here liked the movies, from what I've seen while interacting with them. So you can cross that out.

"They are irrelevant" in the sense that, being in a separate medium, what happens in the movies, whether huge or small, is irrelevant to what happens in the manga.
Comparing the movies to Toru is the height of false equivalence. She's canonically existing in the main story of the manga. Her irrelevance to the major plot doesn't matter.

Gentle Criminal had an entire arc in the manga. Again, this is another, pardon my language, asinine twist for the reasons the split was brought up.

 

[Gitagon]

Manga > Anime/Movies

Manga always comes first in terms of considerations.

 

[Metalballrun]

Funny thing is that Deku has only used Full Cowl 100% once but because Heroes Rising used the same design as the anime people labelled that Full Cowl 100% too despite Deku and Bakugo both breaking their arms whenever they used 100% punches.

People's assertions, in this case based on character design, clearly go against what happened in the film.

If Deku & Bakugo were using Full Cowl 100%, their bodies would have broken the same way as their arms did. They would literally become broken meatbags.

Deku cannot use Full Cowl 100%. This is fact. So him using his all against Shigaraki is obviously 45% Full Cowl + 100% punches.

Against Nine, while Katsuma activated their cells, we can't guess the exact boost and it might have allowed them to go further than 50% Full Cowl but again if it was 100% they wouldn't have broken their arms.

I was going to bring this up lol

Can Deku even use Full Cowl 100% without Eri's help? Did Deku use Full Cowl 100% during the fight with Nine?

This has always been a really big question for me. Because if Deku did, then he could've used it against Shigaraki in the War Arc. The fight against Nine was still considerably long with Deku supposedly using 100% with his whole body. It wasn't much shorter compared to the fight against Shigaraki.

Deku being able to use Full Cowl 100% without destroying the rest of his body, like his legs for movement, was always really sus for me, IMO.

Deku explicitly needed Eri's help to use Full Cowl 100%, because every single movement of his is going to **** up his body. Since, you know, he's using 100% throughout his entire body. Yet not only was this disregarded in Heroes: Rising, but Bakugo did it too!

There's no indication that Deku can do the same in the manga.

 

[Earthyboy]

I understand your point, but until now it seemed that you chose the KE explanation because the anime better showed the process of creating the storm with the vortex while the manga did not, the manga only had the speculation of someone random. But ... Now there is that page of the databook that more directly confirms that speculation, and since the manga does not show clouds being bring up, it should be more reliable, with the priority of the canon being: Manga = Movies> Anime only, i think

Problem with your logic; the manga doesn't contradict anything shown in the anime rendition of the feat. We only know that All Might created the clouds in the manga, there's nothing proving he didn't bring them in upon creation. And the anime implies he actually moved them.

The logic of the manga being more reliable than the anime only applies when the anime specifically contradicts things shown in the manga. In this case? It doesn't.

 

[Earthyboy]

Also, after recalculating the feat, because Therefir pointed out some errors, the Double Detroit Smash is still within the Mountain level range. Exactly 910 Megatons or so for both Deku and All Might individually. And I stuck to Therefir's methods too.

I don't think this is going to be lower than anything below 200 Megatons, at the very least.

 

[Spinoirr]

Huh looks like mountain level is actually consistent

 

[Earthyboy]

Huh looks like mountain level is actually consistent

That's what I've been telling people for hours.

 

[Therefir]

Problem with your logic; the manga doesn't contradict anything shown in the anime rendition of the feat. We only know that All Might created the clouds in the manga, there's nothing proving he didn't bring them in upon creation. And the anime implies he actually moved them.

But in the manga it's clearly stated that All Might made these storms with a rising air current, just like in real life, which obviously contradicts your calculation and what you assume happens in the anime.

And if you think about it, it's impossible to create a storm out of cirrus and cumulus clouds, and there's no evidence that a random storm was waiting just over the horizon for All Might to pull it.

 

[Therefir]

Also, All Might's storm having a vortex in the anime is not even a justification for KE, since storms in real life can also have vortexes, and that doesn't mean they were created through kinetic energy.

 

[Ultimate_Invader_Pendulum]

Hey guys, i made a bnha thread about Kaminari, Kirishima and Rappa... and Nine i guess, please check out

 

[AtomicSekiro]

Katsuma boosted Deku and Bakugo to be able to handle Full Cowl 100%. It’s possible they weren’t going all out with every little action tho, and only using full power when they striked.

Being at 100% doesn’t mean he can’t also pull his punches. That’s how i see Overhaul not getting melted along with the city below him when Deku punched downwards. And Muscular also said he can be at 100% but still be “weaker than before” because, ouchies, muscles hurt.

 

[Metalballrun]

Katsuma boosted Deku and Bakugo to be able to handle Full Cowl 100%.

I suppose Katsuma's Quirk was so OP that it boosted Deku and Bakugo enough to use 100% movement without repercussions then. No wonder Nine wanted it.

It’s possible they weren’t going all out with every little action tho, and only using full power when they striked.

So, basically they weren't using 100% with their movement? Then that's not Full Cowl 100% then.

Being at 100% doesn’t mean he can’t also pull his punches. That’s how i see Overhaul not getting melted along with the city below him when Deku punched downwards.

Or maybe Overhaul in his Kaiju form was that durable, which is what we have in his profile. He took the brunt of the force of the attack.
Same reason how Muscular did it when he ate Deku's "1000000%" Delaware Detroit Smash to the face without melting along with the small hill behind him.

Even if it's "pulling back his punches" version of 100%, that is still 100%. And Deku at 100% Full Cowl didn't suffer any injuries aside from when he was attacking.

 

[AtomicSekiro]

Well, if it’s supposedly powerful enough to work on Nine enough to nullify his own overexertion and cells dying, which seems to happen due to his own massively OP quirks and OFA-like strong body, I don’t see why not. Katsuma is apart of the latest generation, quirks are getting more OP by the day.

Deku and Bakugo can be using full cowl at 100% in their entire bodies without going all out with maximum effort with each little movement. How is it not full cowl 100%? It has the eyes, the hair, both are dead ringers for full cowl 100%. The only thing not there is them saying it. You can be using OFA at 100% but not moving your own body with 100% effort. See; All Might. He can tank attacks that only a 100% OFA would tank but them comes back and fights while holding back so his attacks don’t destroy the buildings and nearby people.

Kaijuhaul shouldn’t scale to it in my opinion. Deku went 100% to counteract Eri’s quirk, not to defeat Overhaul. He can still pull his punches while being at a full powered state. Muscular said his second 100% punch was “even weaker than before” because the more your arm breaks, you tend to be able to put less force behind it. Considering “one million percent” happened after he used 100% in his arm to push against an equal force, it was probably massively weaker than even that. And Horikoshi said it was only a battle cry from Deku.

It’s always been shown that Deku’s limbs break after he exerts the force in them. He can turn on 100% in his full body thanks to Katsuma, just enough to handle it, but only uses 100% in his arms when attacking. The rest of his body is probably moving closer at 65% speeds.

 

[AtomicSekiro]

Eri can literally delete people from existence and Katsuma seems to be a similar age. So it‘s not really an outlier to have such a powerful healing/boost quirk.

 

[Metalballrun]

I'm not disagreeing about Katsuma's quirk. But...

Deku and Bakugo can be using full cowl at 100% in their entire bodies without going all out with maximum effort with each little movement.

So Deku can now use Full Cowl 100% without breaking his body then? Because it's not "maximum effort" 100%?
How come he didn't do that in the manga, if that's the case. Was Katsuma's buff only temporary? (I can't remember it).

You can be using OFA at 100% but not moving your own body with 100% effort. See; All Might.

Is it 100% effort or 100% OFA? You gotta be specific here since these things are apparently different according to you, unless I read your comment wrong.

All Might has explicitly said that he doesn't use OFA at 100% all the time. Meaning he uses lower percentages. So are you saying that's what happened with Full Cowl 100% Deku, too?

Kaijuhaul shouldn’t scale to it in my opinion.

Tbh whether or not he scales doesn't matter much since we formerly had his durability at Unknown IIRC.
But it's not too crazy he took the attack because when fusing with Katsukame he also gained his quirk.

Muscular said his second 100% punch was “even weaker than before” because the more your arm breaks, you tend to be able to put less force behind it.

Yes. It still doesn't explain them using 100% without breaking their body. Unless they weren't using 100%, at least not all the time.

It’s always been shown that Deku’s limbs break after he exerts the force in them. He can turn on 100% in his full body thanks to Katsuma, just enough to handle it, but only uses 100% in his arms when attacking. The rest of his body is probably moving closer at 65% speeds.

Exactly, thanks for giving me your actual thoughts about it. I don't think we disagree too much then.

So going by this logic, it means that:

• Deku was at Full Cowling 100%
• But he was only using 100% for his strikes and I assume his durability too.
• He moves at an unknown speed, but not 100% (meaning he couldn't, which means his speed ratings in his profile is wrong)
• He never does any of this ever again (maybe because the effects of Katsuma's quirk were temporary?)

 

[AtomicSekiro]

Current Manga Deku in a fully healthy state replaces the Deku in the war arc. What changes?

 

[BlackeJan]

If 100% wasn't even capable of doing anything to Nine's storm, despite it supposedly being comparable to Full Cowling 100%, that would imply that it's a lot weaker than Full Cowling 100%, because even if Deku only scales to half the storm's dispersed, he still would've been able to do something to the storm if 100% and Full Cowling 100% are the same Tiers.

Woah slow down a bit lol. Deku needed both him and Bakugou to take on Nine

 

[AtomicSekiro]

Is someone assuming that the fire tornados generated around Nine are weaker than the storm generated miles into the sky?

 

[Earthyboy]

But in the manga it's clearly stated that All Might made these storms with a rising air current, just like in real life, which obviously contradicts your calculation and what you assume happens in the anime.

It doesn't contradict anything. I even admitted that All Might created the storm, it's just implied that he brought the storm in. Simple logic.

And if you think about it, it's impossible to create a storm out of cirrus and cumulus clouds, and there's no evidence that a random storm was waiting just over the horizon for All Might to pull it.

Don't take my argument out of context. And no evidence? Do you mean the evidence suggesting in the anime that he somehow moved the clouds over a long distance?

Also, All Might's storm having a vortex in the anime is not even a justification for KE, since storms in real life can also have vortexes, and that doesn't mean they were created through kinetic energy.

That's not the argument here, and I don't even think that's correct. If there wasn't a vortex that was clearly shown to be in the same position with the eye of the storm? Maybe you'd be correct. However, the anime shows us that the vortex moved the storm and made it spin.

I don't know you're so adamant about using Ad Nauseum for this, but there's nothing you can say to downplay this. There's evidence clearly suggesting that even if he created the storms, he would've had to move them with his cyclone via Kinetic Energy.

Woah slow down a bit lol. Deku needed both him and Bakugou to take on Nine

Of course, he needed help to take down Nine, but the point is, if 100% was comparable to 100% Full Cowling, he would've at least done something to Nine's storm. He couldn't even take down the smaller tornado that was terminating from Nine's storm at 100%, he didn't do jack-shit to it.

 

[AtomicSekiro]

At the beginning of chapter 296, is 13 just missing their left arm?

 

[Spinoirr]

Yeah

 

[Ultimate_Invader_Pendulum]

While nobody is going to separate the manga from the anime movies, these reasonings makes no sense and does not represent the train of thought of why the split was even considered in the first place.

Pretty much most of the users here liked the movies, from what I've seen while interacting with them. So you can cross that out.

"They are irrelevant" in the sense that, being in a separate medium, what happens in the movies, whether huge or small, is irrelevant to what happens in the manga.
Comparing the movies to Toru is the height of false equivalence. She's canonically existing in the main story of the manga. Her irrelevance to the major plot doesn't matter.

Gentle Criminal had an entire arc in the manga. Again, this is another, pardon my language, asinine twist for the reasons the split was brought up.

The Gentle example, was simply to highlight that people use the argument of the films never being mentioned in the manga, being that even events of the manga itself as the fight with Gentle, are not mentioned again.

I understand the example of Toru was not really equivalent, sorry.
But I was referring to the fact that people tend to use the fallacious argument that something irrelevant cant be canon.
Outside of that, it could be said that probably the full gauntlet from Two heroes is more relevant than she ever was.

I understand that here most of you liked the movies, but I mean that if it were to happen that separate keys were made, that would help the general misinformation that exists in other parts of the internet by those who did not like the movies.