My armor is cooler than yours - Gilgamesh (Fate) vs Kharn the Betrayer (Warhammer 40K)

[Primaris_Brian]

You did derailed the Thread because range attack is not fair, as I pretty sure will be disqualified if you use bow in karate or taekwondo match.. it not just because it was a form of martial combat then it pass, it wherever his opponet was fair or not.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Remember that Kharn sits at Small-Planet at bare minimal and is more than likely far more powerful and durable than that.

Not going to argue this as a 100% infallible show of power and scale (since the entire fight happens "off page" and this is a different writer), but just in case it might be worth mentioning that the being in possession of the Low 5-B feat, Velthinar, was the subservient to the Warsmith Shon'tu, who was recently slain by an Imperial Fists Captain and his Terminator elite in Fall of Cadia. Kharn on the other hand made a joke out of Azrael, who is not only a Chapter Master, but also one of the most powerful and skilled to ever live.

Again, not saying this is 100% perfect scaling, but it gives an idea of how much stronger Kharn is compared to beings like Velthinar and why the "At least" and "likely higher" are there.

 

[Primaris_Brian]

Azzy I have question on the tyranids thread.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

@NJS

What is it?

 

[Primaris_Brian]

This one.

 

[Cerbus]

My problem is that gilgamesh is at at least with his current large planet and could possibly scale up to solarsystem,but it isn't definate, just like Kharn could probably scale up to multi planetary but it isn't definate. What am I supposed to do with a but they could both be several tiers above their listing argument.

 

[Cerbus]

Sry it's late and I am tired and it's late so I forgot this statement.

Martial combat and melee combat aren't the same thing so you can't just assume every ranged attack will be nullified for unjust fighting and with precog gil knows which ones will and won't be before he even decides to make the attack

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

My problem is that gilgamesh is at at least with his current large planet and could possibly scale up to solarsystem,but it isn't definate, just like Kharn could probably scale up to multi planetary but it isn't definate. What am I supposed to do with a but they could both be several tiers above their listing argument.

Kharn could actually possibly scale up to Solar System level (Eye of Terror Greater Daemon feats), but using both of them as SS level in this thread would be kinda weird.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

I feel like I should clarify something.

Khorne's blessing doesn't nullify all ranged attacks. That would be stupid. If you are mixing range into your up close and personal fighting style or still fighting fair with it, it's fair game. However, trying to play keep away and only using ranged will see them nullified.

The perfect example of this is Khorne completely negating any possibly damage from Kharn taking multiple Baneblade shots to the face from terrified guardsmen trying to kill him before he could get close, but not negating the shots of other Space Marines firing on him while charging in to try and fend him off in combat.

 

[Primaris_Brian]

It won't nullified thing such as whip as I say above how Khorne greaterdaemon still use one. but bow is not malee weapon to begin with. also its what bow do? to trying keep him away using ranged attack?

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Examples of the kinds of things that will or will not be affected:

>shoot arrow at Kharn

>Kharn blocks arrow

>attempt an attack on a potentially vulnerable spot in moment of distraction in order to capitalize on own skill

= completely fine

>shoot arrow at Kharn

>Kharn blocks arrow

>continue trying to keep away and fire arrows while Kharn attempts to close the distance

= arrows have no effect

 

[Cerbus]

What about attacks both in and out of melee gilgamesh isn't known to be scared off of enemies, but does attempt to abuse their weaknesses and kharn's weakness is ranged combat so he would try to draw out a ranged fight as long as possible before entering melee. His SNI tells him exactly when and how to attack in the form of precognition and sight into alternate time lines to instantly know what is the most likely path to vicory as well as tell him all of effects and powers of his opponent has at a glance. Not to mention he has large planet level soul resistence and at least how they are stated definitively higher attack potency a d durability.

Given all of this even with gore child's durability negation through soul manipulation and his massive skill advantage I don't see gilgamesh losing especially because he has anti Imortality weaponry to keep kharn down after he goes down once.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

What about attacks both in and out of melee gilgamesh isn't known to be scared off of enemies, but does attempt to abuse their weaknesses and kharn's weakness is ranged combat so he would try to draw out a ranged fight as long as possible before entering melee.

Kharn's weakness isn't ranged. He just prefers melee, as Khorne views that as the purest and most honorable form of martial skill. He's a perfectly good ranged fighter, should the need arise.

 

[Primaris_Brian]

Alright. but whip should still do it right? or continue trying to keep away with whip while Kharn attempts to close the distance will be nullified too?

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

I mean...it's not like a whip's range is super great to begin with, when some handheld projectiles can travel multiple kilometers without losing power.

 

[Cerbus]

Yes but it's honestly doubtful at least how they are currently stated that any weapon besides Gore child can actually get past gil's large planet durability. His ranged attack is only large continent level and gainst large planet dur it won't even make gilgamesh sweat. Honestly the difference between small planets and large planets is so great that I Don't think any of his weapons besides Gore child would make him flinch without landing an atrocious number of hits and gilgamesh's precog should make up the difference in skill given he is both stronger and likely more mobile(not faster) (kharn's armor looks super bulky).

 

[Primaris_Brian]

Gorechild can ignore dura and soul hax demons in the warp.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Kharn's armor doesn't affect his mobility much. Even your most bare-bones Space Marine can run faster than the human eye can track, and Kharn's reactions should be well within absolute top Space Marine tier, who can perceive and analyze events in nanoseconds.

 

[Cerbus]

Well yes I didn't mean mobile as in speed speed is equalized, I meant mobile as in flexibility in his armor it doesn't look like he can put his arms to his sides or touch his head to the ground by bending backwards it looks very restrictive. Like comparing a guy in plate mail to a guy on cloth even is the guy in plate mail was 10 times stronger and faster the guy in cloth would always be more traditionally mobile.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Oh he definitely can.

Space Marines are genetically modified to use their armour to the absolute fullest effect while still providing maximum protection.

 

[Cerbus]

Ok I will drop mobility, but honestly I haven't seen a good counter to the rest of my points, so I will be chalking this up to counting the votes and calling it quite for me lol.

As far as I can tell there is 2 definitively for gilgamesh Cerbus and corofirmbalance

1 for Kharn not Jim Stirling and many who argued for kharn, but never voiced their opinion of who would win.

 

[Primaris_Brian]

I'm not voting.

 

[Cerbus]

Fair

2 for gilgamesh

0 for kharn

Many undecided or obstaining contributors.

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

I'll vote Kharn for greater skill and experience and hax negation

 

[Sir_Ovens]

Bump.

 

[UserXLII]

Kharn for reasons above.

 

[ScarletFirefly]

Is this thread going anywhere?

 

[Sir_Ovens]

I seem to recall the debate going over whether or not Gil can get past Kharn's anti hax.

 

[ScarletFirefly]

No I mean, it's been over 150 messages and there are barely any votes and the thread was posted almost 4 months ago.

 

[Sir_Ovens]

Well, if it's votes we need then im going with Kharn via Khorne's blessings and way more combat experience.