Mordred Pendragon vs Izuku Midoriya

[AnonymousBlank]

Mystery =/= magecraft. Magecraft has mystery but it is not the same. As mentioned above, Shiki's sword has mystery but the sword isn't going to get cancelled out by MR. If Deku has mystery, and he should seeing as OFA is 100+ years old, has been stockpiling energy and other abilities, and only a handful of people actually know about it and how it works, he can harm Mordred just fine.

 

[Regidian]

Mystery =/= magecraft. Magecraft has mystery but it is not the same. As mentioned above, Shiki's sword has mystery but the sword isn't going to get cancelled out by MR. If Deku has mystery, and he should seeing as OFA is 100+ years old, has been stockpiling energy and other abilities, and only a handful of people actually know about it and how it works, he can harm Mordred just fine.

Magecraft are one category of mystery, but MR allow the resistance to even thing like Mystic eyes that are not Magecraft, pure physical weapon mystery will not be fully resisted (like why excalibur doesn't get cancelled) but ability will be, so his 100% atk will not be cancelled but if use an abily not purely physical it get resisted but he need to use his quick to able to function

 

[Regidian]

But well even whitout that mordred have instinct that allow preco, have Battle continuation that allow her to battle perfectly even if severly damaged and have mana burst that amp her

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Magecraft are one category of mystery, but MR allow the resistance to even thing like Mystic eyes that are not Magecraft, pure physical weapon mystery will not be fully resisted (like why excalibur doesn't get cancelled) but ability will be, so his 100% atk will not be cancelled but if use an abily not purely physical it get resisted but he need to use his quick to able to function

So his punch wouldn't be cancelled but things like his Blackwhip yes? Because if that's the case then they could fight, right?

But well even whitout that mordred have instinct that allow preco, have Battle continuation that allow her to battle perfectly even if severly damaged and have mana burst that amp her

I also though about the mana burst, because the current key say that she is City level with Clarent Blood Arthur and Small City level without it I'm not sure if the amp of mana burst would be enough to fight Izuku 100% that should be City level for a few attack (would need other to say how many attack he could do at 100%).

 

[Regidian]

So his punch wouldn't be cancelled but things like his Blackwhip yes? Because if that's the case then they could fight, right?


I also though about the mana burst, because the current key say that she is City level with Clarent Blood Arthur and Small City level without it I'm not sure if the amp of mana burst would be enough to fight Izuku 100% that should be City level for a few attack (would need other to say how many attack he could do at 100%).

But anyway i don't think we should do duel with servant now as their tier will surely change

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

But anyway i don't think we should do duel with servant now as their tier will surely change

I know and honestly thought about it, but that could be touched later and instead for now focus only in the current fun.

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

I know and honestly thought about it, but that could be touched later and instead for now focus only in the current fun.

For example, the discussion about Izuku affecting servants and so was fun to me and I hope to also others, so talking with how the things are currently shouldn't be bad.

 

[Newendigo]

I don't know why the black whips would be cancelled, is just a weird form of Venom-like energy glue.

 

[BakiHanma18]

Okay, so have any clear win cons been established yet? Mordred’s precog seems like it could present some issues for Deku, and Clarent is an extremely dangerous timebomb, so what’s Deku’s possible means of overcoming those issues?

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Okay, so have any clear win cons been established yet? Mordred’s precog seems like it could present some issues for Deku, and Clarent is an extremely dangerous timebomb, so what’s Deku’s possible means of overcoming those issues?

If I not wrong it's basically defeat her the with the difference of AP before he couldn't continue to fight, with how the current key for Mo-chan (servants in general) she only could equal his 100% with Clarent, the is also the disvantage that Magic Resistance B (not only affect magic but mystic in general) is probably gonna reduce the damage from the attacks of deku (only reduce because they are physical instead of pure energy). With things like that then I think is practically impossible to Deku win, if only Mo-chan didn't have MR the fight will be different.

 

[BakiHanma18]

Okay, if the fight is indeed not viable for Izuku, then its a rip. If someone discovers otherwise, someone hmu and I’ll come back and vote

 

[AnonymousBlank]

Deku has his spidey sense though I dunno how good that is compared to Instinct. He is likely gonna have issues in cqc so he can hang back with his flight and spam air blasts at Mordred if need be. CBA shouldn’t be hard to dodge at range.

MR doesn’t affect mystery, just actual magecraft. You could maybe argue that the air blasts are magecraft but seeing as Deku has a considerable AP advantage he should just be able to overpower it since it’s above MR’s paygrade.

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Deku has his spidey sense though I dunno how good that is compared to Instinct. He is likely gonna have issues in cqc so he can hang back with his flight and spam air blasts at Mordred if need be. CBA shouldn’t be hard to dodge at range.

MR doesn’t affect mystery, just actual magecraft. You could maybe argue that the air blasts are magecraft but seeing as Deku has a considerable AP advantage he should just be able to overpower it since it’s above MR’s paygrade.

If I'm not wrong MR could resist even Authorities. That could indeed be a tactic for Deku, though don't know how powerful are the air blasts (and how much they hurt Deku), the spidey sense I think should be fair to say that counter the instint so they are equal in that, and Clarent it's a big beam so unless the distance it's really big Deku shouldn't be able to evade.

 

[AnonymousBlank]

MR resisting Authorities? That doesn’t sound right at all. Astolfo’s EX MR couldn’t resist Semi’s non Authority Garden blasts, Jeanne’s EX MR amped by her NP was going to be oneshot by Karna’s Brahmastra, Saber’s A Rank MR didn’t do a thing to Cu’s Barbed Spear which is a step below Authority. I’m sure some god tier Servants like Gil has stuff to resist Authority but Mordred definitely should not.

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

MR resisting Authorities? That doesn’t sound right at all. Astolfo’s EX MR couldn’t resist Semi’s non Authority Garden blasts, Jeanne’s EX MR amped by her NP was going to be oneshot by Karna’s Brahmastra, Saber’s A Rank MR didn’t do a thing to Cu’s Barbed Spear which is a step below Authority. I’m sure some god tier Servants like Gil has stuff to resist Authority but Mordred definitely should not.

Didn't watch Apo so not completely sure, but Alstolfo MR is D and it say that it become A rank with his NP Casseur de Logistille, while the garden of Semi is a EX-rank Anti-World NP, Karna it's a servant really powerful and Brahamastra it's was given by the avatar of Vishnu, can't really talk much about the part of Jeanne, but considering all I don't think it's really crazy if she couldn't resist it.

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Magecraft are one category of mystery, but MR allow the resistance to even thing like Mystic eyes that are not Magecraft, pure physical weapon mystery will not be fully resisted (like why excalibur doesn't get cancelled) but ability will be, so his 100% atk will not be cancelled but if use an abily not purely physical it get resisted but he need to use his quick to able to function

You could give concreate example about MR resisting things other than magic? Would help to prove that they resist mystery in general.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Assuming the fight is viable, Mordred’s instinct and Clarent are dealt with by several factors in this fight.

To begin, Deku’s own Analytical prediction + Danger Sense means avoiding attacks and predicting Mordreds own attacks, even when she reacts to his own via instinct. So just hitting him is a difficult thing to do in straight combat. Then you add on his smokescreen quirk, which reduces her visibility. Her instinct will reduce that loss by half, but it’s still a decline in fighting ability for her.

Then you add in Deku’s far higher mobility with flight and swinging around with Black Whip, and even more crucially, the fact that he blows Mordred out of the water in Lifting Strength, so if he gets her with Blackwhip it’s essentially GG unless she manages to release Clarant, which Deku can avoid because Danger Sense will tell him to avoid it.

Cherry on the top is Deku is even stronger than Mordred since he’s baseline 7-B vs her around 2 megatons. So he’s got an around 3x stat advantage.

If the fight is viable, my vote is Deku.

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

The mist can be countered aside from instinct with also partials invocations of Clarent, the mobility with flight it's a point, though with the Agility B of Mo-chan she can do impressive things, also, I have a question, speed is equalized, Deku already begin with 100% so he don't have other amps, right? Because in that case Mo-chan have speed advantage with Mana Burst, honestly don't know how x it's the amp of Mana Burst, and in the case of Mo-chan Mana Burst A, but at minimun with that she have the speed. How much the attacks weaken at enough distance to evade a big beam (that obviously flight at speed of light)? I say because if he is to close then it's gonna hit, but if he is to far then the air pressure from his attack is weaker, right?

 

[Kingofwolves999]

The mist can be countered aside from instinct with also partials invocations of Clarent, the mobility with flight it's a point, though with the Agility B of Mo-chan she can do impressive things, also, I have a question, speed is equalized, Deku already begin with 100% so he don't have other amps, right? Because in that case Mo-chan have speed advantage with Mana Burst, honestly don't know how x it's the amp of Mana Burst, and in the case of Mo-chan Mana Burst A, but at minimun with that she have the speed. How much the attacks weaken at enough distance to evade a big beam (that obviously flight at speed of light)? I say because if he is to close then it's gonna hit, but if he is to far then the air pressure from his attack is weaker, right?

The smoke constantly is coming off of him, such that when he’s using it he himself is obscured, so she can’t just cut it away once and ignore it. Deku can predict her mana bursts with Danger Sense and has trained to predict the movements of characters faster than him already. The fact that her mana burst doesn’t even seem to be a definitive multiplier makes me doubt Deku would be unable to predict and counter her when she uses it. Idk how Agility B effects her acrobatic skills in relation to Deku’s literal flight, especially with speed equal.

When did Clarent become a light speed attack? And where did the assumption his air pressure weakens over distance come from? It’s tens of Kilometers in range with tons of AoE and far more spammable than Clarent it seems?

Deku would be able to avoid Clarent by just backing away the second her Helmet comes off and Danger Sense activates, being able to kick off the air and fly is a big boon for attacks coming his way. Also, what’s stopping him from restraining Mordred with Black Whip the second she tries to use Clarent? Or even during the whole fight? He can create several whips at once, so her being able to counter all of them even with Instinct sounds doubtful to me when combined with his other quirks.

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Magic Resistance resist mystys eyes that aren't magic but isntead eyes with powers, the example it's how they resist the eyes of pretrification of Medusa, so that mean they resist/cancel (depending in the rank) mystic in general, so aside from the physical mystic like the punch of deku, the other quircks are resisted nulled. About Clarent, the problem it's that Clarent equal the Balmung of Siegfried which by the calcs would be Low 6-B (2.9 Teratons), yeah in the case against Fafnir Siegfried is powered because it's fighting against a dragon but Mo-chan have dragon blood so Siegfried also it's powered fighting against her, to point it's that Clarent it's fatal to Deku, even the shockwave in the best case would only left him half-dead, he on top of need to evade the beam itself (which can move while relasing) need to evade the shockwave. About the Mana Burst, my bad there, I only know that there are a amp so I created a thread to see how much it's the amp, and in the case of Mo-chan his Mana Burst turn his rank C Clarent in ran A+ Clarent Blood Arthur, which equal the Balmung of Sieg.

I didn't wanted to say things relationed with the upgrade, but because it's the best way I find to express why Clarent it's so dangerous to Deku it was why I bring that here, currently still haven't be decided to which tier the servants itself would backscale but the definitive thing is that at least the NP are tier 6, so I guess for the moment the only thing tier 6 would Clarent Blood Arthur while Mo-chan itself still is tier 7?

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Magic Resistance resist mystys eyes that aren't magic but isntead eyes with powers, the example it's how they resist the eyes of pretrification of Medusa, so that mean they resist/cancel (depending in the rank) mystic in general, so aside from the physical mystic like the punch of deku, the other quircks are resisted nulled. About Clarent, the problem it's that Clarent equal the Balmung of Siegfried which by the calcs would be Low 6-B (2.9 Teratons), yeah in the case against Fafnir Siegfried is powered because it's fighting against a dragon but Mo-chan have dragon blood so Siegfried also it's powered fighting against her, to point it's that Clarent it's fatal to Deku, even the shockwave in the best case would only left him half-dead, he on top of need to evade the beam itself (which can move while relasing) need to evade the shockwave. About the Mana Burst, my bad there, I only know that there are a amp so I created a thread to see how much it's the amp, and in the case of Mo-chan his Mana Burst turn his rank C Clarent in ran A+ Clarent Blood Arthur, which equal the Balmung of Sieg.

I didn't wanted to say things relationed with the upgrade, but because it's the best way I find to express why Clarent it's so dangerous to Deku it was why I bring that here, currently still haven't be decided to which tier the servants itself would backscale but the definitive thing is that at least the NP are tier 6, so I guess for the moment the only thing tier 6 would Clarent Blood Arthur while Mo-chan itself still is tier 7?

So your entire argument is "Clarent is Tier 6"?

You realize that not only would that mean Clarent can just be restricted due to being a tier changing ability, but that it doesn't even address any of my arguments about how Deku can not only avoid Clarent, but just force her to not use it in the first place? Like Blackwhip restraining her because the Lifting Strength difference is astronomical?

 

[Regidian]

So your entire argument is "Clarent is Tier 6"?

You realize that not only would that mean Clarent can just be restricted due to being a tier changing ability, but that it doesn't even address any of my arguments about how Deku can not only avoid Clarent, but just force her to not use it in the first place? Like Blackwhip restraining her because the Lifting Strength difference is astronomical?

What is blackwhip? And how he would avoid an aoe clarent With mana burst she more quick than him and instinct would alredy show her where he go to avoid it

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

What is blackwhip? And how he would avoid an aoe clarent?

'This Quirk gives Izuku the ability to create tendrils of dark energy from his body and control them at will. This Quirk has grown substantially stronger since its original users time with it due to the stockpiling power of One For All. It can be used to capture enemies and increase maneuverability by grabbing on to objects. Izuku is also able to wrap tendrils around his forearm as a sort of recoil buffer to counter the enormous power of his 100% attacks'.

And the aoe seems like because he can fly.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

What is blackwhip? And how he would avoid an aoe clarent With mana burst she more quick than him and instinct would alredy show her where he go to avoid it

Blackwhip is the controllable tendrils of energy he summons to restrain people. They’re one of the quirks he has in One For All, and he has beyond Class M Lifting Strength. He can summon them from any part of his body and they can curve to follow his directions.

You mean the Mana Burst and Instinct that are countered by his own Danger Sense and prediction abilities? How good even is Mordred’s prediction with Instinct? From what I’m reading, the best it’s done is halve visibility penalties, which is useful for his Smokescreen quirk, but doesn’t seem to let her see into the Future like Artoria’s instinct does.

 

[Regidian]

'This Quirk gives Izuku the ability to create tendrils of dark energy from his body and control them at will. This Quirk has grown substantially stronger since its original users time with it due to the stockpiling power of One For All. It can be used to capture enemies and increase maneuverability by grabbing on to objects. Izuku is also able to wrap tendrils around his forearm as a sort of recoil buffer to counter the enormous power of his 100% attacks'.

And the aoe seems like because he can fly.

Then this quirck will be resisted, i don't even know why in first people think that MR is resistance to magecraft when it's resistance to supernatural power litteraly why power from beast/ESP/mystic eyes can be resisted whitout being magecraft.


For the aoe many servant can flight and she can like send her clarent to the sky or just litteraly approach him and use it in ploint blank.

 

[Regidian]

Blackwhip is the controllable tendrils of energy he summons to restrain people. They’re one of the quirks he has in One For All, and he has beyond Class M Lifting Strength. He can summon them from any part of his body and they can curve to follow his directions.

You mean the Mana Burst and Instinct that are countered by his own Danger Sense and prediction abilities? How good even is Mordred’s prediction with Instinct? From what I’m reading, the best it’s done is halve visibility penalties, which is useful for his Smokescreen quirk, but doesn’t seem to let her see into the Future like Artoria’s instinct does.

Smoking screen will be litteraly just do nothing, every servant have enhanced sense and don't need to see for fight and they mostly fight by sensing soul

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Then this quirck will be resisted, i don't even know why in first people think that MR is resistance to magecraft when it's resistance to supernatural power litteraly why power from beast/ESP/mystic eyes can be resisted whitout being magecraft.


For the aoe many servant can flight and she can like send her clarent to the sky or just litteraly approach him and use it in ploint blank.

If it’s being resisted then the fight is irrelevant because all his abilities are resisted due to low mystery. The entire premise of my arguments is the assumption that the fight can happen in the first place.

Mordred cannot fly, what? And how would sending it at him do anything if he predicts it? And being in close range just means she gets caught with Blackwhip the second her helmet comes off and she tries to use Clarent.

 

[Popted2]

question what they can do? what are their powers?

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Smoking screen will be litteraly just do nothing, every servant have enhanced sense and don't need to see for fight and they mostly fight by sensing soul

I literally said that her instinct counters his smokescreen alresdy

 

[Regidian]

Blackwhip is the controllable tendrils of energy he summons to restrain people. They’re one of the quirks he has in One For All, and he has beyond Class M Lifting Strength. He can summon them from any part of his body and they can curve to follow his directions.

You mean the Mana Burst and Instinct that are countered by his own Danger Sense and prediction abilities? How good even is Mordred’s prediction with Instinct? From what I’m reading, the best it’s done is halve visibility penalties, which is useful for his Smokescreen quirk, but doesn’t seem to let her see into the Future like Artoria’s instinct does.

For instincts the rank add thing to the original purpose and the original purpose is this.

Instinct is the ability to instantly identify “the best personal course of action” during combat. Because this Skill allows for the prediction of trajectory, it is possible to avoid attacks from firearms

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Can someone answer me on how good Mordred’s instinct even is? Because it is not Artoria’s instinct that lets her nearly see the future. What feats does Mordred have for instinct that put her in the same wheelhouse as Deku?

For instincts the rank add thing to the original purpose and the original purpose is this.

Instinct is the ability to instantly identify “the best personal course of action” during combat. Because this Skill allows for the prediction of trajectory, it is possible to avoid attacks from firearms

This tells me nothing of her feats with it. For instance, how would she escape a situation where Deku is grabbing her with multiple, controllable tendrils with far higher statistics than her? Or even if he just tries to take her sword away from her?

 

[Regidian]

If it’s being resisted then the fight is irrelevant because all his abilities are resisted due to low mystery. The entire premise of my arguments is the assumption that the fight can happen in the first place.

Mordred cannot fly, what? And how would sending it at him do anything if he predicts it? And being in close range just means she gets caught with Blackwhip the second her helmet comes off and she tries to use Clarent.

She don't need to flight, (i have tell that servant are capable lf fighting servznt that can fight and have preco) she can jump and with arturia we know that servant can jump up to 4km, they have just more problem with changing direction in.

Bevause he prediction is like very basic? It's just sensing danged, modred being rank B mean she above 3 rank normal preco in fate. How she will get caught first if she more fast than him?

 

[Regidian]

If you want a thing instinct ranked C do that

Saint George typically uses this ability to vaguely divine the intent of an opponent so as to determine whether engagement is an appropriate course of action, or if the opponent is an "enemy that must be fought."[

 

[Kingofwolves999]

She don't need to flight, (i have tell that servant are capable lf fighting servznt that can fight and have preco) she can jump and with arturia we know that servant can jump up to 4km, they have just more problem with changing direction in.

Bevause he prediction is like very basic? It's just sensing danged, modred being rank B mean she above 3 rank normal preco in fate. How she will get caught first if she more fast than him?

Basic? Being able to sense danger, as well as the direction of that danger, letting him avoid attacks, is good enough to avoid literally anything Mordred throws at him. Also, that isn’t even where the majority of his prediction comes from, so much as it comes from his Analytical Prediction, that lets him predict the moves of characters faster than him. I feel you haven’t read his profile if you’re assuming he just has Danger Sense when it comes to avoiding attacks on top of his flight. Deku uses his prediction to do things like analyze the precise location of invisible air barriers to bounce air pressure off of and snipe someone through 2 additional layers of barriers.

Not being able to change direction during a jump against someone with true flight and 3x your stats sounds terrible.

I highly doubt that’s how stats in Fate work. Just cause she has rank B doesn’t mean she “has 3x normal level precog.” I don’t even know how you would quantify that.

That description of C rank instinct just makes me doubt the power of Mordred’s rank B. That version of instinct from George just sounds like a severely worse version of Danger Sense, so why would Mordred be able to overwhelm Deku when he has that + his own feats of prediction and analysis?

 

[AnonymousBlank]

Artoria jumping 4km is from Ataraxia with a Command Seal amp. Normal Setvants do not do that.

 

[Regidian]

Artoria jumping 4km is from Ataraxia with a Command Seal amp. Normal Setvants do not do that.

It was litteraly described at her using her veirtable power as she mega weak with shirou

 

[AnonymousBlank]

Command Seal amp makes it unusable. She wants to jump there, Shirou tells her to jump there, they agree so the CS amped her while making that jump.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

If she jumps at him, he dodges easily because he has actual True Flight and she gets grabbed with Blackwhip then ragdolled.

 

[Regidian]

Basic? Being able to sense danger, as well as the direction of that danger, letting him avoid attacks, is good enough to avoid literally anything Mordred throws at him. Also, that isn’t even where the majority of his prediction comes from, so much as it comes from his Analytical Prediction, that lets him predict the moves of characters faster than him. I feel you haven’t read his profile if you’re assuming he just has Danger Sense when it comes to avoiding attacks on top of his flight. Deku uses his prediction to do things like analyze the precise location of invisible air barriers to bounce air pressure off of and snipe someone through 2 additional layers of barriers.

Not being able to change direction during a jump against someone with true flight and 3x your stats sounds terrible.

I highly doubt that’s how stats in Fate work. Just cause she has rank B doesn’t mean she “has 3x normal level precog.” I don’t even know how you would quantify that.

That description of C rank instinct just makes me doubt the power of Mordred’s rank B. That version of instinct from George just sounds like a severely worse version of Danger Sense, so why would Mordred be able to overwhelm Deku when he has that + his own feats of prediction and analysis?

It's not as good she can dodge the arrow and atk while fighting ither servant from chiron who have clairvoyance and true eye mind

 

[Regidian]

Command Seal amp makes it unusable. She wants to jump there, Shirou tells her to jump there, they agree so the CS amped her while making that jump.

The CS only allow boost of magical energy, litteraly by the two that this boost have inly allow arturia to have the energy she should have normaly