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Monkey D. Luffy vs Madara Uchiha

CiscoTheSoto

CiscoTheSoto

3,704
2,332
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Luffy's AP: 39.8 gigatons in base, higher in Gear 2, 477.6 gigatons with Gear 3 or Gear 4: Snakeman, higher in Gear 4: Boundman, 1.9 teratons with Strongest attacks

Luffy's Speed: Higher than .33c with .57c reactions, at least .57c reactions with Gear 2 or Soru, far higher with Gear 4: Boundman and Gear 4: Snakeman

Luffy's LS: At least 9.05e+13 kg in base (Class T), higher with Gear 4

Madara's AP: Higher than 2.65 gigatons in base, varies with different levels of Susanoo, ~1 Teraton with Perfect Susanoo, 643.41 gigatons with Kurama

Madara's Speed: Higher than .32c, Higher than .32c with Kurama

Madara's LS: 3.93e+11 kg in base (Class G), Higher than 6.97e+14 kg with Perfect Susanoo (Class T)
 
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Madara rarely uses genjutsu in his fights. He's the kind of person who enjoys the fight and likes to prolong the battle, and he only uses it to deal with lower-level opponents. Besides, Luffy has resistance to mind manipulation, so he could possibly resist Madara's genjutsu. Not saying it's a guarantee, but still.
 
azontr said:
Genjutsu is layered.
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My other point still stands. Madara isn't like Sasuke, who uses genjutsu much more often in combat after getting the Mangekyo Sharingan. Besides, with speed unequalized, it'd be harder for Madara to make eye contact with Luffy. I'd like to hear the arguments other than Genjutsu GG.
 
He used it against A when their eyes met, and I don't see Luffy beating an armored Kurama before that comes to pass.
 
Kidkinsey said:
not on madaras level especially if he uses his MS
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Superior willpower counts as a layer in OP, as higher willpower allows you to resist abilities that affected those with inferior willpower

Post WCI Luffy's Willpower > Luffy's middle of training Willpower > Marineford Luffy Haoshoku awakening Willpower > Thriller Bark no Hao Willpower > Other Straw Hats Willpower > Cindry's Willpower > Moria's Kage Kage no Mi ~ Baseline Resistance

So yeah, it's on Madara's level if not higher
 
Besides Genjutsu, let's look at the advantages and disadvantages of both characters, since nobody's brought them up.

Madara has much higher AP with the Full Body Armor Susanoo and Full-power Kurama at his control. If he chooses to use the Majestic Attire: Susanoo to combine their strength, Luffy's gonna be in serious trouble, since it would be higher than 1 Teraton in AP. His Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan could also come in handy to read Luffy's movements and predict his actions. He has the ability to use all five nature transformations, clones, substitution jutsu, and many other jutsu. As already mentioned, Madara has Kurama at his disposal, and he can use Kurama to fire many tailed beast bombs or potentially even just pin Luffy down to the ground.

Luffy's got a significant speed advantage, and combined with his ability to see into the future, would allow him to evade several of Madara's attacks. His Gear 4 gives him increased mobility, the ability to increase the power and speed of his attacks with Snakeman. I think Luffy's biggest advantage in this battle is using his strongest attacks like the King Kong Gun: if he uses it, even Madara combining the Susanoo with Kurama's power probably wouldn't be enough to protect himself, since it's almost twice as strong as his AP.
 
LIFE_OF_KING said:
That doesn't prove a better layer. Layers is the number of times that a hax can pass a resistant. If Hax X passes resistance X, the Hax has two layers, something that does not happen in OP.
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as higher willpower allows you to resist abilities that affected those with inferior willpower
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You aren't comprehending what I'm saying.

Having even above average willpower makes it to where you have a resistance (which is why like 80% of the characters have resistances on their profiles).

These resistances get overpowered when the victim has less willpower than what their enemy is capable of negating.

This is why when Luffy was resisting the mind and madness of the shadows
It had been stated that if one have a weak willpower when taking in shadows, then they would have lost their mind and the power would be wasted. This is further supported when the Thriller Bark people have to ask Luffy if can control his mind or confirm that he still knows who he is
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they pretty much say that there's a limit based on willpower. Someone who can take 2 can't take 3 cause of willpower, and someone who can take 3 can't take 4 because of willpower, and so on.

Luffy's willpower scales above itself in previous versions, which would follow this mechanic to where superior willpower makes it to where it counts as a layer above the previous version who has a resistance.
 
Luffy, because Madara is said to be dead on his profile lmfaooo

But uh, seriously. How far does his water manip go? He might be able to incapacitate Luffy for a second and beat the hell out of him. If not luffy might win due to superior AP iirc, plus he can beat people in multiple critical spots at once.
 
Oh wait, can't Madara turn into Kaidou with shapeshifting? I don't watch the series he's from but if so it just becomes this:
 
It's the Doffy case with "more strings mean a 1 string value multiplier" except with willpower resistance.
Baseline resistance= 2/3 shadows
Luffy's resistance= 100 shadows>>>>>>>>>>>>>(a whole lot) baseline mind/madness manip resistance>2 shadows
 
KingTempest said:
they pretty much say that there's a limit based on willpower. Someone who can take 2 can't take 3 cause of willpower, and someone who can take 3 can't take 4 because of willpower, and so on.

Luffy's willpower scales above itself in previous versions, which would follow this mechanic to where superior willpower makes it to where it counts as a layer above the previous version who has a resistance.
Click to expand...
Or basically that, yes
 
CiscoTheSoto said:
Besides Genjutsu, let's look at the advantages and disadvantages of both characters, since nobody's brought them up.

Madara has much higher AP with the Full Body Armor Susanoo and Full-power Kurama at his control. If he chooses to use the Majestic Attire: Susanoo to combine their strength, Luffy's gonna be in serious trouble, since it would be higher than 1 Teraton in AP. His Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan could also come in handy to read Luffy's movements and predict his actions. He has the ability to use all five nature transformations, clones, substitution jutsu, and many other jutsu. As already mentioned, Madara has Kurama at his disposal, and he can use Kurama to fire many tailed beast bombs or potentially even just pin Luffy down to the ground.

Luffy's got a significant speed advantage, and combined with his ability to see into the future, would allow him to evade several of Madara's attacks. His Gear 4 gives him increased mobility, the ability to increase the power and speed of his attacks with Snakeman. I think Luffy's biggest advantage in this battle is using his strongest attacks like the King Kong Gun: if he uses it, even Madara combining the Susanoo with Kurama's power probably wouldn't be enough to protect himself, since it's almost twice as strong as his AP.
Click to expand...
The EMS shouldn't have the capabilities to predict Luffy's rubber movements. Its best feats are regular combat and normal taijutsu techniques, shouldn't assume it stretches out to some shit like a dude stretching his limbs in difficult to predict directions.

Wood style's getting broken through with rhino schnieders and leo bazookas. Might headbutt through them you never know.
Fire style's getting resisted.
Madara has the capabilities of using 5 nature transformations but he doesn't know jutsu for more than fire other than wood style.
Clones are out of character when he's doing 1v1s, especially when he's in Susanoo.

Bijuudamas are getting reflected by Luffy's physiology, so unless he wants to shit himself by accident, I don't advise it.

Even in Susanoo that man has never used substitution jutsu. That's non existent.
On top of that he doesn't have his sage mode sensing so this is an issue as well.

Snakeman gets a speed amp but it's not that strong, so Luffy wouldn't dare use it on the Susanoo.
 
KingTempest said:
Wood style's getting broken through with rhino schnieders and leo bazookas. Might headbutt through them you never know.
Click to expand...
Alive Madara doesn't have wood style. It's only Edo Tensei Madara that has wood style.
KingTempest said:
Bijuudamas are getting reflected by Luffy's physiology, so unless he wants to shit himself by accident, I don't advise it.
Click to expand...
Can Luffy reflect energy attacks with his rubber body? I thought that was only with cannonballs, though I could very well be wrong.
 
CiscoTheSoto said:
Alive Madara doesn't have wood style. It's only Edo Tensei Madara that has wood style.

Can Luffy reflect energy attacks with his rubber body? I thought that was only with cannonballs, though I could very well be wrong.
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Perhaps not his body but he reflected a bolo breath by.. Oh wait he's not gear fifth here lol. Yeah I dunno then. FS might help here depending on how the attack works.
 
Was going to say he can maybe shapeshift into Garp or something, and then surprise Luffy, but Luffy sees the future and can read emotions so he'd know it's really Madara
 
CiscoTheSoto said:
Alive Madara doesn't have wood style. It's only Edo Tensei Madara that has wood style.
Click to expand...
My apologies
CiscoTheSoto said:
Can Luffy reflect energy attacks with his rubber body? I thought that was only with cannonballs, though I could very well be wrong.
Click to expand...
Anything blunt. The bijuudamas are pretty much blunt attacks, or rather chakra turned into a blunt attack
TheMonkeMan said:
Was going to say he can maybe shapeshift into Garp or something, and then surprise Luffy, but Luffy sees the future and can read emotions so he'd know it's really Madara
Click to expand...
he wouldn't even know to transform into garp.
also, he'd still punch him if it was garp. who told yall that luffy not punching garp
 
KingTempest said:
My apologies

Anything blunt. The bijuudamas are pretty much blunt attacks, or rather chakra turned into a blunt attack

he wouldn't even know to transform into garp.
also, he'd still punch him if it was garp. who told yall that luffy not punching garp
Click to expand...
Transform into makano or shanks or chopper, I dunno.
 
He can't read minds, he won't know to do that

Also, it's out of character
 
It actually is extremely OOC. Madara hasn't used it once I don't think? It's just a "basic ninja technique that everyone and their mothers know" but Luffy would still know it's Madara via sensory and probably ask him to teach him
 
Pretty sure the whole point of kenbunshoku is reading emotions and intent. And either way, he sees the future, lol. another problem is how madara would do that without Luffy seeming him in the middle of transforming
 
KingTempest said:
Anything blunt. The bijuudamas are pretty much blunt attacks, or rather chakra turned into a blunt attack
Click to expand...
I'm not very positive with that logic. Even if you're right and Luffy can redirect the Tailed Beast Balls with his rubber body, Kurama has the ability to fire his bijuudamas in the form of an energy beam instead of a sphere of condensed energy, so Madara could easily change tactics if he sees Luffy's rubber body redirect regular Tailed Beast Balls.
 
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