Momoshiki Downgrade and/or Base Naruto Upgrade?

[OnlineLurker]

In the recent chapter of the boruto manga, Base naruto was capable of dodging & blocking punches from powered up momoshiki. Momoshiki barely outmatched base naruto up until he got curbstomped by RSM naruto, therefore he had to resort to ninjutsu. This could probably be marked as inconsistency, but i'd like to hear some opinions on this.

 

[RadicalMrR]

Probably PIS.

 

[Antvasima]

Most likely inconsistency, yes. It would completely mess up our statistics if we started to scale base Naruto to a 5-C character.

 

[Shadowbokunohero]

i dont think base naruto needs to get an upgrade,from what i can tell it seems Momoshiki does need a downgrade, not huge one but def a downgrade

 

[Antvasima]

That may be an idea, yes. I will ask TheMightyRegulator for input.

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

Agreed. Momoshiki is in no way as impressive as previously displayed, except for when he used the Rock Golem. Perhaps At Least Country level (Superior to Kinshiki, overwhelmed base Naruto, destroyed the god tree) would suffice for when he consumed Kinshiki?

We can probably scale base Momoshiki to the Hachibi.

 

[Shadowbokunohero]

Agreed. Momoshiki is in no way as impressive as previously displayed, except for when he used the Rock Golem. Perhaps At Least Country level (Superior to Kinshiki, overwhelmed base Naruto, destroyed the god tree) would suffice for when he consumed Kinshiki?
We can probably scale base Momoshiki to the Hachibi.

yes i think your right , i have no objections here,

 

[Shadowbokunohero]

sorry for wall of text wont do it again

 

[AppleLord]

Well, gosh, this will be a let down. Can you at least update his new form and powers?

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

Is Momoshiki still refered to being as a bigger threat than Kaguya in the manga? If so then shouldnt we go with "Unknow, At Least Country Level"? And the reason for that would be is he is refered to being an even bigger threat than Kaguya but this could be wrong given he's only shown to be superior to Kinshiki, overwhelmed base Naruto and destroyed the God Tree.

 

[Dark649]

He is refered to being an even bigger threat than Kaguya but this could be wrong given he's only shown to be superior to Kinshiki, overwhelmed base Naruto and destroyed the God Tree.

Character Feats>Statements.

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

So, darkness manipulation+sealing via Shikamaru's shadow bind?

Also, should we use this image?

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

Character Feats>Statements.

Right. Tho like mentioned above this could be just PIS.

 

[OnlineLurker]

Agreed. Momoshiki is in no way as impressive as previously displayed, except for when he used the Rock Golem. Perhaps At Least Country level (Superior to Kinshiki, overwhelmed base Naruto, destroyed the god tree) would suffice for when he consumed Kinshiki?
We can probably scale base Momoshiki to the Hachibi.

Not sure if this is worth mentioning, but momoshiki did see sasuke come behind him, however this was at the last second and got sent flying. He easily recovered from the punch though. Anyways, That seems pretty reasonable. Although perhaps we should wait next chapter. Since he may or may not show his arguably best speed/reaction feat which was swatting away sasuke, who teleported behind him


@ProfessorKukui4life Kaguya was frieghtened by him and kinshiki, so he does have hype at least.

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

Wasn't it Base Momoshiki that knocked Naruto out?

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

If scaling him to SO6P Naruto is questionable we probably should not even consider scaling him and Kinshiki to Kaguya....

 

[OnlineLurker]

Wasn't it Base Momoshiki that knocked Naruto out?

Knocked him out with his uber bijuudama. He did send base naruto flying and naruto seemed to turn to momoshiki's direction before getting kicked. There's also that part where naruto tried to sneak up on him and momoshiki easily dodged it.

 

[AppleLord]

Add Hair binding technique to him.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

In that case then I definitely agree with whats suggested above, that its just PIS.

It makes no sense how Momoshiki could easily deal with Naruto in base and then later on Naruto is capable of fighting Transformed Momoshiki in base too. Unless Naruto was holding back, this is likely just a massive PIS scene.

 

[Shadowbokunohero]

In that case then I definitely agree with whats suggested above, that its just PIS.
It makes no sense how Momoshiki could easily deal with Naruto in base and then later on Naruto is capable of fighting Transformed Momoshiki in base too. Unless Naruto was holding back, this is likely just a massive PIS scene.

yes naruto was most likely holding back as later on it was even stated

 

[OnlineLurker]

The only thing naruto was holding back on at the chunin exam, was his power. Sasuke stated naruto could've easily obliertated momoshiki's bijuudama but the entire area would go up in smoke. Base naruto defintely wasn't holding back though(since his son was in danger).

 

[Shadowbokunohero]

if anything so far in the manga, momoshiki hasnt really shown that he is that much superior than base naruto, and putting him at 6B likely higher is reasonable ,but 5C i just dont see it sorry

 

[AppleLord]

Didn't Naruto defeat Toneri in base too? I'm afraid Kishi is showing how strong Naruto has become and that's why he refuses to allow Naruto to transform at full power again.

 

[Shadowbokunohero]

im pretty sure he just concentraited all of his chakra into his fist to over power toneri's attack, or else he wouldnt have went Tailed beast mode during the fight

 

[OnlineLurker]

if anything so far in the manga, momoshiki hasnt really shown that he is that much superior than base naruto, and putting him at 6B likely higher is reasonable ,but 5C i just dont see it sorry

Which is pretty BS considering his other versions fought on near even grounds with a much higher form. Seems alright for now however.

 

[AppleLord]

im pretty sure he just concentraited all of his chakra into his fist to over power toneri's attack, or else he wouldnt have went Tailed beast mode during the fight

It couldn't had been all for TWO major reasons:

-You can die if you use all of your chakra.

-Toneri had stolen a lot of chakra from Naruto to move the moon.

He also use tailed beast mode against Momoshiki.

Momoshiki may powerscale to Sasuke, and tailed beast mode Naruto. After all he did survive their attacks combined.

 

[Shadowbokunohero]

im pretty sure he just concentraited all of his chakra into his fist to over power toneri's attack, or else he wouldnt have went Tailed beast mode during the fight

It couldn't had been all for TWO major reasons:
-You can die if you use all of your chakra.

-Toneri had stolen a lot of chakra from Naruto to move the moon.

He also use tailed beast mode against Momoshiki.

Momoshiki may powerscale to Sasuke, and tailed beast mode Naruto. After all he did survive their attacks combined.

what i mean is the majority of chakra he had when he was in TB mode

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

Kurama mode was SO6P enhanced and Susanoo sasuke is moon level. It was also mentioned momoshiki was staying at 5-C with the Golem.

 

[Antvasima]

@TheMightyRegulator I am fine with if you wish to rescale Momoshiki.

 

[BarryAllen2.0]

So we just forget the fact that Naruto Was able to React and Defend against a Bloodlusted Sasuke? WTF is all this inconsistency talk?

Also, don't forget Momoshiki wants Naruto Alive and how are we gonna downgrade him? Naruto hit him twice and that's it. Did we downgrade him based on his movie feats? No and he got raggdolled still. This should be a Durability Feat for him and AP feats for Naruto.

That's the reason Base Naruto can react and defend. He can react and defend to Sasuke who is just as fast as Momoshiki and Momoshiki isn't trying to kill Naruto.

 

[BarryAllen2.0]

Naruto v Sasuke:

[1]
[2]

[3]

Naruto v Momoshiki:

[4]
[5]

[6]

[7]

So no, its not PIS or an Inconsistency. Coupled with the fact that Again Momoshiki isn't trying to Kill Naruto. And overpowered Naruto with his Golem.

Momoshiki is still portrayed ~ Naruto and Sasuke Individually. It makes sense Naruto is able to react to him if you don't forget his feats.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

Oh right.......

Then yea I agree with this^. I completely forgot that Momoshiki didnt want to kill Naruto as he wanted his chakra to remake the Chakra fruit for him and Kinshiki so it makes perfect sense that Momoshiki would hold back against them. So yea I definitely no not think he should be downgraded.

 

[OnlineLurker]

So we just forget the fact that Naruto Was able to React and Defend against a Bloodlusted Sasuke? WTF is all this inconsistency talk?
Also, don't forget Momoshiki wants Naruto Alive and how are we gonna downgrade him? Naruto hit him twice and that's it. Did we downgrade him based on his movie feats? No and he got raggdolled still. This should be a Durability Feat for him and AP feats for Naruto.

That's the reason Base Naruto can react and defend. He can react and defend to Sasuke who is just as fast as Momoshiki and Momoshiki isn't trying to kill Naruto.

Makes sense if base naruto could react to sasuke's non shunshin speed, at least it didn't look like sasuke used shinshin there. base naruto isn't as fast as sasuke let alone RSM, correct? Movie momoshiki still reacted to RSM naruto & sasuke's shunshin at once while catching their punch. They did overpower him but he put up a better taijutsu fight against them before resorting to ninjutsu. manga momo couldn't even block or react to RSM naruto's elbow strike or kick. He was forced to use ninjutsu much sooner as the resut. There's obviosuly a difference in speed & strength between base & RSM naruto, right?

Oh, that seemed to have changed in the manga. Momoshiki had intent to kill or at least now he does.

[[1]]

 

[TheMightyRegulator]

Base Naruto is rated MHS+, Sasuke is physically scaled to Base Naruto and Momoshiki should have, logically, have no issue with the Kages as well as Sasuke without his jutsu and base Naruto if he was this powerful normally. Further, we already agreed he's staying 5-C with the Golem (again), in the movie Momoshiki still destroyed Sasuke 's Susanoo, overpowered Sasuke' s chidori and was overall far more impressive than what was displayed.

So far most of the evidence points to Momoshiki capturing Naruto being a plot device.

 

[AppleLord]

Why is the movie mention? When is been reconned by the Boruto manga which is the new canon.

 

[Antvasima]

@TMR Okay then.

 

[Heatforce]

A little late to the party here but I think it should be established that yes, Naruto is indeed stronger in his base form now. Naruto has complete Kurama inside of him afterall.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, I suppose that an extra "Boruto Manga" statistics key could be a possibility.

 

[BarryAllen2.0]

So what are the stats going to look like for Momoshiki? His taking out Naruto at the Chunin exams shouldn't be labeled as PIS or anything considering this:


So how about this as a stats change:

AP: At Least Multi-Continent+, Likely Higher (Knocked out RSM Naruto when he absorbed the Damage from his TBB)/Possibly Moon+ (RSM Naruto supplemented by Sasuke's Chakra struggled under his attacks)/Possibly Moon+ (Absorbed Kinshiki)/At Least Moon+ (Overpowered RSM Naruto with Golem)

Durability: At Least Multi-Continet+, Likely Higher (Unconcerned about his TBB exploding)/At Least Moon+, Likely Higher (Tanked serious attacks from RSM Naruto and Sasuke)

Speed: MHS+ (unconcerned with a Serious Base Naruto)/MHS+ (Comparable to RSM Naruto and Rinnegan Sasuke)

 

[Antvasima]

What do you think TheMightyRegulator?