Minamoto no Raikou vs Siegfried

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

ALTERNATE TITLE: DRAGON SLAYER VS DEMON SLAYER REBOOT EDITION​

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Now this match is a thing, and i hope it would be good as Raikou vs Sigurd but we'll see
Heh, if you guys don't know i'm in the past was pretty much a very hardcore Siegfried hater....for a absolute and stupid reasons. Stupid reason because i was so f***ing annoyed by peoples who wanted Armor of Fafnir buff and i viewed it as overrated NP (now you get it why it's stupid lmao)
Thankfully that feeling is no more, gone, reducted to atom....while i still saying AoF is overrated but now with an troll intention lel
Siegfried is one of the servants that i used to hate alongside Alcides but not anymore, the only servant that i hate and despise is Atalanta, i want to say why but it would take too long here lel

Anyway withour any further wait, let's go to the match!

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There was two aspect of the Norse Greatest Hero, one symbolized the wisdom of dragon, and one symbolized the invicible might of dragon, that was what Siegfried and Sigurd has achieved from the blessing of slaying the fearsome and fierce dragon
Now that one symbol has fallen to the hand of the Japan Greatest Demon Slayer in her previous fight, the battle that cost the wielder of Gram his life against the Demon Slayer
The other symbol of Norse Greatest Hero and Dragon Slayer were now faced off against her, in a duel depth in the largest rainforest in the world
Both of these two has achieved the greater deeds on their past lifes and has tasted the glory and tragedy, however they're here not for a friendly talk and chit-chat, this is a duel to death and while Siegfried has a such of high pride as knight and honor, Raikou seems doesn't have that as she only seeks survival and extermination
And....if he fall then Raikou would achieving the glory of subduing and killed the invicible might and wisdom of the dragon
Who will emerged victorious and who will fallen? Can his mighty Dragon Armor withstanding the great might of Raikou divine lightning strikes!?

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• Base Raikou is used
• Both are in-characters
• Both having a prior knowledge while Raikou had a lil but further knowledge, especially Siegfried's back weakness
• Place located in: Amazon Rainforest
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• Starting Range: 10 Meters
• Win via anything!!
• The Most Well-Known Classical Dragon Slayer Hero: 2 (Mage, Makenai)
• The Well-Known Classical Japanese Demon Slayer Hero(ine): 8 (Expectro, Myself, Popted, Glaceon, Pokemon, Noneless, Fanta, Kflare)
• Inconclusive: 0

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VS

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[Mageman460]

Oh boy, Raikou can't do anything to get past Armor of Fafnir. Even Raikou's NP will do little more than scratch Siegfried. Sure Raikou has A Rank Strength, so did Karna using his spear and he barely cut him. The NP is a B++ NP so it can harm Siegfried, albeit barely. It will effectively be ranked all the way down to an E Rank NP. Raikou has no way to put Siegfried down outside of going for the back. But even then, Siegfried is an exceptionally skilled fighter who is constantly fighting to protect his back. It's even stated that there very few servants skilled enough to pull off a feat of stabbing him in the back.

In terms of offense, Siegfried is capable of taking on Karna and Mordred (not at the same time) and uses an A+ rank Noble Phantasm. He has enough skill to be hailed as one of the greatest two heroes in all of Norse Mythology. Raikou holds the advantage over him in terms pure offense thanks to A rank Strength and Mana Burst. (Mordred held a slight advantage with B+ Rank Strength and Mana Burst).

I give the fight to Siegfried almost 9/10 times. Raikou just would not be able to put him down.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

I swear AoF is bullshit lel

 

[Mageman460]

I don't disagree. It honestly makes Siegfried one of the hardest servants to put down.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

I don't disagree. It honestly makes Siegfried one of the hardest servants to put down.

But it still kinda inferior to what Karna had tbh

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Oh right, i want to say that about your point above:

In terms of offense, Siegfried is capable of taking on Karna and Mordred (not at the same time) and uses an A+ rank Noble Phantasm. He has enough skill to be hailed as one of the greatest two heroes in all of Norse Mythology. Raikou holds the advantage over him in terms pure offense thanks to A rank Strength and Mana Burst. (Mordred held a slight advantage with B+ Rank Strength and Mana Burst).

Sigurd was also hailed as the greatest heroes in all norse mythology by that logic since they are actually a same but in different way
However....Sigurd lost to Raikou
Yeah i know A>B>C Logic isn't convincing but that sound funny to me

 

[Mageman460]

Oh right, i want to say that about your point above:

Sigurd was also hailed as the greatest heroes in all norse mythology by that logic since they are actually a same but in different way
However....Sigurd lost to Raikou
Yeah i know A>B>C Logic isn't convincing but that sound funny to me

How did Sigurd lose to Raikou? That doesn't make sense to me.

But also yeah, Siegfried has the great benefit of Armor of Fafnir.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

How did Sigurd lose to Raikou? That doesn't make sense to me.

But also yeah, Siegfried has the great benefit of Armor of Fafnir.

Here: https://vsbattles.com/threads/minamoto-no-raikou-vs-sigurd.132039/

Honestly even how convincing your arguments is, we should wait for @Expectro2000xxx to come here since he's the most well-known about Raikou

 

[Mageman460]

I really feel like you can't use a non canon fight as an argument. Especially when it's a fan made "who would win".

Also wow that thread was bad.

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

I haven't saw Apocrypha but wasn't the fight against Karna something considered bullshit by the fandom? Like that he only did as well as he did against Karna thanks to plot armor.

That aside, Raikou already have her Rank A Strength, so add to that Mystery Slayer which increase her stats one rank (do to Siegfried be Earth attribute) and then on top of that there is Mana Burst Lightning A to not only buff even more her stats but also give her another weapon (the electricity and heat of the lightning, along with the range from it), yeah the damage will be reduced by Armor of Fafnir but not as much as you believe (to begin with the base strength of Raikou is already above Karna and Achilles, so added with her big amps is something that he isn't going to be able to easily ignore).

Balmung also isn't going to be as strong as in the Low 6-B calc since his anti-dragon amps aren't going to be active (so isn't going to be as strong as when he matched Mordred NP), while in the other side Ox-King will still scale above that do to the amps. Still the the armor would lessen the damage but in a direct clash Ox-King should overcome Balmung.

The effectiveness of the armor will also get reduced each time he blocks with Balmung so that's another point to consider. The personality of Siefried of have honorable fights is another thing rhat can go against him.

Skill wise we all know that Raikou is highly skilled and she should probably be comparable to Karna in skill, added to her skill is the numbers advantage do to her clones which would make easier for her to accomplish the feat of hit his weak point.

In general I see Raikou having more advantages so I vote her.

 

[Mageman460]

I haven't saw Apocrypha but wasn't the fight against Karna something considered bullshit by the fandom? Like that he only did as well as he did against Karna thanks to plot armor.

Siegfried had a draw with Karna actually. Sieg is the one who ultimately won via plot armor shenanigans.

That aside, Raikou already have her Rank A Strength, so add to that Mystery Slayer which increase her stats one rank (do to Siegfried be Earth attribute) and then on top of that there is Mana Burst Lightning A to not only buff even more her stats but also give her another weapon (the electricity and heat of the lightning, along with the range from it), yeah the damage will be reduced by Armor of Fafnir but not as much as you believe (to begin with the base strength of Raikou is already above Karna and Achilles, so added with her big amps is something that he isn't going to be able to easily ignore).

Mordred with her B+ Strength and Mana Burst A could not overwhelm Armor of Fafnir. With the two of them and a Command Spell boost to her max, Mordred could only slightly out perform him in Strength. Karna effectively had A Rank Strength and Mana Burst Flame. He could only leave small scratches on Siegfried. Sieg tanks Karna's fire so lightning's heat won't be too impressive. It also gets reduced by AoF.

Base Raikou is equal in Strength to Karna actually. As his NP lets him strike with the force of an A Rank attack passively. Karna also has Mana Burst Flame A, so the only amp over Karna Raikou has is Mystery Killer.

Balmung also isn't going to be as strong as in the Low 6-B calc since his anti-dragon amps aren't going to be active (so isn't going to be as strong as when he matched Mordred NP), while in the other side Ox-King will still scale above that do to the amps. Still the the armor would lessen the damage but in a direct clash Ox-King should overcome Balmung.

Ox King has a big start up to get to the final low 6-b blow. Siegfried sees Raikou go for it and takes her down with Balmung. And even if she does get the NP off, Siegfried's AoF ranks it down all the way to E++ or somewhere around there.

The effectiveness of the armor will also get reduced each time he blocks with Balmung so that's another point to consider. The personality of Siefried of have honorable fights is another thing rhat can go against him.

It's not a stacking debuff just to be clear. It is whenever he blocks with Balmung, AoF is slightly less effective. It still works really well as a Defensive NP.

Skill wise we all know that Raikou is highly skilled and she should probably be comparable to Karna in skill, added to her skill is the numbers advantage do to her clones which would make easier for her to accomplish the feat of hit his weak point.

Siegfried is not a slouch in combat either. He matched Mordred who is roughly equal to Artoria. And on top of that he fought on par with Karna. Hitting his weak point is incredibly difficult to the point of it being stated that Assassins for this specific purpose are needed.


Armor of Fafnir gets my vote for just being one of the tankiest servants.

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Mordred with her B+ Strength and Mana Burst A could not overwhelm Armor of Fafnir. With the two of them and a Command Spell boost to her max, Mordred could only slightly out perform him in Strength. Karna effectively had A Rank Strength and Mana Burst Flame. He could only leave small scratches on Siegfried. Sieg tanks Karna's fire so lightning's heat won't be too impressive. It also gets reduced by AoF.

Base Raikou is equal in Strength to Karna actually. As his NP lets him strike with the force of an A Rank attack passively. Karna also has Mana Burst Flame A, so the only amp over Karna Raikou has is Mystery Killer.


Ox King has a big start up to get to the final low 6-b blow. Siegfried sees Raikou go for it and takes her down with Balmung. And even if she does get the NP off, Siegfried's AoF ranks it down all the way to E++ or somewhere around there.


It's not a stacking debuff just to be clear. It is whenever he blocks with Balmung, AoF is slightly less effective. It still works really well as a Defensive NP.


Siegfried is not a slouch in combat either. He matched Mordred who is roughly equal to Artoria. And on top of that he fought on par with Karna. Hitting his weak point is incredibly difficult to the point of it being stated that Assassins for this specific purpose are needed.


Armor of Fafnir gets my vote for just being one of the tankiest servants.

I mean, you yourselve recognize that Karna was able to damage him, even if not much, which mean than Raikou who have the extra amp of Mystery Slayer will do more damage than Karna. Lightning is actually hotter than what you can initially thought you know? Between 27,760 to 38,871 Celsius, their is also the paralysis effect of it.

Siegfried actually seem to also take a bit before fire his NP, at least his weakness section say that he can't activate it as fast as when he was alive and iirc the clips I saw of Clarent Blood Arthur vs Balmung also show as if he take a bit. She also have her clones to gain time for her until she charge, be it by attacking or becoming shields. My point with Ox-King was more so that she can cancel Balmung in case he decide to use it, instead of trying to say that she can kill him with it.

I mean, that still mean that he receive more damage, even if slightly, which added with the fact that Raikou will be doing more damage than Karna did to him mean that the damage Siegfried will be receiving isn't gonna be just scratches.

I mean, Raikou is at least equal to Lancelot who is significantly above Mordred and even Artoria in skill (though in a fight the latter could defeat Berserker Lancelot thanks to Instincts and his desire of be defeated by her). I mean, let's suppose that Siegfried and Raikou are actually comparable in skill, which personally I don't think is the case but for argument sake let's say is the case, the simple fact that he need to simultaneously fight five enemies with equal skill, the ability to damage him and versatility (both do to the elemental powers and the range they have with the weapons and elements), I believe that under such circunstances is comprensible that they could end hitting his weak point even if he try to defend.

As in my previous comment I believe that do to her various advantages Raikou have more chances of win.

 

[TrueKingOfHeroes]

Siegfried had a draw with Karna actually. Sieg is the one who ultimately won via plot armor shenanigans.

Karna is higher than Siegfried in many aspect, he said he can fight both Siegfried and Jeanne at the same time.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Bump!!
I'll count you guys votes btw @Expectro2000xxx @Mageman460

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Bump!!

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Bump!!

 

[Makenai]

In the battle against Karna, both Siegfried and Karna trade blows and both receives countless scratch which can be healed instantly during fight.

Raikou may able to scratch Siegfried but still only a scratch that will be healed instantly, now that the problem is Raikou doesn't have KK which mean if Raikou trade blows with Siegfried she would definitely lose, Ox King may be able to cancel Balmung but so does Balmung should be able to cancel Ox King.

So obviously Siegfried should clear this quite easily.

Also in terms of skill Raikou still below Lancelot because the latter literally stated as Swordsman of the era while Raiko is not.

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

In the battle against Karna, both Siegfried and Karna trade blows and both receives countless scratch which can be healed instantly during fight.

Raikou may able to scratch Siegfried but still only a scratch that will be healed instantly, now that the problem is Raikou doesn't have KK which mean if Raikou trade blows with Siegfried she would definitely lose, Ox King may be able to cancel Balmung but so does Balmung should be able to cancel Ox King.

So obviously Siegfried should clear this quite easily.

Wasn't the healing do to the masters magic energy?

Raikou will be doing more damage than Karna do to the extra buff of Mystery Slayer. I think that you are underestimating how problematic will be face five enemies stronger than Karna with a comparable level of skill to him, specially since he will need to constantly protext his back or otherwise his weak point will be hit. I never one mentioned Ox-King lightning as a win con, I said that if Siegfried wanted to use Balmung she can cancel it with her own NP.

Also in terms of skill Raikou still below Lancelot because the latter literally stated as Swordsman of the era while Raiko is not.

Both share the exact same skill at exactly the same rank bruh, and if you want to take that approach Raikou have by far better feats than Lancelot, like: Give problems to a near end of Shimousa Musashi >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> every Lancelot feat.

 

[Makenai]

Wasn't the healing do to the masters magic energy?

Raikou will be doing more damage than Karna do to the extra buff of Mystery Slayer. I think that you are underestimating how problematic will be face five enemies stronger than Karna with a comparable level of skill to him, specially since he will need to constantly protext his back or otherwise his weak point will be hit. I never one mentioned Ox-King lightning as a win con, I said that if Siegfried wanted to use Balmung she can cancel it with her own NP.

Yes it was master doing, but my point still stand that it's still a mere scratch.

Even with mystery slayer Raikou can't do as much as dealing mortal wound to Suzuka who is stated as a very weak to Raikou's Mystery slayer, you should understand that her mystery slayer isn't absolute and by the time she deal some real damage to Siegfried she would've already turned to minced meat.

Both share the exact same skill at exactly the same rank bruh, and if you want to take that approach Raikou have by far better feats than Lancelot, like: Give problems to a near end of Shimousa Musashi >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> every Lancelot feat.

Lancelot : Mastership of combat arts has reached the point of being said to be unrivaled in one's era. By complete merging of mind, body and technique, it is possible to make use of full fighting skills even when under the influence of any sort of mental hindrance.

Raikou : The dexterity of combat arts performed to the extremes. Prevents the degradation of fighting skills no matter the kind of circumstances, even if she loses her armaments, etc.

Eternal Arms mastery is just to prevent the degradation of combat capability it doesn't measure to one's skill.

You do realize that Artoria with Shirou (degraded stats) as master can stand toe to toe with Sasaki Kojiro who is Musashi's equal and far more skilled than Raikou? And this Lancelot is far more skilled than prime Artoria.

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Yes it was master doing, but my point still stand that it's still a mere scratch.

Even with mystery slayer Raikou can't do as much as dealing mortal wound to Suzuka who is stated as a very weak to Raikou's Mystery slayer, you should understand that her mystery slayer isn't absolute and by the time she deal some real damage to Siegfried she would've already turned to minced meat.



Lancelot : Mastership of combat arts has reached the point of being said to be unrivaled in one's era. By complete merging of mind, body and technique, it is possible to make use of full fighting skills even when under the influence of any sort of mental hindrance.

Raikou : The dexterity of combat arts performed to the extremes. Prevents the degradation of fighting skills no matter the kind of circumstances, even if she loses her armaments, etc.

Eternal Arms mastery is just to prevent the degradation of combat capability it doesn't measure to one's skill.

You do realize that Artoria with Shirou (degraded stats) as master can stand toe to toe with Sasaki Kojiro who is far more skilled than Raikou? And this Lancelot is far more skilled than that Artoria.

Suzuka was completely beating though, and she was only surviving do to use variuos NP and stall the fight. You should understand that fight various enemies with at least comparable skill and which are able to do more damage than Karna, while protecting his back, is something unfavorable and that I, personally at least, don't believe Siegfried will be able to pull.

It measure the skill though.

You do realize that Atoria only could fight against Kojiro do to Instincts? That she could only defeat him do to the stairs nerfing Tsubame Gaeshi? You do realize that a nerfed Artoria with Kiritsugu as master defeated Lancelot in a short amount of time? You do realize that Saber Lancelot lost in a 1vs1 against Singularity 6 Mash (something that I just can remember have happened even until the current point when she is fasr superior)? You do realize that the next day to win against Raikou Musashi defeated Saber Kojiro (the Kojiro with the infinite Tsubame Gaeshi)? Please don't act like Lancelot actually have super good feats that he lack them compared with Raikou.

If you want to vote Siegfried then do it, I still retain the same opinion though.

 

[Makenai]

Suzuka was completely beating though, and she was only surviving do to use variuos NP and stall the fight. You should understand that fight various enemies with at least comparable skill and which are able to do more damage than Karna, while protecting his back, is something unfavorable and that I, personally at least, don't believe Siegfried will be able to pull.

It measure the skill though.

No, Do more damage doesn't mean she will do more than a scratch. All Siegfried should do is to blast all that clone with Balmung besides he could ignore most of Raikou's attack since it would just sting like mosquito to him.

Prove it.

You do realize that Atoria only could fight against Kojiro do to Instincts? That she could only defeat him do to the stairs nerfing Tsubame Gaeshi? You do realize that a nerfed Artoria with Kiritsugu as master defeated Lancelot in a short amount of time? You do realize that Saber Lancelot lost in a 1vs1 against Singularity 6 Mash (something that I just can remember have happened even until the current point when she is fasr superior)? You do realize that the next day to win against Raikou Musashi defeated Saber Kojiro (the Kojiro with the infinite Tsubame Gaeshi)? Please don't act like Lancelot actually have super good feats that he lack them compared with Raikou.

Her instinct only react to something dangerous to her which is only Tsubame Gaesh, she still able to trade blows with him despite her disadvantage, also saying Artoria can trade blows only because instinct is like saying the same thing to Musashi throughout entire Shimosa since she deeply reliant on her Heavenly Eyes.

Berserker Lancelot is wanted to be punished by Artoria and the fact that his master run out of juice at that battle.

Saber Lancelot literally overwhelmed everyone on the spot he was dumbfounded once he found out Mash is his daughter(son) and barely fight back.

You do realize that Musashi who defeated Raikou was not a servant yet and her skill too has yet to fully bloomed either.

You really think the feats of being defeated by a not full power Musashi is a great feat?

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

No, Do more damage doesn't mean she will do more than a scratch. All Siegfried should do is to blast all that clone with Balmung besides he could ignore most of Raikou's attack since it would just sting like mosquito to him.

Prove it.

Do more damage that someone who only do a scratch mean that she will do more than a scratch, I don't think is a concept so hard to understand but if you are unable to do so then ok, whatever. The fact that you mention Balmung blasting them show that you didn't understood the point about Ox-King cancelling Balmung, also if he actually tried to activate Balmung he will become open to attacks in his back by the clones. Have he ignored the attacks of Karna?

Several characters have called her the best of her era, even Musashi in their battle said how she was so good that no one in her era was near to match her skill and thus she was peerles. So the fact that both Raikou and Lancelot are called the best of their era and both have the exactcsame skill at exactly the same rank show that the skill is only possessed by the best of a era.

Her instinct only react to something dangerous to her which is only Tsubame Gaesh, she still able to trade blows with him despite her disadvantage, also saying Artoria can trade blows only because instinct is like saying the same thing to Musashi throughout entire Shimosa since she deeply reliant on her Heavenly Eyes.

Berserker Lancelot is wanted to be punished by Artoria and the fact that his master run out of juice at that battle.

Saber Lancelot literally overwhelmed everyone on the spot he was dumbfounded once he found out Mash is his daughter(son) and barely fight back.

You do realize that Musashi who defeated Raikou was not a servant yet and her skill too has yet to fully bloomed either.

You really think the feats of being defeated by a not full power Musashi is a great feat?

Her instincts were helping her in the fight and she only survived do to them (which was stated and show various times). I don't say that she can only trade blows do to her instincts, I say that she can only match Kojiro do to instincts, unless otherwise you genuinely believe that Artoria is equal in skill to the dude that reached tier 1 shit with pure skill, in which case I will like to see how many people share that opinion. Your comparison between Artoria and Musashi is so bad that I genuinely don't even know how you could thought such a thing.

He was defeated by a nerfed Artoria without her master supporting her (do to kiritsugi fighting the curry lover) and servants iirc can continue without a master for hours even without indepedent manifestation, so his master situation didn't affect the battle.

Unless the movie changed something that I don't know do to still not see it, Lancelot had an actual serious match with Mash and she defeated him.

What have to do be a servant with her skill? Especially since when alive she was a skill monster that constantly grew even more. You do realize that Raikou fought against an almost fully bloomed Musashi and that fully bloomed Musashi defeated the super busted Kojiro and was even a key to defeat a monster like Ivan?

You do think that the feat of give problems to a almost end of Shimousa Musashi isn't great? Because that Musashi already defeated tons of masters, had a duel with Yagyu so great that his life changed, defeated an Artoria, defeated the dude with a spear said to reach the gods (which was in a state in which he changed his fighting style to be specially strong against swordmans), and that that Musashi already had her Heavenly Eye along with the ability to cut karma. Sorry but this is leagues above anything Lancelot have ever show.

She also have the feat of only be scratched once in a long fight against someone with a NP that increased her skill and calculation power to super levels, and was only defeated by that person after use another two NPs and use divinity shit that is at the level of Gilgamesh Sha Naqba Imuru and Mooncell calculation power.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Okay i think i'll go with Raikou FRA based on what Expectro said right now

 

[Makenai]

Do more damage that someone who only do a scratch mean that she will do more than a scratch, I don't think is a concept so hard to understand but if you are unable to do so then ok, whatever. The fact that you mention Balmung blasting them show that you didn't understood the point about Ox-King cancelling Balmung, also if he actually tried to activate Balmung he will become open to attacks in his back by the clones. Have he ignored the attacks of Karna?

Suzuka can withstand attack from Raikou without receiving any grave injury, any damage Raikou do with Mystery slayer wouldn't be able to do any significant damage to Siegfried which mean it's not different than a scratch, besides Ox-King is a B++ anti-army NP while Balmung is A+ anti-army Raikou would get overpowered if she tried to cancel Balmung.

Do you think she can use Ox-King or clone without chant? The moment she summon the clone she would get blasted by Balmung.

Her instincts were helping her in the fight and she only survived do to them (which was stated and show various times). I don't say that she can only trade blows do to her instincts, I say that she can only match Kojiro do to instincts, unless otherwise you genuinely believe that Artoria is equal in skill to the dude that reached tier 1 shit with pure skill, in which case I will like to see how many people share that opinion. Your comparison between Artoria and Musashi is so bad that I genuinely don't

Kojirou outskilled Artoria but she can still hold her ground against him, your argument sound as if she solely reliant on her instinct when her instinct only react to Tsubame Gaesh. Lol Musashi would be dead already if it's not because of her Heavenly Eyes in Shimosa.

He was defeated by a nerfed Artoria without her master supporting her (do to kiritsugi fighting the curry lover) and servants iirc can continue without a master for hours even without indepedent manifestation, so his master situation didn't affect the battle.

Do you forget how costly a Berserker is? Do you watch F/Zero and see how Kariya was struggling to sustain Berserker? Despite having his magical energy boosted by Zouken? The fact that Lancelot want to be punished by Artoria also affected the battle.

Unless the movie changed something that I don't know do to still not see it, Lancelot had an actual serious match with Mash and she defeated him.

Do you perhaps forget how many times Lancelot overwhelmed them before? Heck even Tristan overwhelmed Mash too.

What have to do be a servant with her skill? Especially since when alive she was a skill monster that constantly grew even more. You do realize that Raikou fought against an almost fully bloomed Musashi and that fully bloomed Musashi defeated the super busted Kojiro and was even a key to defeat a monster like Ivan?

A servant is multiple times stronger and faster than Human you see even a strong Knight like Bedivere barely got an E rank parameter?

Also assassin Kojiro is the same Kojiro that fight Male Musashi, there was no busted Kojiro, his skill as an assassin and saber remains the same if there any difference then it would only his parameters.

A key to defeat Ivan? Musashi can only hurt Ivan after his invulnerability was removed even the she only cut his trunk and leave.

You do think that the feat of give problems to a almost end of Shimousa Musashi isn't great? Because that Musashi already defeated tons of masters, had a duel with Yagyu so great that his life changed, defeated an Artoria, defeated the dude with a spear said to reach the gods (which was in a state in which he changed his fighting style to be specially strong against swordmans), and that that Musashi already had her Heavenly Eye along with the ability to cut karma. Sorry but this is leagues above anything Lancelot have ever show.

She also have the feat of only be scratched once in a long fight against someone with a NP that increased her skill and calculation power to super levels, and was only defeated by that person after use another two NPs and use divinity shit that is at the level of Gilgamesh Sha Naqba Imuru and Mooncell calculation power.

Yes yes with that bullshit a Spear that reach God and all, tell me how Musashi does in fight against a real Divine Spirit like Castor? She doesn't stand a chance even after being boosted by Ares and Athena. Lancelot killed a Sphinx who is said to have equal to 3 servant easily and he is also stated to be equal to Gawain even under the sun due to his sheer skill, the same Gawain that's defeated Karna and stated would win against Suzuka Gozen at night even with her Trichiliocosm NP, yes the same NP that defeated Raikou.

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Suzuka can withstand attack from Raikou without receiving any grave injury, any damage Raikou do with Mystery slayer wouldn't be able to do any significant damage to Siegfried which mean it's not different than a scratch, besides Ox-King is a B++ anti-army NP while Balmung is A+ anti-army Raikou would get overpowered if she tried to cancel Balmung.

Do you think she can use Ox-King or clone without chant? The moment she summon the clone she would get blasted by Balmung.

Suzuka was constantly dodging and using her three sword simultaneously while stalling to survive against Raikou (on top of her Blessing of Wisdom and the high calculation power it grant). You do know how the + of abilities and NP work right? Because having + only mean that under certain circunstances the ability or NP have a output above its rank, in Balmung case the increase from + activate when facing dragon related beings (like when he faced Mordred and matched her Clarent Blood Arthur) while Ox-King ++ activate when facing mystical beings, reason of why Ox-King isn't going to get overpowered.

Where you get that Raikou need a chant to use clones? Because I don't remember that. Balmung take some time to activate which is noted by the profile itself and the clip I saw of Siegfried vs Mordred support that (I also sort of remember in the manga that he needed some time to use it against Fafnir, though could remember wrong).


The rest of the comment have so many things wrong that I honestly don't think that anything I say will change your opinion, so I will not respond to that part (to begin with is derailment to center and talk so much about Lancelot and Raikou when the fight is with Siegfried). You already said what you had to say and I already said what I had to say, let the rest decide to which side they want to vote.

 

[Popted2]

Raikou FRA

 

[GlaceonGamez471]

Raikou FRA

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Counted
I also need to update the OP with those good ol' summary sooner or later

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

Raikou fra

seriously what’s with all the raikou threads. Sounds like someone has an obsession with her

 

[HammerStrikes219]

Unless the movie changed something that I don't know do to still not see it, Lancelot had an actual serious match with Mash and she defeated him.

It was a duel. Not a outright serious match.


Edit 1: Post in thread '6-C Tournament: "Journey Through The Ride of Mystery and Supernatural Power" Round 2 - Match 2: Naruto Uzumaki vs Caster Gilgamesh'
https://vsbattles.com/threads/6-c-t...umaki-vs-caster-gilgamesh.136871/post-4780266

I also have address this earlier too

 

[HammerStrikes219]

Also you can not use the movie version completely since it doesn’t strictly follow mobile version to begin with

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Raikou fra

seriously what’s with all the raikou threads. Sounds like someone has an obsession with her

Oh you don't want it?
Anyway, counted

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

It was a duel. Not a outright serious match.


Edit 1: Post in thread '6-C Tournament: "Journey Through The Ride of Mystery and Supernatural Power" Round 2 - Match 2: Naruto Uzumaki vs Caster Gilgamesh'
https://vsbattles.com/threads/6-c-t...umaki-vs-caster-gilgamesh.136871/post-4780266

I also have address this earlier too

Also you can not use the movie version completely since it doesn’t strictly follow mobile version to begin with

Fair enough, though as how Reaper said he can be reluctant and still fight with full skill. I'm completely fine using adaptations like movies, animes and so since in a verse with multiverse stuff I consider this type of stuff as also canon, though if isn't wanted to use it I'm also fine with that. The point that Lancelot have kinda bad on-screen feats compared to Raikou still stand though.

 

[HammerStrikes219]

Fair enough, though as how Reaper said he can be reluctant and still fight with full skill. I'm completely fine using adaptations like movies, animes and so since in a verse with multiverse stuff I consider this type of stuff as also canon, though if isn't wanted to use it I'm also fine with that. The point that Lancelot have kinda bad on-screen feats compared to Raikou still stand though.

Not true per se. I already elaborated that isn’t true. We were never shown the full fight as it was off screen and what we saw is just Mashu hitting Lancelot in the mobile version. I am literally rereading this as I speak as not only is this isn’t necessarily true, it also technically extrapolate the scene in question

Edit: Not to mention it kinda does dwell into head canon territory. Something I will advise avoid using in cases such as this

 

[HammerStrikes219]

Anyway, other than that off topic statement and stuff, regarding this entire match, I have no interests. Only here for clarification on certain details

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Not true per se. I already elaborated that isn’t true. We were never shown the full fight as it was off screen and what we saw is just Mashu hitting Lancelot in the mobile version. I am literally rereading this as I speak as not only is this isn’t necessarily true, it also technically extrapolate the scene in question

Edit: Not to mention it kinda does dwell into head canon territory. Something I will advise avoid using in cases such as this

I mean, since the mobile version don't show much either equally possible that he hold back in skill or still fought with his normal skill.

But yes, lets stop talking about that since is off-topic to the actual thread.

 

[HammerStrikes219]

I mean, since the mobile version don't show much either equally possible that he hold back in skill or still fought with his normal skill.

But yes, lets stop talking about that since is off-topic to the actual thread.

I sent you message on your wall.

I will stop replying to this thread

 

[Noneless21]

milf FRA

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

milf FRA

Lmao bold move there

 

[Noneless21]

Lmao bold move there

I mean she had a son called Kintoki so I dunno what you saying there