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MH Monsters Ability and Tier Revision
- Thread starter ShiroyashaGinSan
- Start date
- 10,674
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What's the Low 6-B feat, again?
Mr. Bambu
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- #44
Bump
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- #45
Also I want to say Hunter seems to able to react to the lightning.
GimmyJibbsJr
They/Them- 1,436
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Just occurred to me that maybe not EVERY monster should get resistance to Disease Manipulation since Girros, Raphinos and even Odogaron are unable to overcome Vaal Hazak's Effluvium Virus.
GimmyJibbsJr
They/Them- 1,436
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yeah they live in it, but there are Raphinos and Girros that have the Effluvium itself trailing off of their body, indicating that they are indeed infected. Another hint that something is infected is if Vaal Hazak can suck the Effluvium from those monsters to heal itself (which subsequently kills those monsters).
This also happens to the Monster Hunter when their health bar turns yellow and shrinks to half the original size, and it usually happens when they are hit by one of Vaal Hazak's Effluvium attacks or if they stand within the thicker, damaging clouds for a longer period of time without protection.
This also happens to the Monster Hunter when their health bar turns yellow and shrinks to half the original size, and it usually happens when they are hit by one of Vaal Hazak's Effluvium attacks or if they stand within the thicker, damaging clouds for a longer period of time without protection.
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- #49
They're still able to hunt, eat and live in the effluvium heavy areas. Vaal Hazak part is just because he produces virus too much for them to handle. They're usually able to walk around there, heck, Girros don't even want to get out of the area. Hunter can resist the effects of effluvium as well, and can get rid of the status Effect by nulberries.
GimmyJibbsJr
They/Them- 1,436
- 131
For Hunters, they still get infected by the disease fairly easily. If they are to get the resistance to this, then it should be specified that this is primarily the case via Nulberries.
"Vaal Hazak part is just because he produces virus too much for them to handle."
Yeah, so that means these monsters fail to resist Vaal Hazak's Disease Manipulation, therefore likely shouldn't have it "resistance to disease manipulation" on their profiles.
"Vaal Hazak part is just because he produces virus too much for them to handle."
Yeah, so that means these monsters fail to resist Vaal Hazak's Disease Manipulation, therefore likely shouldn't have it "resistance to disease manipulation" on their profiles.
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- #51
Vaal Hazak virus isn't even make you sick anyway, it straight up decomposes you. It's more of a biological than disease. Also they should still have it for living in effluvium heavy areas. There's a thing called potency of resistance and Vaal Hazak broke it, nothing more. It's plus to Vaal Hazak, not minus to Girros. It took an effect when Vaal Hazak tried to strengthen the effects and it didn't when he doesn't. Girros even able to live in his own nest before he strengthen it.
GimmyJibbsJr
They/Them- 1,436
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Also it occurred to me while I was fighting Vaal Hazak that he is basically immune to the acid pools as he takes no damage from it and, iirc, can fall asleep in it without a problem.
GimmyJibbsJr
They/Them- 1,436
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But they are still unable to resist Vaal Hazak'a manipulation of the virus. Also, it is literally called a virus, which is, by definition synonymous with "disease". It doesn't matter if it makes you sick in the conventional sense of "you get a cough, fever, etc", it still infects you and induces a negative effect on your health and wellbeing, so therefore what Vaal Hazak itself is using is a disease, which we have seen infecting Girros and Raphinos and even repelling Odogaron.
This would imply that they do not have an immunity OR resistance to Vaal Hazak's Disease Manipulation.
Anyway, think of it like this. Let's say for this example that the Effluvium by itself does nothing to Raphinos or Girros. That would imply that, to the strain/strains they grow up in and are raised in, they are effectively immune to the Effluvium by itself.
However, that Effluvium is a naturally occurring disease and at that moment is not being manipulated, therefore it is not Disease Manipulation.
However, when they come into contact with the Effluvium directly produced and controlled by Vaal Hazak, they become infected and sick. Meaning that, to this instance of actual Disease Manipulation, they are defenseless.
This would imply that they do not have an immunity OR resistance to Vaal Hazak's Disease Manipulation.
Anyway, think of it like this. Let's say for this example that the Effluvium by itself does nothing to Raphinos or Girros. That would imply that, to the strain/strains they grow up in and are raised in, they are effectively immune to the Effluvium by itself.
However, that Effluvium is a naturally occurring disease and at that moment is not being manipulated, therefore it is not Disease Manipulation.
However, when they come into contact with the Effluvium directly produced and controlled by Vaal Hazak, they become infected and sick. Meaning that, to this instance of actual Disease Manipulation, they are defenseless.
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- #54
Likes of The Beast (inFAMOUS) are resistant to disease even when nobody in the verse as far as I know, manipulate virus. Not all resistance to disease stems to actual manipulation of disease, they just need to be able to resist the disease in general. Composite Human is one of the example.
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- #55
Now that I think about it, monsters that can be battled in Arena in MHW should have Low-mid regen. It's the same guy who you captured and it's fully regenerated even if you cut off its tail.
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^No.
Gameplay mechanics.And even if so it is Regenerationn overtime.
Gameplay mechanics.And even if so it is Regenerationn overtime.
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- #57
Yeah, it's likely mechanics now that I think about it. Sorry.
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- #58
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Why does Zorah have Country+ dura?
The Dragonator isn't 6-B and Zorah's 6-B (AP) comes from a suicide attack,that scales to no one.
The Dragonator isn't 6-B and Zorah's 6-B (AP) comes from a suicide attack,that scales to no one.
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- #60
It's not a suicide attack. It's just a consequence of his death. The monsters do the same thing in Rotten Vale and their bodies still remain, dissolving in the Effluvium. Dalamadur was there, skeleton intact.
GimmyJibbsJr
They/Them- 1,436
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To be fair though, wasn't it stated that the New World would be destroyed only if Zorah Magdaros died in the Everstream?
Implying that had it died virtually anywhere else it wouldn't have destroyed the New World?
Even if that is the case, Zorah was able to shift the tectonic plates with ease after you beat it the first time, so that's a decent feat.
Implying that had it died virtually anywhere else it wouldn't have destroyed the New World?
Even if that is the case, Zorah was able to shift the tectonic plates with ease after you beat it the first time, so that's a decent feat.
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- #62
I mean, the destruction will include Astera, which is like almost continent away and if we consider that's the blast radius, Yeah, all of NW will caught up in the blast.
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It is a suicide attack,it shouldn't scale to ordinary durability of a monster,especially if it dies in the processe.
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- #64
Their bodies remain after the energy, the dead bodies was able to survive. Again, Rotten Vale EDs did the same thing, releasing their energy to the continent. The body still remained intact and it's up to the virus to decompose it. If it is 6-C ZM should be turned into paste. The dead bodies "survived", the alive bodies scale. Also it's not activated and dying, it's activated because it's dying. It's completely opposite.
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The statement is actually that Zorah is colliding with the Everstream. Zorah just happens to be doing this in an instance where it is supposed to die. Zorah should have that AP also just by being laughably superior to the other Elder Dragons, who appear to be Low 6-B.
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It is still a suicide attack,I don't see a reason to scale it to Zorah's durability.
@Reinhardthrowhisspear
Zorah =/= other monsters.
Zorah has a lot of energy inside it that it was going to reveal upon its death.
@Reinhardthrowhisspear
Zorah =/= other monsters.
Zorah has a lot of energy inside it that it was going to reveal upon its death.
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- #67
It's not a suicide attack. If it's suicide attack, the whole Elder Crossing doesn't make a single sense. It's just an excretion of energy after death. Nothing more, nothing less. Continent takes advantage of it, and if it is used to Kamikaze, Elder's Recess and Rotten Vale's creation is debunked to Oblivion. Zorah is just using it differently.
He will do the same thing, why won't result be the same? Dragonator would only flinched him, and nobody in ED and MH history did get a Dragonator treatment before. Not Shagaru, not Dalamadur, not Kushala, unless you're part of the lunatic Ancient Civilization. He should be more durable than Dalamadur who is at 6-B. He's far more durable than Nergigante who can take two EDs at once, each at 5 Teratons. Even if you 2 times it, it's still 6-B.
He will do the same thing, why won't result be the same? Dragonator would only flinched him, and nobody in ED and MH history did get a Dragonator treatment before. Not Shagaru, not Dalamadur, not Kushala, unless you're part of the lunatic Ancient Civilization. He should be more durable than Dalamadur who is at 6-B. He's far more durable than Nergigante who can take two EDs at once, each at 5 Teratons. Even if you 2 times it, it's still 6-B.
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Never mentioned to be a suicide attack, I'd say it should scale to normal AP. Like Reinhard said, Zorah actually went against the normal "go here, die, release energy" in the name of colliding with the Everstream.
GimmyJibbsJr
They/Them- 1,436
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So, just wondering, but are there still things we need to cover on this thread? Because if not, I think we should be alright to apply the revisions to the profiles (6-C and Low 6-B for Elder Dragons like Kushala, Kirin and Elder Dragon Level monsters), as well as most of the things detailed in the OP of this thread.
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- #70
I think we need to revise High-rank speed. The key's speed only covers reactions and not anything else. For me, the ED speed feat should be Kirin dodging Rajang's beam.
GimmyJibbsJr
They/Them- 1,436
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That could totally be calced. If it helps at all, the beam is electricity and we can just use the "average" size of a Kirin for scaling the one in the cutscene (Smallest possible size + Largest Possible size, then divide that by 2).
That being said, we do have a thing here of Kirin moving in the form of a literal lightning bolt.
That being said, we do have a thing here of Kirin moving in the form of a literal lightning bolt.
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- #72
Then the Speed shouldn't be changed. I think this should be added.
GimmyJibbsJr
They/Them- 1,436
- 131
So it occurred to me that the Hunter's profile has his Hunter Rank at "at least Continent Level" for beating up Xeno'Jiiva. If Xeno'Jiiva is Continent Level, then shouldn't that scale to the low-end on the Fatalis profile instead of Country Level+? Naturally this would apply to other Dangerous First Class Monsters, too.
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- #75
I kinda disagree? Unlike Zorah and pals, Xeno'Jiva is just...... Weird. His carve description is portrayed him like a God similar to Alatreon and argument about fetus Xeno'Jiva thing.
GimmyJibbsJr
They/Them- 1,436
- 131
I mean regardless, the Fatalis Brethren and Dangerous First Class Monsters are the top tiers of the verse, and even having a low-end part of their profiles that is lower than another random monster makes no real sense.
Also Xeno'Jiiva is still not a DFCM. And it being spoken of like a God is nothing new. Dalamadur, a monster notably weaker than the Fatalis, has weapon descriptions that also refer to it as a god.
Low end for Fatalis and other such DFCM should be Continent Level and not Country Level+.
Also Xeno'Jiiva is still not a DFCM. And it being spoken of like a God is nothing new. Dalamadur, a monster notably weaker than the Fatalis, has weapon descriptions that also refer to it as a god.
Low end for Fatalis and other such DFCM should be Continent Level and not Country Level+.
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- #77
Then I think it's alright.
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- #78
Also LR Hunter should be At least 8-B, possibly far higher. There's three instances that Hunter has ED level feats in MHW.
GimmyJibbsJr
They/Them- 1,436
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Also, pretty sure you fight Gore Magala and Shagaru Magala in Low Rank for MH4/MH4U
Granted, in those cases the Hunter is like on the cusp of being a High Rank Hunter, but still.
Granted, in those cases the Hunter is like on the cusp of being a High Rank Hunter, but still.
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Btw, is Gore Part of the ED level Monsters? He isn't technically ED.
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