MCU Thor Upgrade Calcs for Star Level Durability

[Qawsedf234]

Strength, durability, and healing factor are three different powers.

What you're saying is that Thor should have the power of a billion stars, Hulk has the endurance less than a helicopter explosion and can still directly take his serious hits. That scaling does not work. You cannot separate Hulk's strength and durability for this version. If Thor is the level you're claiming, every single character he seriously fights is that level. Everyone scales to this and there's zero ways around it.

Its what I said originally: Its at best not a feat and at worst utterly unusable for scaling since it would be the definition of an outlier

2. I am not seeing what you say that you see with Loki and the stars.

Its not that hard to see. The video just completely debunks the idea that its a star. Heck under your logic this Black Hole can suck in a star millions or billions of miles away at the same speed its sucking in Loki. Under that logic Asgard should also be sucked away considering how close they would need to be.

Your third point ignores Jane's statements defining the Bifrost as an Einstein-Rosen Bridge wormhole

I'm not, its explained in Avengers and shown in other movies that you can generate stable wormholes naturally and with the Tesseract by even nominally powerful reactors.

The Bifrost is not the Tesseract

The Bifrost is based on the Tesseract and the Tesseract itself is used to reconstruct it. The Bifrost also doesn't operate like a true wormhole going by NASA, since its not an instant form of transportation.

This just isn't a feat that's useable in any capacity. Trying to push it is just nonsensical because you're either saying that Thor should be 4-B to 3-A and therefore nearly every high tier character in the series is that strong or you're arguing that there's some massive tier disconnect between physicals which doesn't work for the site.

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

He fall in the water prone and then floated unmoving

I’m pretty sure he was moving his arms and trying to swim once he fell into the water

 

[Qawsedf234]

I’m pretty sure he was moving his arms and trying to swim

His body is limp and he isn't moving.

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

His body is limp and he isn't moving.

Well, to me, I can see some kind of arm movement

 

[ParkerKent007]

What you're saying is that Thor should have the power of a billion stars, Hulk has the endurance less than a helicopter explosion and can still directly take his serious hits. That scaling does not work. You cannot separate Hulk's strength and durability for this version. If Thor is the level you're claiming, every single character he seriously fights is that level. Everyone scales to this and there's zero ways around it.

Its what I said originally: Its at best not a feat and at worst utterly unusable for scaling since it would be the definition of an outlier

Its not that hard to see. The video just completely debunks the idea that its a star. Heck under your logic this Black Hole can suck in a star millions or billions of miles away at the same speed its sucking in Loki. Under that logic Asgard should also be sucked away considering how close they would need to be.

I'm not, its explained in Avengers and shown in other movies that you can generate stable wormholes naturally and with the Tesseract by even nominally powerful reactors.

The Bifrost is based on the Tesseract and the Tesseract itself is used to reconstruct it. The Bifrost also doesn't operate like a true wormhole going by NASA, since its not an instant form of transportation.

This just isn't a feat that's useable in any capacity. Trying to push it is just nonsensical because you're either saying that Thor should be 4-B to 3-A and therefore nearly every high tier character in the series is that strong or you're arguing that there's some massive tier disconnect between physicals which doesn't work for the site.

No, I'm saying Thor can tank a star, not a billion stars.

Hulk was unbothered by the helicopter cuts. Hela was able to be cut yet casually one-hand crushed Mjolnir. Sersi was stabbed by a normal dagger yet could trigger the Uni-Mind that put Tiamut the Celestial to sleep before it could explode the Earth. Plus the helicopter hit early Hulk, who had not even fought Abomination yet much less Thor. By the time Hulk punched out the Leviathan in Avengers 1, his strength and durability clearly had surpassed his Hulk 1 movie levels. His ability to take the full IG snap is obviously so far above helicopter blade that this should not be in question. Besides 616 comic book Hulk has gotten flipped by Captain America and choked out by a damn snake and nobody is trying to make him building level.

In Thor 1, Loki ALLOWED himself to fall into the black hole -- he LET GO of the staff intentionally. He did not get dragged in against his will. Besides, Asgard, which controls the Bifrost, would not create and use something that could so easily become its own demise. That would be grossly stupid of them. Also, the black hole is gigantic and very far away from Asgard as well, at least light years -- just like the stars. Asgard is an asteroid-sized planet that can resist the pull of a black hole. That makes sense. It is inhabited by Odin, who turned his dead wife into a star in Thor 2 and has an energy beam whose side effect is capable of destroying a planet in another galaxy.

It is not stated in-movie that the Bifrost is based on the Tesseract. If that is again from some guidebook or tie-in comic, accepting that is the internal convention of this website and in no way evidenced by what is shown onscreen in a verified canon MCU movie. I understand that is an internal convention of this website but it is flawed logic concerning the MCU at least because it amounts to headcanon. The movies do not reference the guidebooks and tie-in comics; it's only the guidebooks and tie-in comics that reference the movies.

On a related note, Jane defined THE BIFROST as an Einstein-Rosen Bridge. She did not define the wormhole created by the Tesseract or anything else as an Einstein-Rosen Bridge. I am not extrapolating her definition to in-universe phenomena she did not reference. Thor 1 and Thor 4 make clear that Jane's Einstein-Rosen Bridge wormhole study is specific to the Bifrost. And even if the Tesseract did create an Einstein-Rosen Bridge wormhole, there is NO onscreen statement about the energy that the Tesseract itself needed to produce -- only statements about external apparatus that Selvig needed to apply to the Tesseract to affect it. The Tesseract itself is a power source. Anything external he does to it is additional and by definition not intrinsic to the power of the Tesseract.

Loki's durability does in fact scale to Thor's. Thor was not trying to kill Iron Man in Avengers 1, and Iron Man did not hurt Thor as much as annoy him, so Avengers 1 Iron Man does not scale anywhere close to Thor. (Thor holds back around humans, which is in keeping with the 616 comics.) Malekith with Aether scales to Thor. Kurse, Thanos, Hela, prime Surtur, and Gorr scale above base Thor but below peak Thor. Hulk scales below Thor but is probably planetary durability. The dude staggered planet buster prime Surtur.

Anyway I'm done here. Was hoping VS Battles would be civil and rational. My bad for hoping that. Enjoy yourselves.

 

[Qawsedf234]

No, I'm saying Thor can tank a star, not a billion stars.

You 100% said multiple stars

Thor 1 he tanked the exploding Bifrost, which created a black hole and sucked in stars. So the Bifrost can produce more than 100 Million solar masses: E = mc² = 1.8x10^55 Joules

Thor 3 he tanked getting pushed through the Bifrost, an Einstein-Rosen Bridge wormhole (black hole + white hole) of at least 7.6 solar masses: E = mc² = 1.4x10^48 Joules
Source (NASA): https://www.nasa.gov/topics/universe/features/smallest_blackhole.htmlhttps://www.nasa.gov/topics/universe/features/smallest_blackhole.html

Infinity War he survived a Power Stone explosion that destroyed a spaceship which tanked the singularity of a collapsing neutron star (at least 1.3 solar masses) inside an Einstein-Rosen Bridge (at least 7.6 solar masses): E = mc² = 1.8x10^48 Joules
Source (NASA): https://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/...rs cram roughly 1.3,the same as Mount Everest!

The Sun's GBE is accepted as 5.693 * 10^41 joules here. All of these values you mentioned in your opening well beyond star level.

Hulk was unbothered by the helicopter cuts

He was cut all around his body and was injured by them. Bleeding from a 9-B to 9-A explosion when you're suggesting he's 5-B to 4-B is not possible using this site's policy.

Sersi was stabbed by a normal dagger yet could trigger the Uni-Mind that put Tiamut the Celestial to sleep before it could explode the Earth.

Those two things have no relation to each other in terms of power/durability. Even if they did you're only proving my point that you could have used examples of inconsistent showings in the MCU without going to a completely different franchise.

In Thor 1, Loki ALLOWED himself to fall into the black hol

You entirely missed the point of my comment here. Loki fell into the portal and it took under ten seconds. The Bifrost observatory also fell in there and could be viewed in the background. When Loki falls you can also directly make a size comparison between him and one of the lights.

Everything in the scene debunks the idea its a real black hole and that those lights are real stars.

at least light years

Read what you wrote here.

Gravity moves at light speed and you're claiming Loki travelled thousands of times faster than that while falling.

Loki fell for under 30 seconds and entered the portal. It was not lightyears away, it was absurdly close to Asgard.

vie. I understand that is an internal convention of this website but it is flawed logic concerning the MCU at least because it amounts to headcanon.

We have WoG that directly states that comics are canon MCU material as long as they have the correct MCU stamp on them. Its not headcanon, its literally canon-canon.

Thor was not trying to kill Iron Man in Avengers 1, and Iron Man did not hurt Thor as much as annoy him, so Avengers 1 Iron Man does not scale anywhere close to Thor.

You're misunderstanding my point here. The site doesn't scale Mark VII Iron Man to Thor, but we do scale Mark L and Mark LXXXV Iron Man to Thor/Thanos for drawing a drop of blood. We also scale Hulk to Thor. We also scale Hela to Thor. We also scale Vision to Thor. We also scale Ultron to Thor. A vast swath of characters get their ratings directly from Thor, so any upgrade to him effects them. You're suggesting a franchise wide AP upgrade to 4-B or 3-A.

(Thor holds back around humans, which is in keeping with the 616 comics.)

This has never been stated in any of the movies.

Hulk scales below Thor but is probably planetary durability.

How does one scale to a Solar System to Universal Character but only to a rating a trillion times lower than them?

The dude staggered planet buster prime Surtur.

Surter destroyed an asteroid that doesn't breech a couple miles in width. He's not a planet buster in the sense that he can blow up the Earth.

Was hoping VS Battles would be civil and rational.

I don't mind if you dislike our conclusions here, but to assume the rational choice is upgrading Thor to be universal in his base form and upgrading half the franchise to that is the opposite of rational.

Anyways if this is done then I'll close the thread.

 

[ParkerKent007]

I'd just like to add that, regarding claims the MCU never states Thor holds back most of the time ... actually the MCU consistently shows that Thor became very concerned with protecting life and containing his power so it does not hurt weaker people.

Thor 1 at Timestamp 1:36:00

Thor: "You can't kill an entire race!"

Loki: "Why not? And what is this newfound love for the Frost Giants? You could have killed them all with your bare hands."

Thor: "I've changed."

---

Avengers 1 at Timestamp 00:45:54

Thor, minutes before Iron Man attacks him: "The Earth is under my protection, Loki."

---

Thor 2 at Timestamp 01:39:22

Loki posing as Odin after Thor prevented universal destruction: "The Alignment has brought all the realms together. Every one of them saw you offer your life to save them."

---

Avengers 2 at Timestamp 00:51:25

Wanda's vision of Heimdall as lightning from Thor accidentally kills Asgardians, what Thor later calls "the horrors in our heads": "You're a destroyer, Odinson. See where your power leads."

---

Thor 3 at Timestamp 00:55:14

Thor talking to a raging Hulk: "Banner we're friends. This is crazy. I don't want to hurt you!"

---

All this makes it clear, to me at least, that MCU Thor is intentionally not going all out using his full power most of the time.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Loki: "Why not? And what is this newfound love for the Frost Giants? You could have killed them all with your bare hands."

Thor: "I've changed."

You left out the previous sentence. Loki is not talking about Thor fighting people.

Loki: I will have destroyed that race of monsters. And I will be true heir to the throne!

Thor: You can't kill an entire race!

Loki: Why not? And what is this newfound love for the Frost Giants? You could have kill them all with your bare hands.

Thor: I've changed.

This is about Loki trying to kill the entire planet and mentioning that Thor was doing the exact same thing earlier in the movie. This has nothing to do with holding back. The only thing Thor is holding back is inner urge to commit genocide. Right after he screams in anger and charges Loki when he says he's going to kill Jane.

Thor, minutes before Iron Man attacks him: "The Earth is under my protection, Loki."

This has nothing to do with holding back. Just that his duty is to protect Earth.

Wanda's vision of Heimdall as lightning from Thor accidentally kills Asgardians, what Thor later calls "the horrors in our heads": "You're a destroyer, Odinson. See where your power leads."

This is about how he failed against Thanos and let his people be killed by Hela. Its also showing his hidden power and in the same movie he's clearly going all out against Ultron at every relevant moment.

Thor talking to a raging Hulk: "Banner we're friends. This is crazy. I don't want to hurt you!"

He then says

All right. Screw it. I know you're in there, Banner. I'll get you out!

After the Hulk hits him and he goes full tilt trying to knock out and get Banner out. He was then punched so hard he nearly fell into unconsciousness and triggered his god powers.

 

[Excellence616]

bump

 

[ParkerKent007]

The evidence below should be sufficient to get MCU Thor to star level now:





Thor did this to full Infinity Gauntlet Thanos. And then Thor did this:

Thor Kills Thanos







Thor is evenly matched with Gorr in the Shadow Realm, where Gorr is stated to be most powerful.





Gorr tanks a direct shot by Stormbreaker.





Valkyrie, who is weaker than Thor, is the only one to deeply penetrate Gorr's body, which she does with Thunderbolt.





Thunderbolt makes Gorr bleed, a lot, from the mouth.





Yet Thor is able to easily one-hand catch Thunderbolt after Zeus throws it at him with intent to wound or kill.





Thor then beats Zeus with Thunderbolt, Zeus' own weapon, by throwing it through Zeus' armor-plated chest.





Zeus is the leader of the most powerful gods in the universe. The most powerful gods in the universe include Khonshu, who did this:

Khonshu Moves Stars







The most powerful gods in the universe also include the god of magic. So the god of magic defers to Zeus, who Thor beats.





Zeus also commands the attention of two Celestials. One Celestial can bust a planet AT BIRTH, and grow up to CREATE STARS.

Arishem Explains Celestials

 

[Qawsedf234]

Thor did this to full Infinity Gauntlet Thanos

Because Stormbreaker was made to counter the IG and Thanos didn't take it seriously. Its not an AP feat

Zeus is the leader of the most powerful gods in the universe

Zeus is the leader because he's wise, not because he's the strongest

And Zeus, the oldest and wisest of them all.

At no point is Zeus stated to be the leader because of strength.

Zeus also commands the attention of two Celestials.

Zeus doesn't command the Celestials because he's stronger than they are. In fact him commanding them at all is questionable since the Celestials in Omnipotence city are far smaller than the ones seen in Eternals.

The most powerful gods in the universe include Khonshu,

While true, we separate Khonshu's star thing from his AP, since that's reality warping then a direct attack.

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

Because Stormbreaker was made to counter the IG

That was revised and changed months ago

 

[Qawsedf234]

That was revised and changed months ago

What do you mean revised? It's what was stated to happen. If Thanos was more prepared the directors stated he would've just done something else the Axe couldn't directly counter.

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

What do you mean revised? It's what was stated to happen. If Thanos was more prepared the directors stated he would've just done something else the Axe couldn't directly counter.

Stormbreaker countered the Infinity Gauntlet's beam because it was powerful enough. It is an AP feat

https://vsbattles.com/threads/minor-stormbreaker-crt.139074/

 

[Qawsedf234]

Stormbreaker countered the Infinity Gauntlet's beam because it was powerful enough. It is an AP feat

It countered the beam, but it couldn't handle the IG's other powers and certainly has no evidence of scaling to the full gauntlet.

Even if it wasn't built to counter the IG, which I'm not seeing that aspect being disproven by the thread, it still wouldn't be evidence of a Tier 5, 4 or 3 rating for Thor like the thread is suggesting.

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

certainly has no evidence of scaling to the full gauntlet.

it still wouldn't be evidence of a Tier 5, 4 or 3 rating for Thor like the thread is suggesting.

I definitely don't disagree with that

 

[Yusuf21259]

Zeus akıllı olduğu için liderdir, en güçlü olduğu için değil

disagree with this because if zeus wasn't a strong enough leader, he wouldn't be so respected, and the gods wouldn't watch his shows with thunderblot enthusiastically, basically, if there are gods who can scale with 4-a, they won't even feel excited when they do it at a gun show like thunderbolt, I'm sure everyone there is taking refuge in zeus and the United god force

 

[Qawsedf234]

wasn't a strong enough leader

A leader can be wise and charismatic. Power can have nothing to do with it. Joe Biden can't defeat Muhammad Ali or anything.

 

[Yusuf21259]

A leader can be wise and charismatic. Power can have nothing to do with it. Joe Biden can't defeat Muhammad Ali or anything.

But assuming that these scales can run on gorr, wouldn't it be a chain scale for someone like ra, who has a serious position among the Egyptian gods, to take shelter in this city, sir? I know ra doesn't have data for power but he's comparable to other egyptian gods

 

[Qawsedf234]

But assuming that these scales can run on gorr, wouldn't it be a chain scale for someone like ra, who has a serious position among the Egyptian gods,

Yeah it makes more sense to scale from Ra imo than Zeus.

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

But assuming that these scales can run on gorr, wouldn't it be a chain scale for someone like ra, who has a serious position among the Egyptian gods, to take shelter in this city, sir? I know ra doesn't have data for power but he's comparable to other egyptian gods

Yes. That's one of the current agreed scaling for Gorr and co.

https://vsbattles.com/threads/mcu-thor-and-friends-upgrade-to-tier-3.143847/

 

[Yusuf21259]

Evet. Bu, Gorr ve ortakları için üzerinde anlaşılan mevcut ölçeklendirmelerden biri.

https://vsbattles.com/threads/mcu-thor-and-friends-upgrade-to-tier-3.143847/

thanks for the thread link

 

[ParkerKent007]

I found proof for upgrading MCU Thor and Gorr to at least 4-C star level based solely on the star-moon relationship of the Shadow Realm in Love & Thunder.

The new wording for Gorr would be:

"At least Star Level (Empowered by the Necrosword, whose power moved both the star and moon of the Shadow Realm to the Gate of Eternity at the center of the universe"

The wording for Thor's attack potency and durability would remain the same:

AP: "Fought evenly against Gorr the God Butcher on multiple occasions"

Durability: "Tanked a direct hit from Gorr's All-Black the Necrosword and endured a beating from him)

---

The Proof:

The Disney+ official English [Audio Description] of Love & Thunder at timestamp 1:14:30 says "Light from a blazing sun revealed behind the celestial body washes over Jane's awed face just before the Goat Boat crashes into the surface of the moon."




Then the Disney+ official English [Audio Description] of Love & Thunder at timestamp 1:28:40 says "In the Shadow Realm, the silhouette forms of the children can be seen against the bright glow of the sun as giant boulders float together to form pillars. With Stormbreaker slung across his back, Gorr stands at the front of the children and watches as chunks of the moon form the cracked stone floor of the structure around them."




This means Gorr generated the force necessary to move the mass of both the star and moon of the Shadow Realm from its previous position to the Gate of Eternity at the center of the universe.

We know this because the very previous scene is Thor and Valkyrie discussing directions to Eternity at the center of the universe, so Thor would not get lost. This discussion would be unnecessary if the previous position of the star and moon of the Shadow Realm had already been at the Gate of Eternity in the center of the universe, since Thor already knew how to reach the moon of the Shadow Realm and in fact had just been there a few minutes ago onscreen.

We also know that, at timestamp 1:28:40, the star and moon of the Shadow Realm are clearly in a different position than during Gorr's previous battle with Thor, Jane and Valkyrie at timestamp 1:21:10, because at timestamp 1:28:40 Gorr, the children, and outer space are in color instead of the black-white-gray of the previous battle.

Note that the Shadow Realm itself has areas of color, as proven at timestamp 43:31, when Thor first identifies that this is where the caged children are located. Thor, the children, and outer space are in color at timestamp 43:31, yet Thor says "I know where you are" and then a few seconds later "They're in the Shadow Realm." He does not say "I know where you're going" and he does not say "They're going to the Shadow Realm." They are already there, in color.

At timestamp 43:31, the children also are on a large floating rock in outer space, which is definitely under Gorr's control. This proves Gorr can move large amounts of matter through outer space.



---

IMPORTANT:

It does not matter whether Gorr directly moved the star and the moon to the Gate of Eternity, or whether Gorr only moved the moon while the star somehow orbits the moon on its own.

Why? At timestamp 33:57 Love & Thunder explicitly shows onscreen in the movie that the laws of centripetal force (F=mv^2/r) and Newton's law of universal gravitation (F=G*Mm/r^2) apply to actions in the MCU. Jane, an in-universe astrophysicist, teaches a lecture with both formulas on her whiteboard. She can only teach what she perceives, and she clearly perceives these laws of physics in that universe.

NASA says the laws of centripetal force and Newton's law of universal gravitation apply to objects such as our own Sun's pull on the Earth, and that both forces are equivalent to each other when also accounting for velocity.

https://imagine.gsfc.nasa.gov/features/yba/CygX1_mass/gravity/sun_mass.html

Therefore, applying these laws and formulas to Gorr and/or the star-moon relationship of the Shadow Realm, this means that either the moon itself has much more mass than the star in order to keep the star orbiting the moon, or Gorr himself must generate enough centripetal force / gravitational attraction to simulate that greater mass ... as they all move from the place of battle at timestamp 1:21:10 to the center of the universe at timestamp 1:28:40.

The laws of centripetal force and Newton's law of universal gravitation also mean that even if we take a low mass for a real star, 3% of the sun's mass, either Gorr himself or the moon itself must generate at least 9.79x10^37 Newtons of force to keep it orbing the moon, if we assume 1 orbital rotation per minute velocity (onscreen approximation) at a distance of 1 astronomical unit (Earth to Sun). Increasing the velocity, and/or decreasing the distance, increases the force needed.

Mass of our sun = 1.989x10^30 kilograms

3% mass of our sun = 5.9x10^28 kilograms = M

r = 1 astronomical unit = 1.495x10^11 meters

v = 1 orbital rotation per minute at 1 astronomical unit = 1.56x10^10 meters per second

Centripetal force = F=Mv^2/r = (5.9x10^28 kilograms x (1.56x10^10 meters per second squared)) / 1.495x10^11 meters = 9.79x10^37 Newtons

Mass of the moon = m =v^2r/G = ((1.56x10^10 meters per second squared) x 1.495x10^11 meters) / Gravitational constant 6.67x10^-11 = 5.5x10^41 kilograms = m

Gravitational attraction = F=G(Mm/r^2) = Gravitational constant 6.67x10^-11 x ((5.9x10^28 kilograms x 5.5x10^41 kilograms) / 1.495x10^11 meters^2) = 9.79x10^37 Newtons

---

In a universe with Infinity Stones and weapons forged from neutron star material, a building-sized moon with large star-level mass would be very possible.

 

[Qawsedf234]

This means Gorr generated the force necessary to move the mass of both the star and moon of the Shadow Realm from its previous position to the Gate of Eternity at the center of the universe.

There's not a lot of indication that Gorr moved the star. The rest of your calc doesn't work because we see how large the moon is and its nowhere near dense enough to drag around a star sized object.

a building-sized moon with large star-level mass would be very possible.

?????

What? No it wouldn't. The sun becomes a black hole if it shrinks down to 590 meters. An object that dense and that small would collapse in a black hole under any set of physics.

If anything all this would imply is that the star is tiny, like with Omnipotence City.

 

[ParkerKent007]

There's not a lot of indication that Gorr moved the star. The rest of your calc doesn't work because we see how large the moon is and its nowhere near dense enough to drag around a star sized object.

?????

What? No it wouldn't. The sun becomes a black hole if it shrinks down to 590 meters. An object that dense and that small would collapse in a black hole under any set of physics.

If anything all this would imply is that the star is tiny, like with Omnipotence City.

As I said, the other option is that Gorr moved both the star and the moon with his own power, which relieves the need for the moon to be that dense.

And how do you address the fact that Gorr and the kids are clearly in a different location from the previous black-and-white battle when the Gate to Eternity forms?

 

[Qawsedf234]

As I said, the other option is that Gorr moved both the star and the moon with his own power, which relieves the need for the moon to be that dense.

He can just move the moon really. There are plenty of other stars in that scene and Eternity's location at the center of the universe would contain a bunch of stars already.

And how do you address the fact that Gorr and the kids are clearly in a different location from the previous black-and-white battle when the Gate to Eternity forms?

He can move rocks and objects with the Necrosword. So he just took a chunk of the moon and moved it to the center of the universe. Also the audio description for that scene doesn't even make any sense, as they aren't being lit by a star but some weird cosmic light storm. You're using audio-descriptors for people with vision difficulties, but that's not the same as WoG or director commentary. Its just scene description which can be wrong or truncated for the sake of the viewer getting a rough idea of what's happening.

 

[ParkerKent007]

He can just move the moon really. There are plenty of other stars in that scene and Eternity's location at the center of the universe would contain a bunch of stars already.

He can move rocks and objects with the Necrosword. So he just took a chunk of the moon and moved it to the center of the universe. Also the audio description for that scene doesn't even make any sense, as they aren't being lit by a star but some weird cosmic light storm. You're using audio-descriptors for people with vision difficulties, but that's not the same as WoG or director commentary. Its just scene description which can be wrong or truncated for the sake of the viewer getting a rough idea of what's happening.

1. The audio description for the Gate of Eternity says "the sun" ... not "a sun" or "a star". It clearly is referring to the sun that the audio description already mentioned.

2. Why would Kevin Feige and the rest of the MCU producers ignore how audio on Disney+ describes the movie?

3. What kind of sense does it make for us to disregard that Disney+ audio commentary, but to place more trust in what appears in comic-book tie-ins and text guidebooks that are never referenced in the movies or on Disney+?

 

[Qawsedf234]

1. The audio description for the Gate of Eternity says "the sun" ... not "a sun" or "a star".

It also says "The Moon" for Earth's moon and uses "The Sun" for other stars as well. It's a generic descriptor.

Why would Kevin Feige and the rest of the MCU producers ignore how audio on Disney+ describes the movie?

Do you not know what an Audio Descriptor is for?

Audio description, also referred to as a video description, described video, or more precisely called a visual description, is a form of narration used to provide information surrounding key visual elements in a media work (such as a film or television program, or theatrical performance) for the benefit of blind and visually impaired consumers. These narrations are typically placed during natural pauses in the audio, and sometimes during dialogue if deemed necessary.

It's not like director commentary or anything like that. It's to help those who are visually impaired to follow along with the movie. Most audio descriptors will truncate stuff so the viewer can get an idea of what's happening, especially if they don't have a lot of time to cover what's happening.

What kind of sense does it make for us to disregard that Disney+ audio commentary,

It's not audio commentary. It's an audio description. An audio commentary would be like director or actor commentary where its someone involved in the project speaking about stuff as the movie is playing/going on. Audio description is a narrator explaining scenes so someone who's visually impaired can better follow what's happening.

 

[ParkerKent007]

An object that dense and that small would collapse in a black hole under any set of physics.

I purposely left out mention of black holes because that has been disputed here before. Yet, as I long ago noted here, Jane's lecture also gives both the Schwarzschild radius formula for black holes, and the visual imagery for wormholes immediately below it, and in the same movie she defines wormholes as Einstein-Rosen Bridges, which by definition produce black holes.

---

Ragnorak even has Banner, Thor and Valkyrie state that the Einstein-Rosen Bridge on Sakaar has a destructive singularity that can destroy ships. Singularities only exist inside black holes, or the Big Bang.

---


Yet that line of thought was rejected here for the Bifrost. So if it's legit to reference black hole radius to debunk MCU Thor feats, it should be legit to use black hole radius to acknowledge when they actually occur in Thor events.

But something tells me there will be no retroactive revising of Thor tanking the Bifrost beam explosion in Thor 1. So I think we should set aside all reference to black holes in this discussion.

 

[ParkerKent007]

Do you not know what an Audio Descriptor is for?
It's not like director commentary or anything like that. It's to help those who are visually impaired to follow along with the movie. Most audio descriptors will truncate stuff so the viewer can get an idea of what's happening, especially if they don't have a lot of time to cover what's happening.

Nothing about the factual information you just provided suggests that the audio description is wrong:

Audio description, also referred to as a video description, described video, or more precisely called a visual description, is a form of narration used to provide information surrounding key visual elements in a media work (such as a film or television program, or theatrical performance) for the benefit of blind and visually impaired consumers. These narrations are typically placed during natural pauses in the audio, and sometimes during dialogue if deemed necessary.

 

[theultimate5105]

I will Repeat What I said the last time
That is purely theoretical and could be off by dozens of orders of magnitude

 

[Qawsedf234]

I purposely left out mention of black holes because that has been disputed here before.

The reason it was rejected before is that all of the examples you attempted to use were wrong or flawed in some capacity.

Yet that line of thought was rejected here for the Bifrost.

Because the Bifrost is based on the Space Stone. The only other examples brought for portals were all rejected because the movie or show provided information that went against the idea they were producing quintillions of watts per second as well.

Nothing about the factual information you just provided suggests that the audio description is wrong:

Its why I mentioned other segments of that audio description. They call Earth's moon "The Moon" and the Sun "The Sun". It's just generic word descriptors rather than WoG.

 

[ParkerKent007]

Its why I mentioned other segments of that audio description. They call Earth's moon "The Moon" and the Sun "The Sun". It's just generic word descriptors rather than WoG.

How else would you describe them? "The rock that orbits the Earth" or "the glowing sphere in the night sky" and "the star that the Earth orbits" or "the glowing sphere in the day sky" ...? In the example you just gave, "the Moon" and "the Sun" are the only logical descriptions, which even by your statement are clearly different objects than what is referred to in the Shadow Realm.

 

[Qawsedf234]

How else would you describe them?

That's the point. It's a way to convey a scene to someone quickly. The use these generic descriptors multiple times to make sure the listener has an easier time to follow along but that doesn't mean it's correct contextually.

As for the context "Gorr's moon" or "Lit by a star" would convey the same intention.

 

[ParkerKent007]

That's the point. It's a way to convey a scene to someone quickly. The use these generic descriptors multiple times to make sure the listener has an easier time to follow along but that doesn't mean it's correct contextually.

As for the context "Gorr's moon" or "Lit by a star" would convey the same intention.

Look at the star in question in this video. Note the movement of its glimmering light. The star is moving upward, even though all the other stars in the background are not moving. Only the flying chunks of rock also are moving. If this was just some random star, and not the star that orbits the moon of the Shadow Realm, why would this star be the only one moving? How does it make more sense for this one moving star here to be a different star than the star we already saw orbiting the moon of the Shadow Realm?