MCU and Sorcerers

[CrimsonStarFallen]

Currently we have Doctor Strange, along with other Sorcerers, listed as Unknown in AP due to this CRT deciding the Sorcerers have no magic attacks that are directly AP, and thus they have nothing to scale to. Putting aside how this wasn't edited into the pages, how we were left with circular scaling withh no explanations as to why they are unknown, and how the CRT was not linked in the edit, so I had to spend a hour searching for it; the actual change itself is wrong. We do actually see him use offensive magic, and it does have a measuring stick.

Episode 4 of What If, Strange shoots blasts of energy that disintegrates animals created by Strange Supreme. And when Strange Supreme launched these, not only did he preasure Strange's shield, but he actually destroyed a few of them. Even better, he tears away at his protection spell that was crafted by both him and Wong with prep.

Strange's shields, as well as any Sorcerer's worth their salt really, is 7-B from tanking shots from Thanos's ship, so he should scale. Pre-Infinity War included, since both Stranges are equal to each other, so all this confirms really is that Strange's AP is somewhat comparable to his defensive powers.

 

[AbaddonTheDisappointment]

While I do agree that Unknown is probably not the best for their AP, Strange Supreme, given the amount of beings he absorbed, should be more powerful than regular Strange, aka the one who fought him so if anything the destruction of those shields would only scale to him.

Also means Strange Supreme is At least 7-B physically cuz he punched away the protection spell but that's more an outlier

 

[CrimsonStarFallen]

Not exactly, after all, this was before Strange Supreme absorbed normal Strange. Because of the Ancient One's split, they were equal in power.

 

[AbaddonTheDisappointment]

Not exactly, after all, this was before Strange Supreme absorbed normal Strange. Because of the Ancient One's split, they were equal in power.

Hmm, fair enough I guess. Scaling should be fine as long as we allow cross scaling between What If and main MCU cuz I remember that was something being contested before.

Also now all I can think of is At least 7-B physicals for Strange Supreme lol

 

[PsychoWarper]

Hmm this seems like it should be fine, I definitely disagree with the Sorcerers being Unknown as I just think we have to much to go against that.

 

[Dalesean027]

Yeah this is a NWH spoiler as well but Strange also even without magic

Spoiler

tanks green goblin pumpkin bombs from point blank range which falls in line with the calc for the physicals strange had in what if.

 

[Fastestthingalive50]

Not exactly, after all, this was before Strange Supreme absorbed normal Strange. Because of the Ancient One's split, they were equal in power.

But weren't they split before Strange absorbed all those guys?

 

[Dalesean027]

But weren't they split before Strange absorbed all those guys?

Yes they were split right before he went to Cagliostro's library

 

[CrimsonStarFallen]

According to the Ancient One they were still more or less equal, Supreme just had a few hundred more years of experience.

 

[Rez]

Strange's shield also tanked a kick from Thanos and mirror dimension shield tanked a hit from power stone powered beam

 

[CrimsonStarFallen]

To be fair with the latter mirror dimension is BFR but yes.

 

[Rez]

To be fair with the latter mirror dimension is BFR but yes.

I meant this
At 0:27

 

[ArkhamDC06]

It's not really a shield, he's using the MD to counter his attack so it's more a form of Reality Warping than anything else

Saw someone suggesting the Rings could make sorcerers 6-C due to Wong slicing Cull's arm, could they be put to "9-B physically, at least 7-B via Magic, 6-C via Rings"?

 

[ArkhamDC06]

Also, I agree with the thread, sorcerers need a proper tier

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Putting aside how this wasn't edited into the pages, how we were left with circular scaling withh no explanations as to why they are unknown, and how the CRT was not linked in the edit

My bad

 

[CrimsonStarFallen]

It's not really a shield, he's using the MD to counter his attack so it's more a form of Reality Warping than anything else

Saw someone suggesting the Rings could make sorcerers 6-C due to Wong slicing Cull's arm, could they be put to "9-B physically, at least 7-B via Magic, 6-C via Rings"?

Yep.

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

Strange's shield also tanked a kick from Thanos

Which scene was this?

 

[AbaddonTheDisappointment]

Which scene was this?

Probably meant this scene. TBF, if got immediately destroyed and Strange got sent back from the kick so idk if it can scale

 

[CrimsonStarFallen]

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

Yeah, I don't think it should scale since the Tao Mandalas was completely destroyed

 

[Dalesean027]

Why is it not being mentioned that strange and bubble spells in the mirror dimension that can effect the entire universe and more, man has some crazy sealing and we saw he do the same thing to people from what if when he bubbled killmonger and zola. It might not be related to his shields but it is another defense he has

 

[CrimsonStarFallen]

Bump.

 

[CrimsonStarFallen]

Bump.²

 

[ArkhamDC06]

Bump

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

Bump

 

[ArkhamDC06]

Bump

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Bump.

 

[Blahblah9755]

According to the Ancient One they were still more or less equal, Supreme just had a few hundred more years of experience.

This actually has me a bit concerned, Supreme has clearly gotten more powerful given that that was the whole point of him slowly working up the food chain of demons. So it doesn’t really make sense unless regular Strange has somehow also gotten stronger over this time. Supreme’s statement about his power being diluted between the two of them could imply that Strange is also gaining these boosts, which would explain why he’s able to fight Supreme. Between the two statements, I’m not sure it makes sense to scale live action Strange to what if Strange (in terms of AP, magic knowledge/abilities would still be the same)

 

[ArkhamDC06]

Bump

 

[Fastestthingalive50]

According to the Ancient One they were still more or less equal, Supreme just had a few hundred more years of experience.

Do you have the statement for that though?

 

[Cropfist]

I agree with this.

 

[CrimsonStarFallen]

This actually has me a bit concerned, Supreme has clearly gotten more powerful given that that was the whole point of him slowly working up the food chain of demons. So it doesn’t really make sense unless regular Strange has somehow also gotten stronger over this time. Supreme’s statement about his power being diluted between the two of them could imply that Strange is also gaining these boosts, which would explain why he’s able to fight Supreme. Between the two statements, I’m not sure it makes sense to scale live action Strange to what if Strange (in terms of AP, magic knowledge/abilities would still be the same)

I mean if he got the boost in power, they'd be more or less equal no? My point wasn't that live action Strange is as strong as what if Strange, but that Strange's magical AP is as strong as his forcefields.

 

[Blahblah9755]

My point wasn't that live action Strange is as strong as what if Strange, but that Strange's magical AP is as strong as his forcefields.

I see, that’s fine then. I agree with the upgrades.

 

[MrKerf]

Did Strange Supreme fought Dormammu? I am a bid foggy on details.

 

[ArkhamDC06]

If by fighting you mean getting killed, impaled, obliterated, crushed, etc, over and over and over and over in the time loop for thousands of times, then yes, he did

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Did Strange Supreme fought Dormammu? I am a bid foggy on details.

The events played out like the main film, yeah. If you're asking whether strange supreme fought dormammu when he was evil? Then no

 

[MrKerf]

Ah, I see.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

This thread need more attention

 

[Dalesean027]

Were there ever any conclusions here?

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Most of the folks agree with the upgrade, so what we need now is a staffs to look over this and their evaluations