Mario vs Chara

[Da3ggman]

not really, he would need to know about something to null it, which is impossible when it goes back in time, how would he null it?

He has Acausulaity, so he wouldn't forget fighting her.

they are conscious even after death, that is how they load back, so i don't see why wouldn't they be conscious after the transmutation

Those are two very different things. One involves dying and being transported to some unknown location where they can respawn, and the other involves just turning them into something and not dying.

 

[Kazuma_kuwabara]

Not how it works. Save and Load cannot be nulled

With what feats do you argue this?

 

[Omegabronic]

He has Acausulaity, so he wouldn't forget fighting her.

okay, how does the powernull works?

Those are two very different things. One involves dying and being transported to some unknown location where they can respawn, and the other involves just turning them into something and not dying.

they are concious to reload after their soul is destroyed, does the transmutation affects the soul? because if not chara just reloads

 

[Ikelaggan]

If you got turned into solid metal via transmutation there's no real assumption to just say your automatically dead or your soul gets destroyed unless it's stated or show to have to those types aspects to declare you dead in that aspect.
Otherwise I'm voting mario

 

[Da3ggman]

okay, how does the powernull works?

He has 4 different ways of powernull, so it depends.

• Power Nullification (When using all 7 Star Spirits, Mario can negate the effects of the Star Rod. With Star Beam, Mario can remove all status ailments placed on him. With Peach Beam, Mario can nullify the invincibility granted by the Star Rod)
• Power Nullification (Using all 7 Crystal Stars, Mario nullified the invulnerability of the Shadow Queen)
• Power Nullification (Power Stars can remove the seals placed on the castle doors by Bowser)
• Power Nullification (Nullified Super Dimentio's invulnerability and Count Bleck's barrier)\\

He also has this through catch cards

• Soul Manipulation, Sealing, and Information Analysis (With Catch Card, which is stated to capture an enemies soul and display information on them. The Peekaboo badge also constantly allows Mario to view the HP of an enemy)

He has 4 different versions of his own Time Manipulation

• Time Travel (Traveled through time, via unknown means, to help his past self)
• Time Manipulation (Speed and Slow Flower, Stop Watch)
• Time Stop (Via Time Out)
• Time Stop (With Clock Out, which stops time on an enemy)

There's a lot more, but these are some of the main ones

Would EE work on Chara? Because he has a lot of EE options.

 

[ZespeonGalaxy]

You know whattt screw it Mario FRA

 

[ShionAH]

I think his equipment need to be restricted. EE is not effectivr btw

 

[Ego]

So that's 5 votes for the plumber right?

 

[ShionAH]

I think we should wait for UT supporters before voting and the debate is still on going so just count it 0-0-0 maybe?

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

Seems pretty stompish
Mario can take out Chara in several different ways (Some just via pulling out a card) while Chara has to get past all of Mario's resurrection options to even have a wincon

 

[Da3ggman]

Seems pretty stompish
Mario can take out Chara in several different ways (Some just via pulling out a card) while Chara has to get past all of Mario's resurrection options to even have a wincon

Not even including Supernatural Luck and passive Damage Nullification

 

[ZespeonGalaxy]

Not even including Supernatural Luck and passive Damage Nullification

 

[DaMonkeMan]

 

[Ikelaggan]

I think his equipment need to be restricted.

It's the OP's decision to have Mario use equipment or not.

I think we should wait for UT supporters before voting and the debate is still on going so just count it 0-0-0 maybe?

It's been two days since the thread started, they had more than enough time to put in any input.

 

[ShionAH]

It's the OP's decision to have Mario use equipment or not.

I know.

It's been two days since the thread started, they had more than enough time to put in any input.

Sure but its not a good idea to just go for FRAs since this seems like a stomp unless a UT supporter brings a good statement

 

[Dragonite007]

What Mario can do? He can't Interact with AE1

 

[Ego]

What Mario can do? He can't Interact with AE1

Read her AE1

 

[Dragonite007]

Read her AE1

I read, Mario still can't interact with Chara

 

[Roachman40]

y'know by 'all equipment' I thought it meant he just has his standard set, not the optional equipment and artifacts other than pure hearts also, haha


either way, this makes for a much more tougher matchup than previously expected.

the power nullification for mario has only been shown to nullify invulnerability it seems, so im not sure if it could a universally nullify any ability, especially something like the SAVE system. Catch Cards probably wouldn't do much, Chara's immune to SOUL manipulation and if they are sealed they could just load back to a certain SAVE point.

The AE1 for chara is a point of interest as well, even if it is under a 'possibly' it still should be acknowledged as an ability in chara's moveset, Chara quite literally became the feeling of the players statistics increasing, mario would have to somehow interact with the abstraction itself to effect chara, somehow.

so, If mario is truly unable to interact with AE1 than chara I feel still gets a win here, and even then, I dont think he could still counter the SAVE system in any effective way as I mentioned in my previous points above.

 

[Ego]

I read, Mario still can't interact with Chara

Will it work?
Because it says possibly and it's debatable

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

If we give Chara the AE1, they stomp
If we don't, Mario stomps
lel

 

[Dragonite007]

Will it work?
Because it says possibly and it's debatable

Yes, things that are described as likely or possibly in the profile can be used in the battle

 

[Omegabronic]

He has 4 different ways of powernull, so it depends.

• Power Nullification (When using all 7 Star Spirits, Mario can negate the effects of the Star Rod. With Star Beam, Mario can remove all status ailments placed on him. With Peach Beam, Mario can nullify the invincibility granted by the Star Rod)
• Power Nullification (Using all 7 Crystal Stars, Mario nullified the invulnerability of the Shadow Queen)
• Power Nullification (Power Stars can remove the seals placed on the castle doors by Bowser)
• Power Nullification (Nullified Super Dimentio's invulnerability and Count Bleck's barrier)\\

okay, but how does he do that? what motion?

He also has this through catch cards

• Soul Manipulation, Sealing, and Information Analysis (With Catch Card, which is stated to capture an enemies soul and display information on them. The Peekaboo badge also constantly allows Mario to view the HP of an enemy)

trapping sealing the soul would not work, chara would just load

He has 4 different versions of his own Time Manipulation

• Time Travel (Traveled through time, via unknown means, to help his past self)
• Time Manipulation (Speed and Slow Flower, Stop Watch)
• Time Stop (Via Time Out)
• Time Stop (With Clock Out, which stops time on an enemy)

i don't see how any of those would help, if he does anything to chara, they just reload

Would EE work on Chara? Because he has a lot of EE options.

does it work on abstracts type 1?

 

[Omegabronic]

Will it work?
Because it says possibly and it's debatable

we consider it unless the op restricts it

 

[Ego]

we consider it unless the op restricts it

Let's wait for the guy to restrict it so Mario can body this demon child

 

[Roachman40]

y'know by 'all equipment' I thought it meant he just has his standard set, not the optional equipment and artifacts other than pure hearts also, haha


either way, this makes for a much more tougher matchup than previously expected.

the power nullification for mario has only been shown to nullify invulnerability it seems, so im not sure if it could a universally nullify any ability, especially something like the SAVE system. Catch Cards probably wouldn't do much, Chara's immune to SOUL manipulation and if they are sealed they could just load back to a certain SAVE point.

The AE1 for chara is a point of interest as well, even if it is under a 'possibly' it still should be acknowledged as an ability in chara's moveset, Chara quite literally became the feeling of the players statistics increasing, mario would have to somehow interact with the abstraction itself to effect chara, somehow.

so, If mario is truly unable to interact with AE1 than chara I feel still gets a win here, and even then, I dont think he could still counter the SAVE system in any effective way as I mentioned in my previous points above.

Aye, to expand on this, what does mario usually lead with in a fight?

 

[Ikelaggan]

Weaknesses: Chara needs someone with strong enough Determination and capacity for violence to manifest and needed to possess a host to interact with the universe before they had reached a sufficiently great level of power.

Chara's AE 1 isn't really combat applicable if they're body is incaped outside of anything that isn't straight up death.

 

[Dragonite007]

Weaknesses: Chara needs someone with strong enough Determination and capacity for violence to manifest and needed to possess a host to interact with the universe before they had reached a sufficiently great level of power.

Chara's AE 1 isn't really combat applicable if they're body is incaped outside of anything that isn't straight up death.

Weaknesses: Chara needs someone with strong enough Determination and capacity for violence to manifest and needed to possess a host to interact with the universe BEFORE they had reached a sufficiently great level of power.

 

[Da3ggman]

the power nullification for mario has only been shown to nullify invulnerability it seems, so im not sure if it could a universally nullify any ability, especially something like the SAVE system.

Unless the Power Null has shown to only be able to work on invincibility, then we assume that it works on every ability up to its tier.

Catch Cards probably wouldn't do much, Chara's immune to SOUL manipulation and if they are sealed they could just load back to a certain SAVE point.

Transmutation + BFR would work.

The AE1 for chara is a point of interest as well, even if it is under a 'possibly' it still should be acknowledged as an ability in chara's moveset, Chara quite literally became the feeling of the players statistics increasing, mario would have to somehow interact with the abstraction itself to effect chara, somehow.

so, If mario is truly unable to interact with AE1 than chara I feel still gets a win here, and even then, I dont think he could still counter the SAVE system in any effective way as I mentioned in my previous points above.

I feel like the SAVE/LOAD system is really ill defined. On the page, it's legit just Time Manip, and that's it.

 

[Da3ggman]

okay, but how does he do that? what motion?

Pretty much all of them are some form of item that he pulls out to use, but the pure hearts are passive IIRC.

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

I feel like the SAVE/LOAD system is really ill defined. On the page, it's legit just Time Manip, and that's it.

That's what it is tho

 

[ShionAH]

BFR would work.

no save and load takes care of it

 

[Da3ggman]

no save and load takes care of it

Okay, how does it work exactly? Does it work exclusively on death, or can they just save and load as they please? Because I don't remember being able to do that unless you include the IRL player quitting and opening the game as we please.

 

[ShionAH]

Okay, how does it work exactly? Does it work exclusively on death, or can they just save and load as they please? Because I don't remember being able to do that unless you include the IRL player quitting and opening the game as we please.

They should be able to save and load any time AND if they die. You can reset to yout save file

 

[Da3ggman]

You can reset to yout save file

That's only with the true reset, which Chara doesn't appear to have access to.

 

[ShionAH]

That's only with the true reset, which Chara doesn't appear to have access to.

I wrote it wrong lol I meant load to your save file

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

Okay, how does it work exactly? Does it work exclusively on death, or can they just save and load as they please? Because I don't remember being able to do that unless you include the IRL player quitting and opening the game as we please.

Photoshop Flowey can LOAD without dying, so yeah, don't need to die
I think Frisk's Notable Attacks/Techniques explains it pretty well, if you're curious

 

[Omegabronic]

Unless the Power Null has shown to only be able to work on invincibility, then we assume that it works on every ability up to its tier.

ye but how does it work? he pulls and item and then what does he do do activate it? and also with the pure hearts, how does the passive work? you abilities get null by just standing next to mario?

Transmutation + BFR would work.

no, reload

I feel like the SAVE/LOAD system is really ill defined. On the page, it's legit just Time Manip, and that's it.

it is also resurrection

 

[Da3ggman]

ye but how does it work? he pulls and item and then what does he do do activate it?

They just activate once he pulls them out

and also with the pure hearts, how does the passive work? you abilities get null by just standing next to mario?

Your abilities just get nulled automatically, I think

no, reload

Can't reload if they aren't even conscious

it is also resurrection

Powernull

 

[Ikelaggan]

Photoshop Flowey can LOAD without dying, so yeah, don't need to die
I think Frisk's Notable Attacks/Techniques explains it pretty well, if you're curious

But that type of LOAD can still be powernulled. The human souls powernulled his save states before.