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Maou Gakuin mini-upgrade CRT

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Agree with everything, disagree with BDE, and for acausality, I am neutral so you can add me to the agreed list.
Dread said:
Note: You may wonder why I said mini-Upgrade CRT because I will be dropping one of the biggest CRTs for the verse next weekend. So be prepared!
Click to expand...
Can't wait
Tatsumi504 said:
Wait till you see the massive scaling revision I'm planning.
No hax involved, no tier 2 shenanigans but it'll still be controversial as heck🤓
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Ahhh war, what a lovely thing.
 
I'm back, again nothing prove Acausality 1, it literally is, when the past change, a god will fix the change not character physiology power, being bound by order is not a reason, you don't get power by being slave to a system, by this logic i can give all Dragon Ball characters acausality 1, since the verse work on the logic of branching timeline to resolve time paradox, thus you can change the past, the timeline will branch out to solve the problem. And lastly even if somehow we agree with this power, this is literally verse specific mechanic which can't be equalized in battle, because if we equalized either MG characters lost Acausality or give Source and Order to opposite characters thus they also gain power from MG due to having Order and Source

Acausality 1 for Venuzdonoa is fine i think, however negation is a no, because when you fling someone out of time, you actually grant then power like Acausality 1, not negate it
 
Vietthai96 said:
I'm back, again nothing prove Acausality 1, it literally is, when the past change, a god will fix the change not character physiology power, being bound by order is not a reason, you don't get power by being slave to a system, by this logic i can give all Dragon Ball characters acausality 1, since the verse work on the logic of branching timeline to resolve time paradox, thus you can change the past, the timeline will branch out to solve the problem. And lastly even if somehow we agree with this power, this is literally verse specific mechanic which can't be equalized in battle, because if we equalized either MG characters lost Acausality or give Source and Order to opposite characters thus they also gain power from MG due to having Order and Source

Acausality 1 for Venuzdonoa is fine i think, however negation is a no, because when you fling someone out of time, you actually grant then power like Acausality 1, not negate it
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First, this isn't Dragon Ball, second, the mechanic you described in DB isn't even close to this one. In DB the past is changed but it just created a new timeline, here the past can't be changed at all.
If you go back in time to let's say kill someone, the order of time just laughs and resets everything. The characters themselves are bound to this law most especially the gods who are AE 1 beings and embody order.

If there's no negation for Venuzdonoa then sure, I guess it can be removed.

What about the type 4?
 
Tatsumi504 said:
First, this isn't Dragon Ball, second, the mechanic you described in DB isn't even close to this one. In DB the past is changed but it just created a new timeline, here the past can't be changed at all.
If you go back in time to let's say kill someone, the order of time just laughs and resets everything. The characters themselves are bound to this law most especially the gods who are AE 1 beings and embody order.

If there's no negation for Venuzdonoa then sure, I guess it can be removed.

What about the type 4?
Click to expand...
1. Again you don't get power due being a slave the a system of the verse which both DB and MG are subjected to, which again nothing you all posted prove that it is character physiology power to resist the change in the past.

2. Not evaluate it yet
 
Acausality 1 is like just a verse mechanism. Everyone?? Just no i will says.
for the Gods??? I think it more make sense, since they maintain and embodied the order of the world that changless even if the world is change

BDE 1 and acausality 4 for sasha and misha, i dont think it will work

Everything else i think is fine
 
This took me a while to evaluate.

Agree on Heal, Regeneration, Regeneration negation, Immortality type 2 & 5 for Gods, Anos and Graham addition.

Definitely agreeing with Graham's rating changes.

BDE and Acausality reasoning is pretty shaky, so I'll just be neutral on that.

Just want to ask, so the Immortality type 9 negation Celis did with Parrington is via Probability Manipulation (which kinda busted), because Graham took Celis' power and Anos then absorbed Graham's power hence they both have Immortality type 9 negation? Is that the reasoning? Or the reasoning is because they both can use the same probability manipulation magic so they get immortality type 9 negation?
 
Overlord_THE_END said:
BDE and Acausality reasoning is pretty shaky, so I'll just be neutral on that.
Click to expand...
Acausality type 4 is existing outside of normal Causality which Sasha, Misha and Eques Qualifies.
As for Acausality type 1. Its not verse mechanism. Its just how a character is too lucky or something we give luck manipulation. Here characters past is protected by order( which is above fate in MGF)
Overlord_THE_END said:
Just want to ask, so the Immortality type 9 negation Celis did with Parrington is via Probability Manipulation (which kinda busted), because Graham took Celis' power and Anos then absorbed Graham's power hence they both have Immortality type 9 negation? Is that the reasoning? Or the reasoning is because they both can use the same probability manipulation magic so they get immortality type 9 negation?
Click to expand...
Yeah Graham's had complete power of Celis. The thing is that Probability Manipulation is only limited to Voldigoad family in MGF. Its kinda busted as hell. He created a possibility where that connection between avatar and the main body gets negged.
 
Fixxed said:
acausality 4 for sasha and misha, i dont think it will work
Click to expand...
The thing is Creator and destruction gods existed before the world even born & they are not affected by mortal world Causality. You know how mortals fate already set by god's but gods existing different from that.
 
Vietthai96 said:
Again you don't get power due being a slave the a system of the verse which both DB and MG are subjected to, which again nothing you all posted prove that it is character physiology power to resist the change in the past.
Click to expand...
EldemadeDityjon said:
Its not verse mechanism. Its just how a character is too lucky or something we give luck manipulation. Here characters past is protected by order( which is above fate in MGF)
Click to expand...
 
Again what the hell you guys trying to say here??. It literally the change in the past was fixed due to a god who is the order of time, order is a system, they are bound to a specific system within the verse that any drastical change happened it get fixed, nothing here prove it is characters inherent state of being, physiology power allow them to resist the change in the past, they need the order of time to fix the change for them, we don't give power that way
 
I kinda agree with Vietthai here.

In a versus match, the character can still get affected by changes in their past if the battle takes place where there is no "Order of Time" that actively reverse the changes. So the acausality itself is reliant on the verse system.

What if the character fight in a verse where the causality system wouldn't reverse the change?

I can get behind "Limited Acausality type 1" which is reliant on the verse mechanic.

About Acausality type 4...
Why not make an argument that Eques is accepted as Transduality type 2 and thus beyond the order of causality in the verse? That's a better argument to give acausality type 4 to Eques.
 
Overlord_THE_END said:
I kinda agree with Vietthai here.

In a versus match, the character can still get affected by changes in their past if the battle takes place where there is no "Order of Time" that actively reverse the changes. So the acausality itself is reliant on the verse system.

What if the character fight in a verse where the causality system wouldn't reverse the change?

I can get behind "Limited Acausality type 1" which is reliant on the verse mechanic.

About Acausality type 4...
Why not make an argument that Eques is accepted as Transduality type 2 and thus beyond the order of causality in the verse? That's a better argument to give acausality type 4 to Eques.
Click to expand...
Vietthai96 said:
Again what the hell you guys trying to say here??. It literally the change in the past was fixed due to a god who is the order of time, order is a system, they are bound to a specific system within the verse that any drastical change happened it get fixed, nothing here prove it is characters inherent state of being, physiology power allow them to resist the change in the past, they need the order of time to fix the change for them, we don't give power that way
Click to expand...
Well then if Mortals doesn't get Acausality type 1 that's fine but Venozdonor still needs to get Acausality type 1 negation. It completely changing what is unchangeable.

Also As I said Eques , Sasha and Misha as gods exists in different system of Causality than Mortal world well even without that they should get Acausality type 4 for being outside of Order of Silver Sea.
 
Vietthai96 said:
Again what the hell you guys trying to say here??. It literally the change in the past was fixed due to a god who is the order of time, order is a system, they are bound to a specific system within the verse that any drastical change happened it get fixed, nothing here prove it is characters inherent state of being, physiology power allow them to resist the change in the past, they need the order of time to fix the change for them, we don't give power that way
Click to expand...
What about equipments? There are some equipments that can give powers as well if we include them in a versus match.

Another thing to note is that we only arguing on an Limited type 1 that is only true within the verse and it's not because of someone (The gods of time) but because of something, The temporal Order itself that is one of the laws that make up the world and all characters within the verse abide by them.
 
Iirc, i said that Venuzdonoa acausality 1 is fine, however negation is not
EldemadeDityjon said:
@Vietthai96 @Overlord_THE_END

Anos destroyed land of traces which is collection of all past and no one got Affecting in present. Its pretty much Acausality type 1 though.
Click to expand...
Scans??.
Tserriednich said:
What about equipments? There are some equipments that can give powers as well if we include them in a versus match.

Another thing to note is that we only arguing on an Limited type 1 that is only true within the verse and it's not because of someone (The gods of time) but because of something, The temporal Order itself that is one of the laws that make up the world and all characters within the verse abide by them.
Click to expand...
Equipment bestow physiology power, however being abide to law is not the same
 
EldemadeDityjon said:
Well then if Mortals doesn't get Acausality type 1 that's fine but Venozdonor still needs to get Acausality type 1 negation. It completely changing what is unchangeable.
Click to expand...
Tilting my head 180°

I can see see the reasoning for acausality type 1 Venuzdonoa.

Agree.

For acausality type 1 negation. Once again my reasoning aligns with Vietthai here:
Vietthai96 said:
Acausality 1 for Venuzdonoa is fine i think, however negation is a no, because when you fling someone out of time, you actually grant then power like Acausality 1, not negate it
Click to expand...
Yeah, so I disagree with Acausality type 1 negation.

EldemadeDityjon said:
Also As I said Eques , Sasha and Misha as gods exists in different system of Causality than Mortal world well even without that they should get Acausality type 4 for being outside of Order of Silver Sea.
Click to expand...
I'm neutral on this.
Sasha and Misha, I can see the reasoning but am not certain enough to get my agreement. (Neutral).

Arcana and Eques is a different case, I agree that they should get acausality type 4 for being Transdual type 3 and 2 respectively to Order of Causality.
 
Vietthai96 said:
Equipment bestow physiology power, however being abide to law is not the same
Click to expand...
I see, I didn't read your comment right, I didn't see the "physiology" part. I disagree with acausality type 1 for the mortals as well.
Overlord_THE_END said:
I'm neutral on this.
Sasha and Misha, I can see the reasoning but am not certain enough to get my agreement. (Neutral).

Arcana and Eques is a different case, I agree that they should get acausality type 4 for being Transdual type 3 and 2 respectively to Order of Causality.
Click to expand...
And here I share the same thoughts with the Overlord.
 
@Vietthai96 @Overlord_THE_END

I hope this helps why they should get type 1 Acausality.

vsbattles.fandom.com

Maou Gakuin no Futekigousha Explanation Page

This page will cover Maou Gakuin no Futekigousha's Terminology and Cosmology. This page will use statements from the Maou Gakuin Web Novel and the Maou Gakuin Light Novel. This page should not be considered a complete explanation of the verse's cosmology, since the novel has not yet provided a...
vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com

Check the second world destroying spell explanation. <Gilieriam Naviem>
 
EldemadeDityjon said:
@Vietthai96 @Overlord_THE_END

I hope this helps why they should get type 1 Acausality.

vsbattles.fandom.com

Maou Gakuin no Futekigousha Explanation Page

This page will cover Maou Gakuin no Futekigousha's Terminology and Cosmology. This page will use statements from the Maou Gakuin Web Novel and the Maou Gakuin Light Novel. This page should not be considered a complete explanation of the verse's cosmology, since the novel has not yet provided a...
vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com

Check the second world destroying spell explanation. <Gilieriam Naviem>
Click to expand...
Checked it, but to be honest, i don't see anything grant Acausality 1 in that section, that Land of Trace is just a collection of past, not the literally "past" itself which can affect the present and the future due to cause and effect
EldemadeDityjon said:
Why not because no matter what past can't be changed but with Venozdonor it can still neg the past and keep the changes its literally negating the laws of Causality
Click to expand...
No, it is not, as "acausality" here is just the god of time fixed the change, if anything that Venuzdonoa feat possibly is resistance to Causality hax
 
Vietthai96 said:
Checked it, but to be honest, i don't see anything grant Acausality 1 in that section, that Land of Trace is just a collection of past, not the literally "past" itself which can affect the present and the future due to cause and effect
Click to expand...
That's literally past of all things when Anos destroyed all past got destroyed. Its even written in there.
 
EldemadeDityjon said:
Why not because no matter what past can't be changed but with Venozdonor it can still neg the past and keep the changes its literally negating the laws of Causality
Click to expand...
Acausality type 1 is not get affected by the change in the past.

The scan literally is of Anos making someone who is not aca 1 into aca 1 (unchangeable by the past).

Aca 1 negation is you able to affect someone who is certainly acausality type 1 by affecting their past or making them able to be changeable by their past.
 
Overlord_THE_END said:
Acausality type 1 is not get affected by the change in the past.

The scan literally is of Anos making someone who is not aca 1 into aca 1 (unchangeable by the past).
Click to expand...
He never did that. He changed the past without any problem even though it's unchangeable
Overlord_THE_END said:
Aca 1 negation is you able to affect someone who is certainly acausality type 1 by affecting their past or making them able to be changeable by their past.
Click to expand...
 
Vietthai96 said:
And???, can it affect the present and the future??, because all i see is he destroy a recollection of past, not the literally past
Click to expand...
He destroyed the past which is collected in the books. All pasts are stored as world copies. If he wants to change past he needs to change those information.
 
Vietthai96 said:
so no feat then, well, my disagreement still stand
Click to expand...
「然り。されど、我もまた不滅なり。この身は、痕跡の秩序。万物の過去なのだ。時を何度塗り替えようと、そこにあったという事実は変わらぬ」

　すでに過ぎ去った存在、記録と記憶が痕跡神の秩序。

　奴を滅ぼすには、過去を改変するのが望ましいだろうが、その秩序を司る神を相手に時間魔法で挑んでも勝ち目はあるまい。

　奴は確かにここにいた。
　その事実は、なにがどうあろうと変わりはしない。

　そして、それこそが過去である奴が不滅だという所以である。
　セリスが眠っている内に痕跡神を滅ぼそうとしたのがわかるというものだ。

"Yes. But I, too, am immortal. This body is the order of traces. I am the past of all things. No matter how many times I rewrite time, the fact remains that it was there."

　The existence that has already passed away, records and memories are the order of the god of traces.

　To destroy him, it would be desirable to alter the past, but there is no way to win if you use time magic against the god who controls that order.

　He was certainly here.
　That fact will never change, no matter what.

　And that is the reason why he, the past, is immortal.
　You can see why he tried to destroy the god of traces while Celis was sleeping.
Click to expand...
Land of traces is past itself. Anyway i forgot many things I can't dig anymore scans. I will wait for others
 
Overlord_THE_END said:
Hmmm, so you are suggesting Anos changes the past which is supposedly unchangeable because of Order of Time (OOT) would reverse everything by making that person unchangeable to the reverse effect of OOT?

Did I understand that correctly?
Click to expand...
Yeah. It doesn't matter as if character inheritedly has Acausality type 1 or not because Anos negating the Causality which gives Characters Acausality type 1.
 
EldemadeDityjon said:
The thing is Creator and destruction gods existed before the world even born & they are not affected by mortal world Causality. You know how mortals fate already set by god's but gods existing different from that.
Click to expand...
Then it must default ability for the gods not only for some god

I consider you guys want add aca 4 for sasha and misha because they existed before other order, in fact the time militia create the order, that time too she bound by order she created, i dont know the bound mean for every order or just her order. But they bound by order
 
For aca 1, like i says. I dont think it will work
Fixxed said:
Acausality 1 is like just a verse mechanism. Everyone?? Just no i will says.
for the Gods??? I think it more make sense, since they maintain and embodied the order of the world that changless even if the world is change
Click to expand...
 
Overlord_THE_END said:
In a versus match, the character can still get affected by changes in their past if the battle takes place where there is no "Order of Time" that actively reverse the changes. So the acausality itself is reliant on the verse system.

What if the character fight in a verse where the causality system wouldn't reverse the change?
Click to expand...
If mortals don't get it then the gods should as they're literally order.
 
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