Madoka Magica Misc Revisions (7-A and Akuma Homura)

[Jinsye]

Okay so. There are two things that have been bothering me about this verse for a while.

7-A AP
So, as far as I know, 7-A is based on... frankly nothing really. It's from massively upscaling to a 7-B feat, and also Mami Tomoe chip damaging Walpurgisnacht, who is 6-C. Neither of which should be valid for 7-A because it's not one of the two possible tiers she can scale to.

The 7-B feat is 50 megatons at the moment (if you accept creation calcs as = to destruction but that's a can of worms I do not want to open at the minute), which is a 2x difference which isn't that big but we have no real evidence to assume that our one-shot gap is that high (as we don't assume that).

If you really want to upscale, go to 7-B+, but I don't think 7-A works under our current assumptions. Chip damaging Wal means nothing btw. We don't scale to chip damage.

Homura Abilities
Most of her abilities come from here. WOG states she is a similar state of existence to Madoka, so obviously she should get all of Madoka's existential abilities, right?

Now, that's great but like.

lol.

Even if you want to ignore that, this is very clearly written by a person who isn't reliable WoG.

This is written as speculation, not actual confirmation. An author providing confirmation would not write in these languages or rely on Japanese accounts. This is most likely just a speculation page, not actual WoG.

So logically, this removes something from Homura, but it depends on how far you want to go. If you want to fully go far, you would remove Acausality type 5, Omnipresence, Abstract Existence, etc.

But this could be saved a little bit by changing the justification.

Kyubey says this. He says Homura is a new principle being born into the universe. This is similar to what he said when talking to Madoka. Add that to Homura becoming an existence known as 'evil' and her contrast as a demon to a god, you could make an argument that their state of existence is similar. But the current justification is very flimsy, and probably needs notable rewriting.

Conclusion
So, we need to downgrade 7-A and also rewrite Homura's justification for her abilities. I would like the CRT to stay on topic however, if you want to dispute the abilities themselves (for example, if you don't think Acausality type 5 is legit for other reasons) then you can deal with those in a separate thread.

 

[Everything12]

I'll wait to see if any Madoka knowledgeables have anything to add, but so far I agree with the premise.

 

[Zencha9]

i share the same opinion as everything

 

[ImmortalDread]

Biggest downgrade I ever see, wait so basically Acausality type 5, AE, omnipresence and as well as CM type 1 are removed?

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Ask @SomebodyData to come first before we just blindly agreed here, tho i'm in same side for downgrading the 7-A
Homura stuff however, need a debate first

 

[Zencha9]

it really doesn't

 

[Leafbladie]

I believe the reason for the 7-A scaling is because Mami Tomoe has an attack rating of 4.5. Characters with an attack rating of 3 (and those who scale to them) have been scaled to City Level, and characters with an attack rating of 6 (and those who scale to them) have been scaled to Island Level. 4.5 is halfway between 3 and 6, and the halfway point between 7-B and 6-C then is 7-A.

That said I don’t fully agree with Homura using weapons scaling to Mami. She did beat Charlotte, but it was pretty clear that Charlotte wasn’t properly hit by Mami’s attack, so we can’t really make any claims for her durability.

 

[Leafbladie]

Also, the ear cuff, which is a part of Homura’s Dark Orb, contains all of Madoka’s power, so I don’t think it’s a stretch to say that she has access to the same powrrs that Madoka does: https://wiki.puella-magi.net/Puella_Magi_Madoka_Magica_the_Movie:_Rebellion_Official_Guidebook_"Only_You"#Translations

 

[Jinsye]

I'm not sure if that entirely extends to her state of existence though, she can pretty easily interact with the universe unlike Madoka.

 

[Leafbladie]

I'm not sure if that entirely extends to her state of existence though, she can pretty easily interact with the universe unlike Madoka.

Are you talking about how we see Homura physically present in the universe at the end of Rebellion? If so, we could just say this a physical avatar she uses to visit the universe. When Madoka is cut off from the Law of Cycles we see her become a Magical Girl without knowledge of her omnipotence the first time, and then an ordinary school girl without knowledge of her omnipotence the second time. Likewise, the Law of Cycles is contained contained in Homura’s Ear Cuff, but could also become separated from her, something to store it away from herself like Sayaka and Nagisa did for Madoka.

The other argument you could make is that we see the contents of her Soul Gem spread out across the entire universe. The Soul Gem is in essence the totality of a Magical Girl‘s being. Her Soul has literally spread all throughout the universe, thus omnipresent.

 

[Oliver_de_jesus]

Bump

Sorry for Necro this dudes, but i nearly make a Fight with 7-A from PMMM and get lost searching their Ap values until find this

 

[Leafbladie]

Bump

Sorry for Necro this dudes, but i nearly make a Fight with 7-A from PMMM and get lost searching their Ap values until find this

Yeah, there's no real AP values to support 7-A Mami. Just the fact that her power rating in-verse averages out between a character with a 6-C feat and a character with a 7-B feat. Mami is often referred to as a league above magical girls who consistently have 7-B ratings, and even in Kamihama where Magical Girls are stronger than average, she's seen as above them.

 

[Oliver_de_jesus]

Yeah, there's no real AP values to support 7-A Mami. Just the fact that her power rating in-verse averages out between a character with a 6-C feat and a character with a 7-B feat. Mami is often referred to as a league above magical girls who consistently have 7-B ratings, and even in Kamihama where Magical Girls are stronger than average, she's seen as above them.

yep, keep in mind that being between tier 6-C and 7-B, does not necessarily mean being 7-A hell it can be the baseline of tier high 7-A, the backscaling is too big considering it's a 14x value from the tier 7-b cap to the tier 6-c baseline

 

[Leafbladie]

yep, keep in mind that being between tier 6-C and 7-B, does not necessarily mean being 7-A hell it can be the baseline of tier high 7-A, the backscaling is too big considering it's a 14x value from the tier 7-b cap to the tier 6-c baseline

Again, it's more the fact that it's the average between them. A character with a offensive rating of 3 is city level, while a character with a rating of 6 is island level. 4.5 being halfway between them seems like it should fall somewhere in the middle. Mami also commonly one shots Witches, which is rather impressive, as most Magical Girl are not capable of doing that. It just suggests a superior level of strength to the characters in 7-B, and it's not done through any hax, she's just stronger than them.