Luck Voltia VS Kamen Rider Vulcan [GRACE END](2-7-0)

[BERRIES555]

Oh okay, so do the people Luck fight cannot predict his moves because he doesn't have Ki?

 

[Jamesthetaker]

Because that's via RPL.

Magna came in the fight way later. Before that, Luck was trading blows with Vetto who previously made him bleed in one strike.

I don't understand a single word of what you said here

He doesn't predict the entire match from what you shared, just the possibilities of the opponent's next moves.

RPL doesn't make you into Low 6-B suddenly like that. The only reason Luck can keep up with him is speed.

Character who is slower than Luck can still react to him like Vetto and Lotus. Vulcan with speed amp and RPL should have counter against him.

Vulcan being able to predict many possibilities of the opponent's basically mean he have control of the matches since every moves Luck throw out would been predicted.

 

[Epsilon_R]

Oh okay, so do the people Luck fight cannot predict his moves because he doesn't have Ki?

Every living being has ki

 

[BERRIES555]

Every living being has ki

Okay but don't say that Luck doesn't have Ki but then say that all living beings have Ki.

 

[Epsilon_R]

RPL doesn't make you into Low 6-B suddenly like that. The only reason Luck can keep up with him is speed.

Yes it can, it depends on how good one RPL is.

Character who is slower than Luck can still react to him like Vetto and Lotus. Vulcan with speed amp and RPL should have counter against him.

Lotus could keep up with Luck's first strike, he got blitzed in the second.
Nerfed Luck was so slow Lotus made fun of him, Luck still blitzed Lotus in the next strike
Vetto nearly blitzed Luck, Luck dodges his next strike with ease and even notices split second openings in his fighting style

They were clearly not slower than him before he adapts

Vulcan being able to predict many possibilities of the opponent's basically mean he have control of the matches since every moves Luck throw out would been predicted.

Sure, like anyone with Precog could do. Why would that be different here?

 

[Epsilon_R]

Okay but don't say that Luck doesn't have Ki but then say that all living beings have Ki.

You don't understand, he has ki but doesn't have ki sensing

 

[Nicetoderp]

Sure, like anyone with Precog could do. Why would that be different here?

Because there’s a clear scaling chain of people out-predicting each other? Especially when basically seeing through various possibilities through that as well? Can you prove that?

And with overwhelming AP along with explosion, Luck can literally get gibbed from the first hit. Never mind if he was tagged with more potent stuff

 

[BERRIES555]

Fuwa's precog vastly matches Luck's own. WIth the fact that he could react to Luck even with the speed boost and that Fuwa has his own RPL and speed amps, he would be able to land the stinger and beat Luck.

 

[Jamesthetaker]

Yes it can, it depends on how good one RPL is.

Lotus could keep up with Luck's first strike, he got blitzed in the second.
Nerfed Luck was so slow Lotus made fun of him, Luck still blitzed Lotus in the next strike
Vetto nearly blitzed Luck, Luck dodges his next strike with ease and even notices split second openings in his fighting style

They were clearly not slower than him before he adapts

Sure, like anyone with Precog could do. Why would that be different here?

Luck RPL apparently weren't good enough, if not then he would have a Low 6-B key now.

None of them have RPL and speed amp to keep up with him, unlike Vulcan. Unless you can proven that Luck amp is far beyond Vulcan then their speed are the same regardless.

Actually, let look back some of Luck earliest matches:

• The fight against Lotus have Asta and Noelle assisting him.
• The fight against four priest is a stomp and we don't even know how its happen.
• The fight against Vetto have Maga assisting him and they loss. Later they team up with Black Bull and manage to make him kneel.
• The fight against Team L, its a team battle so he have supporters as well.

So almost every fights he only won via combine with his team mates, the only fight he fought alone was against Lotus. None of them are the same as Vulcan who have a right amount of abilities to counter against him and a unique fight style different from what he've seen.

 

[Jamesthetaker]

It's late in my place. Will come back tomorrow.

 

[Epsilon_R]

Because there’s a clear scaling chain of people out-predicting each other? Especially when basically seeing through various possibilities through that as well? Can you prove that?

Proving what exactly?

And with overwhelming AP along with explosion, Luck can literally get gibbed from the first hit. Never mind if he was tagged with more potent stuff

The AP gap isn't that overwhelming. He's just 3x Above BC AP calc, which Luck's scales far higher than that. Not only that but the gap is irrelevant due to RPL and Stats amps

 

[Epsilon_R]

I don't get it, do you guys think Luck has precog or something?

 

[BERRIES555]

Does he not? This entire time I thought that he had precog. This honestly just makes Fuwa's own precog even better in this match

 

[Nicetoderp]

Proving what exactly?

Prove that Luck kept up with people who have Precog that actually matter.

Vetto and Asta Precog is considerably small fry to people who considered prediticing 25,000 possibilities on how a fight can goes down in less than a second as small fry at best, and literally useless at worse.

Is there any Precog user that Luck have fought that’s actually better than that?

 

[Epsilon_R]

None of them have RPL and speed amp to keep up with him, unlike Vulcan. Unless you can proven that Luck amp is far beyond Vulcan then their speed are the same regardless

I've already proven so

Actually, let look back some of Luck earliest matches:

• The fight against Lotus have Asta and Noelle assisting him.
• The fight against four priest is a stomp and we don't even know how its happen.
• The fight against Vetto have Maga assisting him and they loss. Later they team up with Black Bull and manage to make him kneel.
• The fight against Team L, its a team battle so he have supporters as well.

That's irrelevant to the point.
*Luck Blitzed Lotus way before Asta came
*I don't see why you're bringing this fight, no one has mentioned it
*What? First off, Vetto never kneeled in this entire arc. Second, that doesn't change the fact that he was able to harm Vetto before Magna comes
*Irrelevant fight

 

[Epsilon_R]

Does he not? This entire time I thought that he had precog. This honestly just makes Fuwa's own precog even better in this match

How so

Prove that Luck kept up with people who have Precog that actually matter.

Vetto and Asta Precog is considerably small fry to people who considered prediticing 25,000 possibilities on how a fight can goes down in less than a second as small fry at best, and literally useless at worse.

Is there any Precog user that Luck have fought that’s actually better than that?

Unless he predicts possibilities of the entire fight and chose the suiting one, it doesn't matter

 

[BERRIES555]

How so

Literally every single scene I used to show Fuwa's precog scaling.

Unless he predicts possibilities of the entire fight and chose the suiting one, it doesn't matter

It's not like Midnighter where we will try to get to his desired outcome. It's literally just precognition. Fuwa would be able to predict where Luck would be and how Luck would attack. Far weaker characters have done this.

 

[Epsilon_R]

Literally every single scene I used to show Fuwa's precog scaling.

It's not like Midnighter where we will try to get to his desired outcome. It's literally just precognition. Fuwa would be able to predict where Luck would be and how Luck would attack. Far weaker characters have done this.

Then that wouldn't stop Luck from avoiding the attacks

 

[BERRIES555]

The fact that it's precog and that Z1 fights have people predicting what the other person with predict. And the fact that even with his speed amps, Fuwa could still react. Again, still not counting Fuwa's own RPL or speed amps. Just his precog.

 

[Epsilon_R]

The fact that it's precog and that Z1 fights have people predicting what the other person with predict.

Vetto was able to predict Asta and Yami as well

And the fact that even with his speed amps, Fuwa could still react. Again, still not counting Fuwa's own RPL or speed amps. Just his precog.

Again, Luck went from being slower to blitzing in one attempt with RPL alone, he still has several stats amps aside from that

 

[BERRIES555]

Vetto was able to predict Asta and Yami as well

Okay, what does that have to do with Luck vs Fuwa. Can Luck fight Vetto even with Vetto's own precog and can he do this without the speed amp?

Again, Luck went from being slower to blitzing in one attempt with RPL alone, he still has several stats amps aside from that

Okay, Fuwa could still react with the initial speed amp without any problem. Also, Luck would have to speed amp himself and have his RPL kick in before Fuwa hits him once with the stinger.

 

[Epsilon_R]

Okay, what does that have to do with Luck vs Fuwa. Can Luck fight Vetto even with Vetto's own precog and can he do this without the speed amp?

Because Luck can dodge attacks from Precog users, who can predict other Precog users.

Yes

Okay, Fuwa could still react with the initial speed amp without any problem. Also, Luck would have to speed amp himself before Fuwa hits him once with the stinger.

He doesn't need to speed amp to dodge that unless Fuwa speed amps himself, and that's assuming the stinger would have his speed increased too

 

[BERRIES555]

Because Luck can dodge attacks from Precog users, who can predict other Precog users.

Fuwa has also done that but to a much higher degree due to his scale chain negging the person lower than them.

He doesn't need to speed amp to dodge that unless Fuwa speed amps himself, and that's assuming the stinger would have his speed increased too

Fuwa's precog would allow him to predict where Luck would be. Far weaker precogs could do that.

 

[Epsilon_R]

Fuwa has also done that but to a much higher degree due to his scale chain negging the person lower than them.

Whatever this is supposed to mean

Fuwa's precog would allow him to predict where Luck would be. Far weaker precogs could do that.

Look, just because you have precog doesn't mean you'll automatically hit. No matter how good the Precog is, it doesn't increase his speed so he won't be guaranteed to hit unless he speed amps, which Luck can also do

 

[BERRIES555]

Whatever this is supposed to mean

I'm literally just saying that Fuwa's precog is far better than Vetto

Look, just because you have precog doesn't mean you'll automatically hit. No matter how good the Precog is, it doesn't increase his speed so he won't be guaranteed to hit unless he speed amps, which Luck can also do

Other than getting close, how is Luck supposed to beat Fuwa? And if Luck has ranged attacks, Fuwa could easily just dodge them or use his summons to block them.

 

[Epsilon_R]

I'm literally just saying that Fuwa's precog is far better than Vetto

Why would "negging the person below them" puts him above vetto in Precog?

Other than getting close, how is Luck supposed to beat Fuwa? And if Luck has ranged attacks, Fuwa could easily just dodge them or use his summons to block them.

And Luck is skilled at dodging at blank range so that doesn't change anything

 

[BERRIES555]

Why would "negging the person below them" puts him above vetto in Precog?

In Zero-One, if your precog is strong enough, it would negate weaker people's precog. Literally, you're opponent wont be able to keep up with you because they're predicting many steps ahead of you. Vetto predicted attacks from Asta and Yami, going off of what was said before, their Ki sensing is higher then people who can predict several possibilities. That's literally Shining Arithmetic level, which Fuwa is vastly above.

And Luck is skilled at dodging at blank range so that doesn't change anything

Except for the fact that with his precog, Fuwa can know where Luck would be attacking. I know, just because you have precog doesn't mean you can 100% land a hit, but Fuwa's precog is higher than anything Luck has seen at the time where we're placing this fight.

 

[IxaSaga2]

Vulcan literally has an Aoe freeze that can freeze people solid.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

BUMP!!

 

[Jamesthetaker]

I've already proven so

That's irrelevant to the point.
*Luck Blitzed Lotus way before Asta came
*I don't see why you're bringing this fight, no one has mentioned it
*What? First off, Vetto never kneeled in this entire arc. Second, that doesn't change the fact that he was able to harm Vetto before Magna comes
*Irrelevant fight

Again, you insist on Luck speed amp being way beyond Vulcan but have yet to proven that his amp can outmatch someone else with similar ability. Luck can blitz Vetto but he isn't untouchable, Vetto can still read his Ki then send him down.

It's relevant to this match because its shown how much experience Luck gained through those matches.

• Lotus weren't much of challenge to him so it's borderline stomp.
• Okay, maybe i'm misinformed on that part but the Black Bull effort can't keep him down for good. Luck fires a Thunderclap Crumbling Orb into Vetto's chest, but he shrug it off then compliments his speed.

So far, Luck only have one tough battle and he lost in the end. He's quick to adapt and find weakness but rely on speed to outmatch enemy. Vetto know this and he can still read Luck moves despite his speed. Don't forget that Vetto was fighting both Luck and Magna at the same time and he was quick enough to put up a shield when they attack him.

Overall, he is less experienced than what you thought and he have trouble against enemy with higher AP and experience (Vetto) even with Magna help. His tendency to rush into battle is a problem because he doesn't know what kind of danger he'll faced, especially since his opponent in this match is much different than what he have seen before.

This is not the fight where Luck could just blitz them and call it a day. This is one enemy that is better than him in everything; abilities, experience, physical strength. He doesn't have a particular fighting style to be easily analyzed and had faced people like him many times. He have gun to snip him from afar and defensive ability to block his attack. His own version of speed amp and RPL which is better than Luck due having more feats.

If you show me one feat of Luck adaption over Ki sensing then i could show you ten of Vulcan. Just to clarify that his power come from a scaling chain with one being superior than another, and not a bare bone ability that happened once then don't get mention again.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Well, guess my vote goes to Vulcan based from James and the other KR supporters arguments above

 

[Sonicflare9]

vulcan fra

 

[BERRIES555]

It's already pretty obvious my vote goes to Vulcan.

 

[Nicetoderp]

Bump

 

[Nullkarot00]

It's already pretty obvious my vote goes to Vulcan.

I know its over but same

 

[Nicetoderp]

Grace end. This should be decent enough to added