Lucario VS Sonic the Hedgehog (X)

[LeoEpicGamer8910]

Mega Lucario used. Base Sonic used. Speed equalized. Both bloodlusted. SBA for anything else.

Lucario: 1

Sonic: 4

Incon:

 

[LaserPrecision]

Does Greninja scale to baseline Island level orrr? Depending on where they scale kind of drastically changes the outcome.

 

[It_is_i_wyatt]

Does Greninja scale to baseline Island level orrr? Depending on where they scale kind of drastically changes the outcome.

pretty sure he scales to the nearly 16 gigatons value, check the verse page

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

Ash-Greninja is comparable to Mega Evolutions, who themselves scale to Gigantamax Pokémon (there are many example of this in the anime) who have a 5 times multiplier from Base

Sonic is 30 Gigatons iirc

 

[LeoEpicGamer8910]

Bump

 

[Sans2345]

How strong is Sonic and Greninja in AP?

 

[Ego]

What's the skill difference between the two?
Because Ash Greninja is a very good fighter for battling a lot of Pokémon along with having shadow clone jitsu and other tricks that would confuse Sonic

 

[Sans2345]

What's the skill difference between the two?
Because Ash Greninja is a very good fighter for battling a lot of Pokémon along with having shadow clone jitsu and other tricks that would confuse Sonic

iirc base Sonic should be able to use chaos control and stop time, as that would give him a slight advantage to find out which Greninja is the real one.

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

iirc base Sonic should be able to use chaos control and stop time, as that would give him a slight advantage to find out which Greninja is the real one.

Double team can also only go so far, so Sonic will find it eventually

 

[Ego]

iirc base Sonic should be able to use chaos control and stop time, as that would give him a slight advantage to find out which Greninja is the real one.

Is chaos emeralds Sonics standard equipment?
Because of the time through out the show only shadow always has them and I don't see a single scene where sonic ever uses them for combat in his base form

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

Is chaos emeralds Sonics standard equipment?

Yes. It's on the page

 

[Ego]

I also want to know the AP difference

 

[Ego]

Yes. It's on the page

This makes no sense...

Throughout the show we see he doesn't casually have a chaos emerald
It's mostly missing
Even at the end of the series the chaos emeralds are all gone(tbf I don't remember much about the show)

 

[LaserPrecision]

I mean if Greninja scales to 16 Gigatons, Sonic could one-shot with a ring once used as he can one shot opponents who were previously comparable or superior.

 

[Ego]

I mean if Greninja scales to 16 Gigatons, Sonic could one-shot with a ring once used as he can one shot opponents who were previously comparable or superior.

It's like using a tank against a fly
Greninja is not gonna stand there and take it to the face

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

It's like using a tank against a fly
Greninja is not gonna stand there and take it to the face

Speed is equal, and Sonic can amp his speed with the rings as well to outspeed Greninja. Given they're bloodlusted, Sonic likely uses Chaos Control and wins that way

 

[Ego]

Speed is equal, and Sonic can amp his speed with the rings as well to outspeed Greninja. Given they're bloodlusted, Sonic likely uses Chaos Control and wins that way

Until the AP is accurate then this is a stomp and Greninja should be replaced with one of the big guns of this tier
Gengar or Alakazam

 

[Ego]

Because if Greninja has an AP that could one shot sonic and this should be fair

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

Is chaos emeralds Sonics standard equipment?
Because of the time through out the show only shadow always has them and I don't see a single scene where sonic ever uses them for combat in his base form

This is incorrect. Base Sonic used two Chaos Emeralds in combat in Episode 13.

 

[Epsilon_R]

I don't see what stops sonic from Chaos Controling him

 

[Ego]

This is incorrect. Base Sonic used two Chaos Emeralds in combat in Episode 13.

He used it just to amp his speed and power

Greninja has the move haze which can eliminate amps and stat changes as well as using moves like substitute and shadow clone jitsu as well as increasing the power of his signature move by combining the clones

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

He used it just to amp his speed and power

Okay, but you claimed he had never used them in base.

Greninja has the move haze which can eliminate amps and stat changes as well as using moves like substitute and shadow clone jitsu as well as increasing the power of his signature move by combining the clones

Sonic’s amps allow him to blitz and one shot opponents that were initially comparable to him so Greninja would be defeated before he could resort to his counters.

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

He used it just to amp his speed and power

Greninja has the move haze which can eliminate amps and stat changes as well as using moves like substitute and shadow clone jitsu as well as increasing the power of his signature move by combining the clones

If you're using the anime Ash-Greninja, then that Greninja doesn't have haze. In the games fair enough but there he can't use the giant water shuriken since it's anime only

 

[Ego]

Okay, but you claimed he had never used them in base.

Sonic’s amps allow him to blitz and one shot opponents that were initially comparable to him so Greninja would be defeated before he could resort to his counters.

Greninja already would've set him his arena full of fake clones and substitute so the match would be difficult for Sonic

 

[Sans2345]

i'm gonna vote for Sonic, he should be able to one-shot Greninja while being able to stop time.

 

[Ego]

i'm gonna vote for Sonic, he should be able to one-shot Greninja while being able to stop time.

But he doesn't even time stop while bloodlust

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

Greninja already would've set him his arena full of fake clones and substitute so the match would be difficult for Sonic

Double team can only take him so far since Sonic would be able to reach the Greninjas, and Substitute hurts Greninja's health so it'd make him weaker

 

[Ego]

Double team can only take him so far since Sonic would be able to reach the Greninjas, and Substitute hurts Greninja's health so it'd make him weaker

That's a game mechanic to damage the Pokémon to balance the game

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

But he doesn't even time stop while bloodlust

Sonic was never bloodlusted in the show. And he used Chaos Control in Base, meaning he can use it here, especially due to bloodlust

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

That's a game mechanic to damage the Pokémon to balance the game

Even in the anime it drains the stamina of the user

 

[Ego]

Sonic was never bloodlusted in the show. And he used Chaos Control in Base, meaning he can use it here, especially due to bloodlust

He was bloodlust when he was Dark sonic and sure as hell didn't go for chaos control

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

He was bloodlust when he was Dark sonic and sure as hell didn't go for chaos control

Because he had no emeralds at the time? And he wasn't bloodlusted, as Eggman could still reason with him and convince him to power down

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

He was bloodlust when he was Dark sonic and sure as hell didn't go for chaos control

Vs Match induced bloodlust basically means characters will use their best hax abilities.

 

[Ego]

Because he had no emeralds at the time? And he wasn't bloodlusted, as Eggman could still reason with him and convince him to power down

But how is the chaos emeralds still standard equipment if he usually just takes them from someone and then they're gone the next episode?

That still boggles me

 

[Ego]

Vs Match induced bloodlust basically means characters will use their best hax abilities.

I thought it means they will only use the hax or what action they will do while bloodlust that's shown in canon

Every sonic matchup in this site he always has to be bloodlust or else the opponent would stomp

I'm not even sure it matters because Greninja hax are trash and I still don't know the clear AP difference

 

[LeoEpicGamer8910]

i'm gonna vote for Sonic, he should be able to one-shot Greninja while being able to stop time.

Counted

 

[LeoEpicGamer8910]

bump

 

[jojo123]

sonic FRA

 

[LeoEpicGamer8910]

sonic FRA

counted

 

[Ego]

What wincon does Greninja even have here?
He probably has a inferior AP and doesn't have any hax that are affective