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LOL Dark Star / Cosmic Court Downgrade

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WeeklyBattles said:
The Void is not 2-A
Thresh himself stated he ate the void. Nothing implies this was done by the Dark Star itself

And yes, i am trying harder than anything i have ever done in my ntire life. This might mean nothing to you but it means everything to me.
Click to expand...
Thresh states "we have looked into the void and consumed it". He uses a plural here, and while he has sometimes used the 'royal we', he has also referred to himself in the singular, and his methods, which I have aptly presented in the first paragraph of my arguent summary, are all shown to be via feeding the Dark Star.

I'm not going to be swayed by an appeal to your motives. If the ratings of some fictional characters on one website on the internet means everything to you, I think you need to re-evaluate your priorities.
 
Thresh constantly talks about himself in the third person, a fact you seem to like ignoring
 
Monarch Laciel said:
And before you argue "oh that's just how he talks, it's the royal we", here are many other quotes where he refers to himself in singular

"I am the herald of reality's end."

"I will carve my way across the stars."

"I will guide them beyond the brink of infinity."

"Soul or no, I will feed it to the nothingness."

"Infinity, rapture, I am their harbinger."

"Oh, how I long for the final kiss of annihilation."

"I envy those who journey into the nothingness."

"I will chain the very heavens and drag them down."

Look at you. I think I'll keep you... or not."

"My pull is inexorable."

"Feel my power."

"Their screams sing me to my eternal sleep."
Click to expand...
Not so constantly as you seem to think.
 
Hell even if he were talking about every coruptant working together thats still an infinite realm consumed in a finite amount of time as there's still no evidence of the Dark Star itself doing anything

Also the Dark Star and its corruptants are stated to be able to move through time and space at will
 
No evidence apart from literally how Thresh does his thing? No evidence apart from all the lore pointing out that Thresh just feeds stuff to the Dark Star until it gets strong enough to do the job itself?

Where? Also they do generally have portals, so that's not really indicitive of immeasurable speed. Dimensional travel and maybe time travel at best, depending on the quote.
 
Correct, because all of the black holes that the Corruptants have are what they use to feed the Dark Star. The Dark Star exists outside of reality as a whole, which in and of itself is evidence that the Dark Star is not the one doing anything here.

Lots of characters with immeasurable and infinte speed have portals, that doesnt discredit their speed in any way.
 
The Dark Star ca exist outside reality, but it also enters reality itself. This is demonstrated in the lore of several corruptants where it is stated the Dark Star passed by a solar system or supergiant star, erased it, and remade it into a corruptant, as well as the short story where Thresh guides the Dark Star to stars and planets, rather than just feeding it through his black hole. Therefore, your evidence that the dark star is not the one doing anything is false.

That's a fallacy.
 
It doesnt actually, this was directly stated by the devs as well as in the new lore, its the whole reason why it creates the corruptants and needs them to feed it in the first place

Not really? Unless youre claiming youre using a fallacy which is true as youre using fallacy of belief with the claim that 'they use portals so they cant be infinite/immeasurable speed' which is facutally wrong and a fallicious statement.
 
What new lore, the most recently released lore is that Thresh guides the Dark Star around the universe so it can feed on things. "Where we build, he guides the Dark Star to consume". That's pretty blatant that the Dark Star exists in the universe. Hell Lux even says she wants to seal it in a fixed point in space, she doesn't want it moving around eating things the court has created anymore. "And when I best Thresh and seal the Dark Star into a fixed point in space, away from the brilliance of the creation we have worked so hard to build… perhaps at last I will also quiet the tireless voice, and be free of this cursed part of me"

Your fallacy is that you are beginning on the assumption they are infinite/immeasurable and then trying to say that them having portals doesn't disprove it, instead of trying to actually prove they are immeasurable/infinite to begin with. You are also now using a strawman fallacy by claiming that my argument was "having portals means they can't be infinite/immeasurable" when in fact it was countering your argument by saying that "moving through time and space at will" is most reasonably interpreted as them being able to use their portals to move where they want rather than immeasurable speed.

And on that note, you haven't provided any proof of this "move through time and space at will" to begin with.
 
I think that Monarch's evaluation males sense. My apologies Weekly.
 
Monarch Laciel said:
Your fallacy is that you are beginning on the assumption they are infinite/immeasurable and then trying to say that them having portals doesn't disprove it, instead of trying to actually prove they are immeasurable/infinite to begin with. You are also now using a strawman fallacy by claiming that my argument was "having portals means they can't be infinite/immeasurable" when in fact it was countering your argument by saying that "moving through time and space at will" is most reasonably interpreted as them being able to use their portals to move where they want rather than immeasurable speed.
Click to expand...
Multiple feats and statements of infinite and immeasurable speed already support it, youre simply trying to dismiss the fact that they have these feats by suggesting that because they use portals that these feats dont exist. Nothing implies the time travel with portals and the dark stars themselves dont even HAVE portals.
 
It is fallacious to claim that all of their feats of physically moving fast are all done through portals when they havent even used portals at any point in the lore and the dark stars dont even use portals to begin with

Serously since youre apparently so well versed in their lore please show me where its stated or even implied that their feats are done through portals
 
WeeklyBattles said:
https://leagueoflegends.fandom.com/wiki/Lux/Quotes#Dark Cosmic

The Dark Star tumbles through space and time unbound, all consuming. I... will reign as its master.
Click to expand...
Yeah that doesn't say anything about moving through time and space at will or give any impression of immeasurable speed. It's just a fancy way of saying it moves through the universe/multiverse eating everything
 
WeeklyBattles said:
Multiple feats and statements of infinite and immeasurable speed already support it, youre simply trying to dismiss the fact that they have these feats by suggesting that because they use portals that these feats dont exist.
Click to expand...
There are neither explicit feats nor statements of this. There is only your stretched interpretation of more vague statements, while ignoring the actually demonstrated and shown non-immeasurable / infinite speed feats that they do have.

Nothing implies the time travel with portals and the dark stars themselves dont even HAVE portals. Yes they do. You can see them in some of their splash art and some of their recall animations. Antvasima said:
I think that Monarch's evaluation males sense. My apologies Weekly.
Click to expand...
Weekly, Rocker and Alonik are the only ones still disagreeing (And Alonik agrees with some parts), everyone else support or appears to support the changes. Shall I begin making them?
 
I think that you can probably apply this, yes.
 
Monarch Laciel said:
Yeah that doesn't say anything about moving through time and space at will or give any impression of immeasurable speed. It's just a fancy way of saying it moves through the universe/multiverse eating everything
Click to expand...
>Literally says it moves through space and time

>Doesnt say anything about moving through space and time

I sincerly hope youre kidding
 
Monarch Laciel said:
There are neither explicit feats nor statements of this. There is only your stretched interpretation of more vague statements, while ignoring the actually demonstrated and shown non-immeasurable / infinite speed feats that they do have.

Yes they do. You can see them in some of their splash art and some of their recall animations.

Weekly, Rocker and Alonik are the only ones still disagreeing (And Alonik agrees with some parts), everyone else support or appears to support the changes. Shall I begin making them?
Click to expand...
Cnosuming a realm of infinite size in a finite ammount of time is an infinite speed feat. Existing before time was created is an infinite speed feat. Viewing time, space, and distance as finite illusions is an infinite speed feat. There is nothing stretched about this. ALL CHARACTERS WITH INFINITE AND IMMEASURABLE SPEED HAVE NON-INFINITE AND NON-IMMEASUREABLE SPEED FEATS.

Prove they time travel with them

Any changes you make will be reverted. I am dead serious. I am not okay with you applying changes that have not been agreed on.
 
WeeklyBattles said:
>Literally says it moves through space and time

>Doesnt say anything about moving through space and time

I sincerly hope youre kidding
Click to expand...
Let me rephrase that

It doesn't say moving through space and time in the sense that would grant immeasurable speed.
 
Honestly, i want to know. Not once is it stated or shown that the Dark Stars use portals and the Cosmics, which do, are not stated to be capable of time travel with them, on top of being able to treat time itself as a physical object
 
WeeklyBattles said:
Cnosuming a realm of infinite size in a finite ammount of time is an infinite speed feat. Existing before time was created is an infinite speed feat. Viewing time, space, and distance as finite illusions is an infinite speed feat. There is nothing stretched about this. ALL CHARACTERS WITH INFINITE AND IMMEASURABLE SPEED HAVE NON-INFINITE AND NON-IMMEASUREABLE SPEED FEATS.
Click to expand...
Thresh most likely didn't consume it though, he would have gone about his usual method of feeding the Dark Star things until it causes the singularity. And there's nothing about them viewing time, space and distance as finite illusions.

Prove they time travel with them

They don't even have time travel to begin with, so I don't see why this is relevant.

Any changes you make will be reverted. I am dead serious. I am not okay with you applying changes that have not been agreed on.

Agree: Me, Antvasima, Paul Frank, Ionliosite, Milly Rocking Bandit, Sigurd Snake in The Eye, LSirLancelotDuLacl, Ercosore, PandarianOda, RegisNex1232, Ciruno Fortes, Celestial Pegasus, Dragonmasterxyz

Disagree: You, Planc69, Rocker1189, SchroKatze

Disagree with some things but not others: Alonik

So not only do more people agree with the changes than those who disagree, those who disagree have repeatedly had their disagreements countered in such a way that neutral observers agree with the changes.

These changes have been agreed on.
 
>Thresh most likely didn't consume it though, he would have gone about his usual method of feeding the Dark Star things until it causes the singularity. And there's nothing about them viewing time, space and distance as finite illusions.

Doing so is still an infinite speed feat as its still destroying a realm of infinite size in a finite timeframe. Even if all the Dark Stars worked together to accomplish this feat it would still be an infinite speed feat.

https://leagueoflegends.fandom.com/wiki/Thresh/Quotes#Dark Star

"Distance is an illusion."

"Space is no impediment."

"Infinity is confined."

>They don't even have time travel to begin with, so I don't see why this is relevant.

Given that your reasoning for them not having infinite/immeasurable speed for moving through time via speed is them having time travel its kinda relevant that you explain your reasoning.

>So not only do more people agree with the changes than those who disagree, those who disagree have repeatedly had their disagreements countered in such a way that neutral observers agree with the changes.

Those who disagree actually understand the lore and know what theyre talking about instead of blindly accepting inaccurate changes because 'big op = correct argument'. If you try to change any profiles before this thread is concluded i will revert them.
 
Doing so would only be an infinite speed feat for the Dark Star itself, not for anyone else. "Space is no impedement" -> quote happens on using his ranged attack that yanks you back towards him / him towards you. Obviously it's just him saying you can't run. "Distance is an illusion" happens on the same thing, it's just him saying you can't get away from him. "Infinity is confined" -> happens on using his box ability -> vague, means nothing, extrapolating this to infinite speed is ridiculous.

My reasoning for them not having infinite/immeasurable speed is the abundance of anti-feats combined with all your statements of so-called "immeasurable" speed being vague and flowery.

Those who disgree have read the evidence that has been presented to them from both sides and come to the conclusion that your interpretation just doesn't measure up. This thread is concluded.
 
The Dark Star did not consume the Void. You really have not been listening at all have you? The Corruptants went into the void and destroyed it from the inside, the Dark Star was not there. And man its almost like running from something infinitely fast is hard.

They have no anti-feats. They have no flowery language. They have feats and low-end feats and nothing else, something you continue to ignore.

If you feel the need to bully people who disagree with you into submission just because your arogance wont let you see someone else's viewpoint then im sorry but i will be reverting any edits you do and will not stop until i am banned.
 
@Weekly

Please be careful about your statement, Thats report worthy you know.

I suggest you go play some game that can makes you relaxing and then come here again with a refreshed mind
 
Also nice to see Monarch has resorted to just asking for numbers to make himself appear right instead of giving counterpoints to arguments that counter the revisions he's trying to force through
 
I've given you counterpoints in abundance, you just refused to accept any of them, so yes, I am trying to see what other admins think on the matter.

I already have support from Ant to make the changes, and the majority of the thread agrees with the changes. If I wanted to, I could make the changes right this moment, you would revert them, and then you would be banned, the changes would go through, and the wiki would continue without you. Instead, I am inviting more staff members to give their input, because yes, you are ignoring the quality of the arguments, so now it's time to bring the quantity.
 
Give me a moment to read through the whole thread, but Weekly, you know you could always make a thread after tightening your argument somemore if the problem is convincing people? I did that when PMMM had a bunch of weaknesses added, people tend to listen if you bring scans with higher quality arguments and respond to the counterpoints on a fresh thread.

This pathway to getting yourself banned seems like a bad idea, not just because you'd get banned, but because the revisions would still happen anyways.
 
Huh, he's kudoing Regis' comment. Guess Weekly really is doing an ultimatum.

You sure about that Weekly? This really is a strange way to get banned. You don't want to at least try the other way?
 
I need to read the arguments, but Weekly you are being a literal child throwing a tantrum because you aren't getting your way. Grow up. Also, you stopping the revisions until you're banned is the most pointless thing you can do. Not only does it take an instant to ban you, but the changes would be performed regardless so what exactly are you accomplishing besides being a pain in the ass? This is ridiculous.
 
Man when did it become a crime to ask for a revision to be completed and accepted before someone applies it?
 
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