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Limbo vs Reinhard. I hope god won't smite me for this.

Firephoenixearl said:
Ugh, rly warren? Ok, let's continue the debate then why not, it's not like we went over this exact scenario before in this thread.
Reinhard doesn't have infinite time for glads as Monarch said. Reinhard leaves Glads, Limbo snaps at him gg.

Reinhard doesn't leave glads, that's why. A) Limbo reveals himself Reinhard takes it, B) Limbo doesn't reveal himself and inconcs via time limit. If it weren't for the time limit Limbo would win in this scenario.

It's a fair match dude, he still has win conditions, he's fighting Reinhard, not Glads. Reinhard can be defeated by Limbo, how glads factors in is by making it from a literal toss up between reinhard and Limbo to a literal toss up between reinhard and inconclusive.

Limbo can stay hidden as much as he wants to, you're the one arguing he can't cus he'll try sth else. I don't believe he'll do something as dumb as that. You vote reinhard, i vote inconc (although im op, you get the point). I mean whether reinhard wins or not was basically decided by coin toss or just preference (a guy even said im inclined to say inconc, but am voting rein ffs). How is that a stomp if Reinhard's win isn't even a fact let alone unfair.
Click to expand...
I already mentioned that there is no mentioned limit on how long Reinhard can maintain his castle, even back in IWKBey - it actually makes sense for it not to have a limit because of Glads eternal-like thematic nature.

Bey just mentioned that Reinhard had kept his castle activated for 2-3 months prior to the events in IWKBey and didn't show any sign of strain because of it, which is in comparison to someone like Bey himself, who can only hold his Briah for a handful of minutes.

There's nothing saying that the castle has a limit of 2-3 months.


Also, why couldn't he just regenerate from deconstruction anyway?


And no, plenty of threads get closed for being stomps because of passive hax that negates any and all abilities of the opponent. Glads is Reinhard's deepest desire made manifest into the world around him. Its nature makes it so none of Limbo's hax will work.

Thus, Limbo can't do anything to Reinhard. And thus this is a stomp. Limbo has no win-condition that is viable in this fight.


The whole point of this fight is for both contestants to kill each other, if one just stands there, then they aren't accomplishing the goals of the fight - that's essentially abandoning the mission to fight, or giving up, which isn't allowed via SBA. There is no logical reason as to why he would just stand there if the mission is to kill Reinhard. This argument is ridiculous, as it goes against the point of these two characters fighting in the first place.


This fight devolves down to literally be the ending to IWKBey with a different villain. Reinhard stomps via da meme.
 
1. NLF. keeping for 3 months doesn't = eternity

2. He kept it for 2-3 months then removed Glads. He'll do the same here. I mean if 2 months is the longest he's ever kept glads for why are you arguing eternity here again?

3. Cus absorption, and information deconstruction. If you can prove that rein can regenerate from an incap method go ahead.
 
Tbh even if Low or Mid-Godly couldn't regen deconstruction for some reason Merc could just bring him back or reset everything to bring him back if he wanted Rein back
 
Firephoenixearl said:
1. NLF. keeping for 3 months doesn't = eternity
2. He kept it for 2-3 months then removed Glads. He'll do the same here. I mean if 2 months is the longest he's ever kept glads for why are you arguing eternity here again?

3. Cus absorption, and information deconstruction. If you can prove that rein can regenerate from an incap method go ahead.
Click to expand...
He never removed Glads, what are you talking about?

I'm not arguing that it is eternal, I am saying that there is no defined limit in the narrative and saying that there is one is disingenuous.
 
Well he kept it for "3 months" which means. That after summoning glads he ONLY kept it for 3 months, then he undid the summoning. I mean if he undid the summoning after 3 months at some point, why are you saying that in this case he won't just keep it for 3 months if he has shown to do so before? He will keep it for 3 months then he'll come out.

That's EXACTLY what you're saying, or exactly what you sound like you're saying. "No stated limit in the narrative", so what? Why did you put that as an argument if not to argue that "there is no limit". That's the definition of NLF. The max he has shown is taken as the max he can do, you know the drill and how NLF things are treated in this wiki, why even bother mentioning that there was no limit stated in the narrative.
 
Paul Frank said:
Tbh even if Low or Mid-Godly couldn't regen deconstruction for some reason Merc could just bring him back or reset everything to bring him back if he wanted Rein back
Click to expand...
Yeah, let's not have Reinhard walk down the DC Cain path shall we? You're just gonna end up forcing people to treat it as outside help.
 
I mean thats kinda how it works though.

Merc wants Rein to live until he can have the ending of Dies Irae play out

If Rein was killed beyond his own type 8 and mid-godly Merc would just bring him back
 
Paul Frank said:
I mean thats kinda how it works though.
Merc wants Rein to live until he can have the ending of Dies Irae play out

If Rein was killed beyond his own type 8 and mid-godly Merc would just bring him back
Click to expand...
Flat out outside help. Type 8 is another thing as it's kind of a passive, merc just interfering and bringing him back on his own free will? Yeah clear outside help.

Cain had a similar thing (but with attacking), and it was deemed outside help.

So yeah SBA just says no.
 
Paul Frank said:
It's more like blessings
Like warhammer gods and their champions
Click to expand...
A power is a blessing. Kharn's passive null is a blessing.

Khorne just saying "nah you die" is outside help. Same for mercurius here. Reinhard being reliant on mercurius is normal type 8. Mercurius just saying "well you're alive but to hell with it anyway imma bring ya back" is outside help, as mercurius is intentionally interfering in Reinhard's battle for plot reasons. There is a clear difference between this and a blessing.
 
Firephoenixearl said:
Well he kept it for "3 months" which means. That after summoning glads he ONLY kept it for 3 months, then he undid the summoning. I mean if he undid the summoning after 3 months at some point, why are you saying that in this case he won't just keep it for 3 months if he has shown to do so before? He will keep it for 3 months then he'll come out.
That's EXACTLY what you're saying, or exactly what you sound like you're saying. "No stated limit in the narrative", so what? Why did you put that as an argument if not to argue that "there is no limit". That's the definition of NLF. The max he has shown is taken as the max he can do, you know the drill and how NLF things are treated in this wiki, why even bother mentioning that there was no limit stated in the narrative.
Click to expand...
No. I said Reinhard kept the castle activate for 2-3 months before the events of IWKBey, a few weeks after the events of IWKBey is the prologue of Dies Irae where Reinhard does the first part of the Ark of Covenant ceremony, which then seals him away in his castle for 60+ years, and then the main events of Dies Irae happen. Reinhard never deactivates his Briah at all.


No, I am not. Don't put words in my mouth. What I meant by "there is no stated limit in the narrative" means that 2-3 months isn't the maximum amount of time that Reinhard can hold his castle, it is the minimum amount of time as shown from Reinhard not having any form strain for keeping his Briah active whatsoever, unlike other Hegmoies - which can only keep it up for a few moments until they have to put it away.

I also said that his castle is possibly indefinite and that it would make a lot of sense because of the resurrective and eternal nature of the castle.


Just to make sure you understand me crystal clear, I am going to repeat myself one more time as simply as I can.

I did not say that Reinhard is definitely able to hold his castle indefinitely - I just said it was a possibility that made sense, and that saying his MAX output of three months is disingenuous as it is more accurately his MIN output.
 
Cain's thing was deemed outside help for the purpose of that one thread, not necessarily battles in general. Also chaos god immortalities are still a thing (they're just inconsistent in verse which is why nobody considers them for Kharn and Ahriman).
 
Wokistan said:
Cain's thing was deemed outside help for the purpose of that one thread, not necessarily battles in general. Also chaos god immortalities are still a thing (they're just inconsistent in verse which is why nobody considers them for Kharn and Ahriman).
Click to expand...
Thoughts on the fight?
 
Warren Valion said:
@Paul Frank Reinhard's immortality comes from his nature as Mercurius's Apoptosis, not from Merc's Law rewinding the multiverse.
Click to expand...
I know

Im saying that if his type 8s or regen didn't work for some reason Merc could bring him back by force or reset and that arguavly wouldn't be outside help
 
Paul Frank said:
Warren Valion said:
@Paul Frank Reinhard's immortality comes from his nature as Mercurius's Apoptosis, not from Merc's Law rewinding the multiverse.
Click to expand...
I know
Im saying that if his type 8s or regen didn't work for some reason Merc could bring him back by force or reset and that arguavly wouldn't be outside help
Click to expand...
That would be outside help, and Merc wouldn't do that.

He resets the universe when he doesn't get to die in Marie's arms as she becomes the God of the New World - not because Reinhard is losing a fight.
 
Pretty sure Warframe battles should be banned until we have a CRT to figure out what is going on.
 
Well then gg, the match sure opened a can of worms at any rate. Better put a notice on the verse page in the meantime regarding that CRT if we're doing this
 
Im actually waiting for Paul or anyone who had problems with the profiles to make that CRT. And @Still, you could make Drac vs Limbo, but wait a couple of days, maybe till the CRT is done.

@ABooige You can bet Limbo's wall of text is gonna increase (for real, im not even kidding).
 
It is

Which is why I said it only works on downed targets but since fire said that's game mechanics I compromised and said it only works on stationary targets since it takes like 15 seconds of keeping your hand in on position above the target
 
Also what is a "full equipment" Limbo? I hope the OP isn't implying Limbo is stacking every mod possible, weapons, and companions all at once like some super warframe. This isn't possible and the OP should pick a designated load out.
 
@Paul When the warframe starts deconstructing, the target becomes immobile the moment the deconstruction starts. But do make the CRT (i have some other minor things to add to the profiles like absolute 0 from glaxion, magnetism etc, and i don't wanna have to make a CRT for minor things like those).

@Sigurd Not exactly. The things we capture are ppl the Lotus needs. That's part of the lore. Im not giving warframes abilities like invincibility (when resurrecting) which are clearly game mechanics. The warframes capture targets which the lotus needs for intel or stuff like that and brings them to her, that's not game mechanics, idk why it would be.

And about the "full equipment" not being possible, that's what i thought as well, then someone said "Carrying more than possible? Heh, tell that to literally every composite profile ever". And from what i heard people having the ability to have all their equipment even if it's not possible in game/verse is pretty common.

@Paul Btw remind me to push the idea of a Warframe (Composite) profile (that profile would be the most common way people woul have to fight against the Operator in verse, as The Operator is not bound to 1 warframe. But anyway that's for the CRT.
 
@fire that's incorrect, the target still squirms and struggles until the deconstruction is over which is why you have to knock them down first so they can't run

As for making the CRT I refuse I'll wait for someone else to ovo

A composite warframe profile might work but would we give the operstor every focus ability? In addition how would that even work wouldn't op have to state a starting frame because the operator can't control all of them at once
 
Paul Frank said:
A composite warframe profile might work but would we give the operstor every focus ability? In addition how would that even work wouldn't op have to state a starting frame because the operator can't control all of them at once
Click to expand...
Im really up to make that tbh. And no a composite profile for the warframes, not the operator (i feel like it's normal for the operator to use any focus school, seems purely game mechanics to have to divide them before a game, if he can learn them all at the same time, why can't he just use it, that's the idea i have of it). And no it's not "what frame", a composite is exactly a profile to make that irrelevant. So it doesn't matter what frame, so rn i think that a warframe composite would have any warframe ability (could use any ability he wishes), but i'll have to wait for when that's actually done and have some admins give some input on how it would be best.
 
Fun fact, i just did the math and warframes are the uncontestant kings of standard equipment. Counting all:

Weapons

Amp/kitguns/zaws

Arcanes

Equipments/Gear

Companions

Archwing

Etc.

They all reach a total of 553. So 553 standard equipments. Holy geez.
 
Anyway i'll be working on making the CRT for the warframe additions and composite profile. @Paul I'll pm you a link when it's done (and don't you dare mention the problems you have with stuff in that thread, make the thread for that yourself xD).
 
Firephoenixearl said:
Fun fact, i just did the math and warframes are the uncontestant kings of standard equipment. Counting all:
Weapons

Amp/kitguns/zaws

Arcanes

Equipments/Gear

Companions

Archwing

Etc.

They all reach a total of 553. So 553 standard equipments. Holy geez.
Click to expand...
That can't be right.

I highly doubt that this is all standard equipment.
 
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