Going to reply to DT now.
>But if you still need to proof that their attacks are lightspeed, then they probably don't have the showings of producing lightspeed stuff. So the most control within their showings wouldn't be lightspeed.
This point here would only apply to characters who's light manipulation isnt being considered to being real light in the first place, which is not what my thread is tackling here. There's a distinct difference between saying a non-real light technique being manipulated isnt light speed and an actual real light technique being manipulated isnt light speed, the latter of which I and multiple others don't immediately agree with currently.
>Furthermore assuming that light manipulators generally are responsible for the speed of the light they use means that there is absolutely no reason to assume that is lightspeed due to being light
And, again, this is what I disagree with for a number of different reasons.
For one, no one is saying that the attacks of the light manipulators are light speed just due to being light. It's the other way around. If the attacks are real light, then the speed of the light manipulators moves being light speed. Clearing this small confusion up.
Two, even in real life where we cannot manipulate light
(and most definitely no where close to the degree of fictional light manipulators), light bending doesnt automatically make it slower than the speed of light. When light is refracted, it can become either faster or slower depending on which object light is being refracted upon. So already at this point, light being changed to be slower or faster is a 50/50 type of phenomena, so you cannot claim "there's no reason to assume its light speed" when there's also no reason to assume it isnt light speed either for the exact same reasoning. If claiming its going faster or slower, then
that should be the burden of proof that needs evidence to back up. So the default assumption for light being bended during use should simply be regular flat out light speed.
Three, light suddenly automatically becoming slower than the speed of light exactly when being bended wouldn't make sense when light manipulators who are actively bending them in the first place are doing that to hit opponents who can dodge light being fired directly at them. A bended beam that supposedly becomes slower would have
even more difficulty hitting successfully since the opponent can react to and dodge something faster already, something potentially far faster if the bended beam becomes far slower. If the bended beam is able to hit someone who is already able to dodge light speed attacks, then the bended beam should still be moving at the speed of light. Arguably even faster.
Your point here would be better DT if you argued the light manipulator to be
willingly slowing down the beam. Which to make things worse, as Andytrenom already pointed out, would only come to happen under very few circumstances. No where near enough to the point where it becomes a standard of any kind.
>NPI is a gathering term for various abilities and it should definitely be segregated (in case you didn't notice: We very often leave specifying details on abilities to the writers of profiles).
I mean, I did point this out earlier above. But again, this is not the thread to discuss this so it should be taken to its own thread if it should be discussed more.
>Being able to physically smack a lightbeam is a subpower of light manipulation, while physically smacking a soul is a subpower of soul manipulation.
This is completely wrong, especially for soul manipulation. And to prove what im saying, refer to this quote
directly from the
Soul Manipulation page:
"It should be noted that the ability to interact with souls and other non-corporeal entities directly as if they were physical objects is usually considered Non-Physical Interaction and does not grant the user the ability to manipulate souls in other contexts."
Smacking souls is not considered a sub power for Soul Manipulation at all, it's just Non-Physical Interaction like it was said earlier. Interacting with a soul and being able to actually manipulate it in any way are 2 completely different things. This is the same for Light Manipulation as well.
>Are you indicating every soul manipulator can manipulate light, 'cause it's easier?
Aside from this already not being true anyway due to above, of course not DT.
Im indicating that every soul manipulator can interact with light, which it is. Think of it like this. Say someone is able to interact with water, which is nothing but a pure liquid. Would you say it makes sense for someone to suddenly be unable to interact with ice, which is a step down from water and is only partially a liquid? A frozen solid entirely if its that cold? No because it doesnt make any sense and its the same case here with light and souls. The former is only partially intangible, while the latter is completely intangible. If you can interact with something completely intangible, then anything that is only partially that is within your capabilities of being interacted with.
R; I think it's simpler to assume a light manipulator is able to manipulate the speed of their attacks as fast as light itself would be allowed to move in the circumstances they provide, and faster if their power improves or works in that way. The alternative implies that the light manipulator is NOT responsible for the speed of their attack, which is a big nuclear take without evidence to support, and it being applied to everyone who uses the power (and powers similar) is pretty out there. Though, this means that there has to be solid statements of it being actual light, not just an energy blast being confused or colloquially called as such.
