Kirby revisions: Everything coming full circle

[Eficiente]

The crown's done now.

 

[Ret_of_Guys]

The crown's done now.

That looks good. I wonder what you're editing next

 

[Eficiente]

I changed the Cosmology blogs, putting the dimension where the main Halcandra is outside of Another Dimension.

 

[Eseseso]

You know, the funny thing is, even if Magolor's "endless skies" comment wasn't English-only, it probably wouldn't change his 2-C tier since his collapse only affected those 16 dimensions.

Probably would've buffed Void Termina to "possibly 2-A", but not RtDL people.

 

[Eficiente]

It wouldn't have affected VT tho.

 

[Eseseso]

It wouldn't have affected VT tho.

Void Termina was a threat to everything.

 

[Winter]

Void Termina was a threat to everything.

Threat ≠ AP. Same reason why Bill isn’t Multi+

 

[Eseseso]

Threat ≠ AP. Same reason why Bill isn’t Multi+

It was stated that he was going to end everything.

 

[Winter]

It was stated that he was going to end everything.

So… I don’t understand. Are you saying he’s a threat, or was he legitimately going to end everything.

It doesn’t matter, statements or threats, there needs to be some sort of context to support that rating. Out of a verse that’s currently known to peak at 2-C, there isn’t really much to support 2-A at all.

As a matter of a fact, his statement comes from a religious chant, which isn’t enough to justify a 2-A rating, while other things we get from pause screens are at least lore statements.

 

[Eseseso]

So… I don’t understand. Are you saying he’s a threat, or was he legitimately going to end everything.

I think the statement said he was going to end everything.

 

[CloverDragon03]

So… I don’t understand. Are you saying he’s a threat, or was he legitimately going to end everything.

It doesn’t matter, statements or threats, there needs to be some sort of context to support that rating. Out of a verse that’s currently known to peak at 2-C, there isn’t really much to support 2-A at all.

As a matter of a fact, his statement comes from a religious chant, which isn’t enough to justify a 2-A rating, while other things we get from pause screens are at least lore statements.

Yeah, Eseseso's referring to this:

"Rise! Oh, Dark Lord of Despair! Crush
the stars! Lay waste to care! (x4)
-Inst.-
Upon your wing, dark judgment bring!
May your symphony of tragedy
cause the end of everything"

Far too vague

 

[Eseseso]

Yeah, Eseseso's referring to this:

"Rise! Oh, Dark Lord of Despair! Crush
the stars! Lay waste to care! (x4)
-Inst.-
Upon your wing, dark judgment bring!
May your symphony of tragedy
cause the end of everything"

Far too vague

Ooof.

Basically, that means that, even if Low 1-C AD was accepted, literally no one would scale.

Pain.

 

[Winter]

Yeah, Eseseso's referring to this:

"Rise! Oh, Dark Lord of Despair! Crush
the stars! Lay waste to care! (x4)
-Inst.-
Upon your wing, dark judgment bring!
May your symphony of tragedy
cause the end of everything"

Far too vague

I know what he was referring to, just trying to get an understanding of what he’s arguing since he goes from “Void threatened” to “Void will end everything”

 

[CloverDragon03]

Ooof.

Basically, that means that, even if Low 1-C AD was accepted, literally no one would scale.

Pain.

Honestly you're wrong about that one but that's a topic for another time

 

[Eseseso]

Honestly you're wrong about that one but that's a topic for another time

I mean, we can't discuss it in the cosmology CRT, so why not here?

 

[CloverDragon03]

I mean, we can't discuss it in the cosmology CRT, so why not here?

Because there is absolutely no thread being made on that topic right now. Please don't try to turn anything you can into a discussion of this. It's irrelevant

 

[Darkz]

Yeah, Eseseso's referring to this:

"Rise! Oh, Dark Lord of Despair! Crush
the stars! Lay waste to care! (x4)
-Inst.-
Upon your wing, dark judgment bring!
May your symphony of tragedy
cause the end of everything"

Far too vague

Yeah, it's a chant. It just uses hyperbole to sound cool and powerful. The Devil form also says he's the end of all tomorrows, which holds just as little or even less merit. It holds the same importance as saying that when The Sun will grow tenfold into a red-giant, that because there's a popular song about it destroying everything, it means that it will destroy the universe.

I mean, I have no doubts that Void Termina would destroy a lot of shit and cause mass chaos and destruction—but this doesn't really justify a tier-jump going from 2-C to 2-A.

 

[Eficiente]

I made this disgusting thing, it needs to be evaluated. Dead serious as always.

 

[Eseseso]

I made this disgusting thing, it needs to be evaluated. Dead serious as always.

Ok, I see.

So what would be changed as a result of this revival stuff?

 

[CloverDragon03]

Ok, I see.

So what would be changed as a result of this revival stuff?

Afaik a number of characters would get Resurrection as an ability

 

[Eficiente]

I also made this.

 

[Ret_of_Guys]

Afaik a number of characters would get Resurrection as an ability

So Kirby characters can now reurrect themselves. I know that this doesn't apply to most Final Bosses, but who else does this apply to and who does this not apply to?

 

[Ret_of_Guys]

I also made this.

Nice to see that you've already managed to analyze the Sakurai video on Kirby. Also I also see that you've also analyzed that conceptual diagram of Another Dimension

 

[Eficiente]

If a Kirby character ever appears in DB again (critical as I am of it), I just want to see that thing animated like a comic panel. The Lor moving from one side to another, maybe the things in the background moving like the things in 0's background.

 

[Eseseso]

Just curious, why was Kirby's pre-RtDL but post Canvas curse key (the 4-A one) removed?

 

[Ret_of_Guys]

Just curious, why was Kirby's pre-RtDL but post Canvas curse key (the 4-A one) removed?

Don't think there ever was one. Also Kirby's now straight 2-C after Return to Dream Land yay I guess

 

[Eficiente]

I got my hands on that interview I talked about.

 

[Eficiente]

@Jasonsith Hello. On this calc, turns out one scan I used was mistranslated, so it can't be used. Can you replace this bit:

"That enemy is called Laser Ball, his lasers are called "Light Amplification by Stimulated Emission of Radiation""

with:

"That enemy is called Laser Ball, his ability, when copied by Kirby, is stated to be a "photochemical weapon"<ref>Laser Copy Ability's Jap. pause screen description · ''Kirby & the Amazing Mirror''</ref> & a "light/light-based science weaponry"<ref>Kirby JP twitter post of Jul 28, 2019</ref>"

Edit: I made a mistake there, should be this:

"That enemy is called Laser Ball, his ability, when copied by Kirby, is stated to be a "light-based weaponry"<ref>Laser Copy Ability's Jap. pause screen description · ''Kirby: Nightmare in Dream Land'', ''Kirby & the Amazing Mirror'', and ''Kirby: Squeak Squad''</ref> & a "light/light-based science weaponry"<ref>Kirby JP twitter post of Jul 28, 2019</ref>"

 

[Jasonsith]

Just curious, why was Kirby's pre-RtDL but post Canvas curse key (the 4-A one) removed?

That was not pre Return to Dreamland key phase.
That was pre Star Allies key phase.

Kirby god tiers used to be "4-A to 2-C" pre SA and "3-C to 2-C" post SA.

Don't think there ever was one. Also Kirby's now straight 2-C after Return to Dream Land yay I guess

And the grounds for removing the low end range? Link? Sorry many people do not have the patience to dig through the walls of mucho texto.

 

[Eficiente]

Well, between the time travel it has going on, the cosmology, and the creators all but saying that it needs to be pieced together bit by bit rather simply saying what happened at once in a super clear way, it's bound to be a lengthy read with patience to it. Especially since I'm aware of what alt. interpretations of things people will have along the way, which is avoided by building every "bit" strongly. I'm aware of how much it sucks, but there is no other way; I'm open to any shorter version if anyone proposes them, but I will point out what is being lost in their version.

 

[Eseseso]

Well, between the time travel it has going on, the cosmology, and the creators all but saying that it needs to be pieced together bit by bit rather simply saying what happened at once in a super clear way, it's bound to be a lengthy read with patience to it. Especially since I'm aware of what alt. interpretations of things people will have along the way, which is avoided by building every "bit" strongly. I'm aware of how much it sucks, but there is no other way; I'm open to any shorter version if anyone proposes them, but I will point out what is being lost in their version.

What exactly are you talking about?

 

[Eficiente]

What exactly are you talking about?

The feat is explained as shorty as it can be for anyone to understand it in Magolor or the Master Crown's profiles, in turn optionally linking a blog that goes over it in much more detail. Otherwise, does anything exactly result confusing? I have no issue going over things, but I would need to ask if it's not something you can come to understand on your own by the information you're reading. If not, again, please be exact on what results confusing.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

Following. What's happenin here?

 

[Eficiente]

Recently

I made this disgusting thing, it needs to be evaluated. Dead serious as always.

I also made this.

it would be great to have this evaluated.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

What happens to the creatures Kirby swallows and where do they go?
Kumazaki: Because the base world is a fantasy world, it’s not like they get swallowed and digested inside of Kirby. Because that might be jarring, and because we made the game to be approachable, having that kind of extreme or violent expression might negate making the game so approachable.
Instead, we have this comical, funny depiction where the enemies poof. When an enemy or creature gets swallowed by Kirby, they may disappear but they do resurface somewhere else in the world.

This is BFR right

 

[Eficiente]

As you can see in the link, should that be BFR;

• It contradicts the secret in the Kirby setting of enemies reviving after getting swallowed. Doing so "(like weeds)", which regrow when cut.
• A more valid statement has it so "everything that goes in is quickly digested", contradicting that too. The latter is info on Kirby in the 20th Anniversary Encyclopedia, the former was an interview, and not one of those custom-made fancy ones they do. One of those clearly has more weight than the other.
• To note, the statement doesn't necessarily say that they get teleported away by Kirby's power, just that they poof, which can mean blow up or get teleported, and that "they do resurface", which too can mean get recreated or just reappearing. The contradiction comes in the sense of interpreting the wording that way specifically.

So, to quote myself there, "the point [was] that something as "jarring"/not "approachable"/"extreme"/"violent" as them dying permanently & cruelly doesn't happen, and that they're only out for a time before coming back and that it's so comical, nobody minds in-universe."

 

[Eficiente]

Everyone, Magolor built the sub-games inside his ship as small atractions, when Checkerboard Chase's last level and Smash Ride have spaces full of stars in them. "Magolor has technological capabilities in science along with magic, he states that he created" the structures he makes "using these powers", so he gains: ". 4-A Creation with Preparation time" via magic and technological skills.

 

[Eseseso]

As you can see in the link, should that be BFR;

• It contradicts the secret in the Kirby setting of enemies reviving after getting swallowed. Doing so "(like weeds)", which regrow when cut.
• A more valid statement has it so "everything that goes in is quickly digested", contradicting that too. The latter is info on Kirby in the 20th Anniversary Encyclopedia, the former was an interview, and not one of those custom-made fancy ones they do. One of those clearly has more weight than the other.
• To note, the statement doesn't necessarily say that they get teleported away by Kirby's power, just that they poof, which can mean blow up or get teleported, and that "they do resurface", which too can mean get recreated or just reappearing. The contradiction comes in the sense of interpreting the wording that way specifically.

So, to quote myself there, "the point [was] that something as "jarring"/not "approachable"/"extreme"/"violent" as them dying permanently & cruelly doesn't happen, and that they're only out for a time before coming back and that it's so comical, nobody minds in-universe."

I don't know enough about BFR to answer that.

Btw, during "Heroes in Another Dimension" in Star Allies, are there any more universes and/or any more info on Another Dimension?

 

[Eficiente]

Yes, it's already listed in the Another Dimension blog.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

As you can see in the link, should that be BFR;

• It contradicts the secret in the Kirby setting of enemies reviving after getting swallowed. Doing so "(like weeds)", which regrow when cut.
• A more valid statement has it so "everything that goes in is quickly digested", contradicting that too. The latter is info on Kirby in the 20th Anniversary Encyclopedia, the former was an interview, and not one of those custom-made fancy ones they do. One of those clearly has more weight than the other.
• To note, the statement doesn't necessarily say that they get teleported away by Kirby's power, just that they poof, which can mean blow up or get teleported, and that "they do resurface", which too can mean get recreated or just reappearing. The contradiction comes in the sense of interpreting the wording that way specifically.

So, to quote myself there, "the point [was] that something as "jarring"/not "approachable"/"extreme"/"violent" as them dying permanently & cruelly doesn't happen, and that they're only out for a time before coming back and that it's so comical, nobody minds in-universe."

Eh.. I'm a tad confused.. But should it be written down as them dying and being reborn in a different place?
Or perhaps it is canon that they do die but it's written as them reviving somewhere else for the sake of the series being wholesome?