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Kingdom Hearts CRT 2: Electric Boogaloo

Yeah okay Cal. Please tell me you'll walk up with that confidence to Golden Sun, Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, Persona, or any RPG Verse with the elements and say they should all be MHS+ at best because they can only be lightning timers. I really want to see all those downgrade threads and I'll link this thread as the reason we need to do so.

I'm not sure saying someone doesn't understand counts as a refute. We've made our case abundantly clear and it seems more like a "I refuse to budge" thing. I said Ever was agreeing not because it was a him thing, I said because a majority of people agree with adding this. You're like the only person who's making arguments to even oppose it right now.
 
I'll reply again to this thread in the morning since it's late, but I'm fine with Xemnas' black hole not being legitimate.
 
I'm also in agreement with Everlasting and Cal
 
I said they're anti-feats, and I don't change my stance there. Feats here outweigh the anti-feats because they're actually quantifiable.

You're completely right! I refuse to budge on this matter. Because I remember that feats are actually greater than statements, and when you have a fuckton of feats disproving infinite speeds, you take it with a grain of salt. Those verses you mentioned before? Actually have feats above MHS+. A lot of people on this site nowadays are yes-men. I don't care what others have to say unless they give a proper rebuttal. Both you and Speedster are doing so, so I unironically applaud you for that.

Seriously though, show me a SINGLE FRANCHISE that has this level of leniency if it passes. I can promise you there isn't one on the wiki that allows every single character to have infinite speed. I don't care if it's Grand Theft Auto or the Masadaverse, there's not a gosh darned one. But that's what you're arguing for. Everyone upwards of Shadows is infinite speed. Which is everyone.
 
Can you link the thread with the Dark Area Digimon? Read below but I'm not sure if I can trust your example fully if they're not cited as to why they have relevancy here. And yet again, you keep glossing over the fact you acknowledged state of existence is of an importance in characterizing the speed. This is one of those examples, the quality of time being irrelevant to the character is absolutely irrelevant in of itself in trying to demean the Infinite speed here.

Are you resorting to false analogies to make a point now? Seriously Cal? The World of Void is accepted as being a false void, therefore the feats do not correlate to infinite speed. That is why they are not applied, nothing regarding quantity pertains there. And that instance quite literally is anything involving the Realm of Darkness, it's right in front of your face Cal. They'd be written off as outliers because those feats wouldn't be consistent for them. The fodder in Kingdom Hearts clearly have this and the fact the Nobodies and Heartless are all capable of keeping pace with an MFTL+ vessel very easily. I'm not sure how much more blatant you can possibly get that they clearly scale speedwise to higher things, then Keyblade Wielders and other main characters simply dwarf that. Is it really that complex?
 
Dark Area Digimon were literally listed in the Timeless Void page for accepted Timeless Voids before they removed the examples.
 
He said it was one of the few things he disagrees with...
 
Why were they removed then? Type 3 Voids notes you can get Infinite Speed off of it.

Also, I'm retiring to my bed for the night, hoping this thread doesn't go kaboom in that time.
 
We've been talking to him off-site (since he's kinda yeeted) and he doesn't have any problems with it after we've been talking it out.
 
Aren't Heartless stronger while in the Realm of Darkness? If so, then only those that have been in it can scale, or at best those comparable to Aqua.
 
Okay hold up but

Why are people taking Everlasting's opinions into account? Aint he banned? Lol
 
I don't care how it makes the wiki look Kira, and I know exactly what he was banned for.... More than you know. But that shouldn't distract from him knowing and being a valuable asset when it counts.
 
I don't care. He's still providing good information. If they come back because of it I'll take the blame for taking up for him, and whether I get permabanned because of it across FANDOM is something I can take (at least it would quell the guilt I have of it) . But, at least please show some respect for him.
 
Let's not start this Ever discussion again.

If you think FANDOM cares so much, message them about it. Otherwise you are derailing this thread with this pointless discussion.
 
Like, I heavily disagree with this thread.

I do not approve of the idea of every Kingdom Hearts character scaling to Infinite speed. Even when Dark Area Digimon were Infinite speed, it really only scaled to them and no one else. We didn't scale every Digimon to them, nor did we scale everyone who simply entered the Dark Area to Infinite speed. We only scaled the natives of the world (and the Angels but even that is faulty). i.e This Infinite Speed rating would cause too many scaling issues and would extrapolate the speed ratings of every character.

Just because the heartless are fodder and the cast consistently tag them doesn't make them up for Infinite speed. Honestly, by this logic every Digimon and such should have Infinite speed. I find including every single character in this to be gross extrapolation. We really need to be stricter with these standards i we are just going to be giving away Infinite speed like this. But if we allow this, let the floodgates be opened, I look forward to seeing the chaos this brings.

Good luck with this thread and future Infinite Speed threads people I'm out.

PS: I agree with "Resistance to Time Stop" btw.
 
Just some minor notes, Fandom doesn't really care what people are doing offsite as long as we aren't doing things that could threaten them. Which what we're doing is completely harmless.

Anyway, stay on main topic, resistance to time stop sounds a lot more reasonable than Infinite speed. As the latter is something we can't be too lenient on.
 
Resistance to "being speed blitzed by someone at infinite speed" would be better, but as that would basically just be "Infinite speed reactions", yeah, TBH I could agree with everyone just getting a resistance to time stop.
 
Alright, fine, Heartless don't get infinite speed, even if I disagree, but the main cast scales. Literally a majority of them have been in the Realm of Darkness, we literally see Riku and Mickey there during KH1, Ansem the Wise getting banished there, Aqua moving in there for literally 10+ years and meeting Ansem there, Roxas and Xemnas in the Realm of Darkness, both Riku and Sora entering the Realm of Darkness after fighting Twilight Xemnas, [https://youtu.be/e2XShhNMjEw Ansem going to the Realm of Darkness to knock Aqua unconscious, Sora, Mickey, Riku, and Anti-Aqua fight in the Realm of Darkness. This is quite literally a huge portion of the characters moving in the Realm of Darkness who alone would have infinite speed. At least Keyblade Wielders, Seekers of Darkness, the original Organization's XIII, and some Disney characters scale, period.
 
I'll give my two cents I guess.

Are there any other examples where this site even has labeled timeless void feats as being Resistance to Time Stop only? I don't believe I've seen that applied off this sort of feat before. That being said, I believe that a middle ground should be met with a "potentially Infinite" rating given there appears to be an uncertainty.

People should really stop hopping on the thread with the sole reason of saying Infinite speed is wrong and actually participate with the other additions as well. While Infinite speed is one of the main points of the thread, it should not be the defining thing for if the thread is to be considered wrong.
 
The arguments against infinite speed look more like feels over reals.

everyone in the main cast would scale to it since they have been in the realm of darkness or have fought others who have been on the realm.

there are only one lower speed feat wich was done by fodder and very casually.

and would not make sense to give only time stop resistence since they dint move on stopped time but a literal void were the concept of time doesn't exist wich is supported by multiple statments and by the author himself.

likely infinite speed would make sense to me.
 
The arguments against infinite speed is that a single infinitely higher feat than every single speed feat in the entire series doesn't override all those finite speed feats.

This is literally the definition of outlier. Hell, people tried to change GER's infinite speed rating because while he had an infinite speed feat, he also had A SINGLE one that apparently wasn't (because Diavolo managed to dodge one of his lasers, although it was later agreed that it didn't contradict infinite speed because Diavolo dodged it via precog).

Meanwhile here every single cutscene, every single gameplay moment, everything that's outside of the realm of darkness contradicts this feat. We aren't so lenient with Infinite Speed.
 
There's no "infinite while in a timeless void", we should list this in their P&A section saying that "they can move in timeless void". It's slightly different than Resistance to timestop (for example, it would let them no sell Diavolo's ability), but it also includes that (if you can move in a place without time, you should also He able to move in place where time has simply stopped).
 
There is literaly only one lower speed feat wich was done by a space ship and fodder heatless and nobodies can casually keep up with it.

Using that same fallacy we could say all dragon ball characters are crater level with subsonic speeds because we don't see them blowing up universes everytime they fight(only once or two) and moving at FTL speeds were you could not eveen see then.
 
False equivalence. FTL=/=Infinite speed

The crater thing is AoE (plus, isn't current DBS held in arenas that are specifically made to contain these fights?), and speed is shown purposely slowed down to let us see.

Infinite speed means that all movement is instantaneous. Characters wouldn't take time to move, which is contradicted first in gameplay and also in every single cutscene. It's not a matter of slowing things down, they would literally need to teleport around if they truly were infinite in speed.
 
TriforcePower1 said:
The arguments against infinite speed is that a single infinitely higher feat than every single speed feat in the entire series doesn't override all those finite speed feats.

This is literally the definition of outlier. Hell, people tried to change GER's infinite speed rating because while he had an infinite speed feat, he also had A SINGLE one that apparently wasn't (because Diavolo managed to dodge one of his lasers, although it was later agreed that it didn't contradict infinite speed because Diavolo dodged it via precog).

Meanwhile here every single cutscene, every single gameplay moment, everything that's outside of the realm of darkness contradicts this feat. We aren't so lenient with Infinite Speed.
Click to expand...
Literally give an example of a single feat where a KH character struggled to react to a MFTL+ feat, because the entire series is full of casual MFTL+ feats.
 
And?

Infinite Speed is literally infinitely higher than MFTL+

They could be below average human in speed, and the outlier would be exactly the same.
 
I'm mean if everybody only did MFTL speed feats and out of nowhere a infinite speed feats comes up that would be an outlier,but in this case there is only one other speed feat wich was done by a space ship not eveen the characters of the story(and the gummi ship gets easily blitzed by Monstro wich can keep up with the main cast).
 
Yet the Gummi Ship despite being faster than the main cast couldn't escape Monstro.

Also there's like, three MFTL+ feats.
 
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