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Kiara vs Ganon
- Thread starter The_real_cal_howard
- Start date
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What does she do against those she mindhaxed?
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Also, can you please post his nasuwiki page?
John985
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https://typemoon.wikia.com/wiki/Archer_(Fate/Grand_Order_-_EMIYA_Alter)
But it doesn't have any information what happend in the CCC event.
But it doesn't have any information what happend in the CCC event.
John985
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According to the profile, it seems more like he wanted to be inder her, or that it worked because she helped him. Also, yeah, he disregarded morality, but that's it.
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(Insert SpongeBob "Imagination" gif here)
Me: "Ganon is a blue pig in this form." You:"Why should that stop her?" Me:"Ehhhmmm... I'm leaving"
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Forsaking his mortality means he has given up on ever being human again. He only exists as a pale shell of his former self that exterminates threats using any means necessary. He's so single minded in his goals that he even has a skill embodies this mindset. 'Derisive Heart of Steel' is something like an extreme form of 'Mental Pollution' that pretty much strengthens his concept of 'Agent of Counterforce'. It pretty muchs makes it near impossible to sway him from his goals and mess with his mind because it's so messed up to begin with, but Kiara was able to do it simply by talking to him.
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"Kiara has managed to seduce those who literally only have a one-tracked mind. Emiya Alter (Demiya), is literally a killing machine that works without qualms with the counter force. Unlike regular Emiya, who hates having to do what the Counter Force asks him to do, Demiya is fully capable of doing so. He doesn't even consider himself human anymore."
Problem: he still is. 4-B Ganon is a demon, a blue pig. Also, disregarding morality=/=disregarding lust, far from it.
"Emiya Alter's profile lists him as someone who threw away everything that made him human in the first place, walking a path from which there is no form of salvation. He's absent of ideals and absent of ideology, a complete machine rather than a man. All he cares about is ushering out the will of the counter force, nothing more. He'll wholeheartedly embrace mass-slaughter as long as it gets him closer to his goals."
Yes, but AFTER he had been mindhaxed.
Problem: he still is. 4-B Ganon is a demon, a blue pig. Also, disregarding morality=/=disregarding lust, far from it.
"Emiya Alter's profile lists him as someone who threw away everything that made him human in the first place, walking a path from which there is no form of salvation. He's absent of ideals and absent of ideology, a complete machine rather than a man. All he cares about is ushering out the will of the counter force, nothing more. He'll wholeheartedly embrace mass-slaughter as long as it gets him closer to his goals."
Yes, but AFTER he had been mindhaxed.
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"Kiara was able to do it simply by talking to him."
I hope I'm not the one seeing the problem here.
I hope I'm not the one seeing the problem here.
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From Archer's page:
"That which abased the spirit of the man who was as the steel of a sword is said to have been a woman akin to the Holy Mother in her compassion. The price that the man came to pay in pursuing the subjugation of her Malice (Ú¡öµÇº, masei?, lit. "demonic nature"; often used to refer to "demonic allure") was the 'disposal' of her many followers; by their martyrdom did he fall to the Path of the Heretics (Ú¡öÚüô, madou?, lit. "demonic path"; in Buddhism, a walk of existence beyond the Six Paths, from which there can be no salvation)"
"That which abased the spirit of the man who was as the steel of a sword is said to have been a woman akin to the Holy Mother in her compassion. The price that the man came to pay in pursuing the subjugation of her Malice (Ú¡öµÇº, masei?, lit. "demonic nature"; often used to refer to "demonic allure") was the 'disposal' of her many followers; by their martyrdom did he fall to the Path of the Heretics (Ú¡öÚüô, madou?, lit. "demonic path"; in Buddhism, a walk of existence beyond the Six Paths, from which there can be no salvation)"
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Nah, he's going to BFR her in the beautiful land of passive transmutation.YungManzi said:
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"Yes, but AFTER he had been mindhaxed."
Uh... no. That's not it. He was like that before he even met her. Granted, it wasn't as bad. This Shirou is from a bad route of fate stay night that led him to be like this. The fact that she was able to incite those feelings from him when he shouldn't even be able to feel anything is an impressive feat on its own. Also, getting rid of his own mortality and giving up on everything that makes himself human means he'd most likely get rid of any attractions he had. Attractions get in the way of his duty, after all.
Also, it doesn't matter if the ganon you're using is a pig-monster. He's still an intelligent being who I highly doubt doesn't known of pleasure.
Uh... no. That's not it. He was like that before he even met her. Granted, it wasn't as bad. This Shirou is from a bad route of fate stay night that led him to be like this. The fact that she was able to incite those feelings from him when he shouldn't even be able to feel anything is an impressive feat on its own. Also, getting rid of his own mortality and giving up on everything that makes himself human means he'd most likely get rid of any attractions he had. Attractions get in the way of his duty, after all.
Also, it doesn't matter if the ganon you're using is a pig-monster. He's still an intelligent being who I highly doubt doesn't known of pleasure.
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Half of the things you said he did, he did after being mindhaxed. Simply being a human disregarding his past (and I'd highlight that according to his page, he's still a human) and morality is preeeetty different from being literal hatred incarnate. Ganon has never shown any kind of pleasure for anything different than power, but at difference of Shirou, he isn't human and there's a reason of why he doesn't.
Ganon is still a Nintendo character. Even if he did (which I highly doubt), wouldn't she still need to talk? Ganon isn't exactly going to let her.
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So, no mindhax? Baloshua's points are moot then.Yobobojojo said:
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Doesn't that just mean Demiya isn't as one track minded as initially thought?
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Emiya Alter never felt guilty for killing her because he saw what she would eventually become if left alone. He only felt guilty for slaughtering all of her followers because he saw them as innocent, blinded by her in order to do her bidding. The incident traumatized him so much that he forgot the details of the experience altogether and became the cold sword of justice he is. It's even implied in other materials that he has a diary in order to remember past events in Chaldea, as he constanly forgets things. Sure, you could say that EMIYA ALTER possibly rejoined Kiara out of guilt, but at the time he met her at SERAPHIX, he didn't even remember her. She was still able to turn him against Chaldea with just her words alone, also saying that he would have fallen into hell without her anyway. He didn't need to respond to her.
In the blink of an eye, Robin, Suzuka, Cat and Tristan are killed. It was just as Kiara said; you were in the palm of her hand. The Demon King Goetia was indeed a mighty beast, but that is merely strength. He was only a beast that could destroy. Kiara's power is still weak right now, and as a Beast she is an immature pupa, something fragile and weak in the perception of others. But all beings with wisdom have souls bound by desire. So long as they have desire, they will not be able to defeat her.
This shows how her power still effects those who are seasoned warriors, annihilating them in an instant due to them posessing a form of 'Desire'.
In the blink of an eye, Robin, Suzuka, Cat and Tristan are killed. It was just as Kiara said; you were in the palm of her hand. The Demon King Goetia was indeed a mighty beast, but that is merely strength. He was only a beast that could destroy. Kiara's power is still weak right now, and as a Beast she is an immature pupa, something fragile and weak in the perception of others. But all beings with wisdom have souls bound by desire. So long as they have desire, they will not be able to defeat her.
This shows how her power still effects those who are seasoned warriors, annihilating them in an instant due to them posessing a form of 'Desire'.
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Again, if it needed words to work against a human, it's not going to passively mindhax Ganon.
Context?
Context?
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Oh, and Ganon resists mindhax.
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Unless it's not passive, she isn't going to have time to do it.Yobobojojo said:
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Not on her page.
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Authority of the Beast: As the third Beast representing the Sin of Pleasure, Kiara possesses this Anti-Humanity skill, granting her authority over all humans and those born from them, including heroes, gods, and all life on Earth, magical or not. As a result, it is exceedingly difficult for them to resist her attacks. In addition, this skill is passed onto all of the monsters she gives birth to.
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Wait wait wait.
It only works on humans or related people? Ganon is a demon and was born from Gerudos, and even with verse equal they wouldn't be considered humans as humans actually exist in the verse.
It only works on humans or related people? Ganon is a demon and was born from Gerudos, and even with verse equal they wouldn't be considered humans as humans actually exist in the verse.
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And that isn't resistance negation.
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This is one odd way of debate.
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Well, what you posted is just the level of her mindhax
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We're debating if a giant evil king can feel pleasure...
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This is basically after Chaldea attacked her when she revealed her true nature. She basically snapped her fingers, pulled a Thanos, and wiped them away in an instant. Because, as she so put it, anything that has a desire cannot stand up to her.
Also, just because EMIYA is a human doesn't mean that the feat is any less impressive. He's horribly sick. Not sick as in 'cool', but sick as in he's mentally broken on a level beyond anything a normal human should have. Hell, it's even said before that his train of thought is 'Alien'. That's why he has a reality marble, as only those who have a desire bordering on extreme fanatasism and alien in nature can obtain one. His entire belief system of annihilating the few in order to save the many time and time again is something no human could endure on their own, yet he has. Kiara managing to push him into attempting to kill the protag is a feat you can't just brush off as if she was manipulating a normal human (Though to be fair he was probably going to do it anyway, as he wanted to make sure the knowledge of what happened on Seraphix wouldn't be put to use again).
Kiara also destroyed a demon pillar that tried to take her over. Originally it was in control, but she was eventually able to dominate it so thoroughly that it could do nothing but reside on her pinkie.
Also, just because EMIYA is a human doesn't mean that the feat is any less impressive. He's horribly sick. Not sick as in 'cool', but sick as in he's mentally broken on a level beyond anything a normal human should have. Hell, it's even said before that his train of thought is 'Alien'. That's why he has a reality marble, as only those who have a desire bordering on extreme fanatasism and alien in nature can obtain one. His entire belief system of annihilating the few in order to save the many time and time again is something no human could endure on their own, yet he has. Kiara managing to push him into attempting to kill the protag is a feat you can't just brush off as if she was manipulating a normal human (Though to be fair he was probably going to do it anyway, as he wanted to make sure the knowledge of what happened on Seraphix wouldn't be put to use again).
Kiara also destroyed a demon pillar that tried to take her over. Originally it was in control, but she was eventually able to dominate it so thoroughly that it could do nothing but reside on her pinkie.
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