Jujutsu Kaisen Discussion Page #1

[Arkenis]

First face punch that was intercepted by Kashimo's staff launched him through multiple shipping containers and gave him a nosebleed. Another one launched him agains and drew blood from his mouth. A lot of Hakari's punches were demonstrably heavy as shown by Kashimo's reactions

Right, those are small instances small nose bleeds and mouth bleeds aren't much when we don't know Kashimo's extent for reinforcement besides Hakari and Panda. Take Kashimo's first time engaging with Hakari, he knocked him out quickly, shows Hakari's reinforcement isn't all that impressive and when he does punches, he doesn't cause Kashimo to faint from it. Attacks can be heavy due to his physique while not having much output behind it compared to others in CG like Yuta and Ryu.

 

[Sir_Marvulous]

It doesn't even have to be that though. Damaging post-shibuya Yuji (someone able to tank a hit from Yuta and even match reinforcement with a knife) tanking a hit from Yuji, and being able to damage Uruame should all be enough to get him scaling to the high tiers. The statements are just further support to help make these tiers more solid.

That was when Yuta explicitly holding back. You wouldn't wanna use that for Hakari's scaling lol

 

[Sir_Marvulous]

Right, those are small instances small nose bleeds and mouth bleeds aren't much when we don't know Kashimo's extent for reinforcement besides Hakari and Panda. Take Kashimo's first time engaging with Hakari, he knocked him out quickly, shows Hakari's reinforcement isn't all that impressive and when he does punches, he doesn't cause Kashimo to faint from it. Attacks can be heavy due to his physique while not having much output behind it compared to others in CG like Yuta and Ryu.

You took out the context that Kashimo was attacking Hakari while he was static. No he did not knock him out quickly. More importantly, Hakari launches him with a punch immediately after that, drawing blood. His striking strength is visibly heavy in this fight

 

[Duedate8898]

That was Yuta was explicitly holding back. You wouldn't wanna use that for Hakari's scaling lol

Yuta was trying to kill Yuji, as he had to as per the orders of his binding vow. He doesn't need to hold back, nor does he ever say he's holding back. The only indication is that Yuta waits to summon Rika until after he loses his katana. But Rika doesn't boost his stats, just refuels his cursed energy and gives him access to his copied techinques so his stats should be relative still

 

[M3X_2.0]

I think before using statements, we should just go with feats Hakari has shown for his output instead. What makes Teen Gojo scale to Nanami and Yuji? That Gojo generally has zero SS feats sadly, we know Nanami to be a model Grade 1, doesn't make sense to say Gojo scale to top 5 Grade 1 without any feats. Should keep in mind, the era Gojo was in, little is known, and sorcerers like mei mei, nanami, kusakabe, naobito, ino, etc weren't where they are now

This guy is insane. I told him to not scale Geto to someone like Nanami or Mei Mei because they had the greatest striking strength of the Grade 1s and somehow he seems mad about it. Like what the ****, why do you want to scale characters that have nothing to do with each other scaling wise?

Does anyone really believe Geto can hit as hard as Nanami?

 

[Arkenis]

Nanami being a model grade 1 isn't about him being an exceptionally strong grade 1, especially when you consider that Gojo suggests the scale would be different if he included the big three clans in the discussion

He says maybe. And do we gotta talk about the Big three? the notable showings are Naobito and Naoya, two who couldn't do much with their output against their opponents like Dagon and Choso. Not to say Nanami is above them, just means the statement isn't all that important for my point which is about when Gojo was a teen not in the current story's time period.

It doesn't even have to be that though. Damaging post-shibuya Yuji (someone able to tank a hit from Yuta and even match reinforcement with a knife) tanking a hit from Yuji, and being able to damage Uruame should all be enough to get him scaling to the high tiers. The statements are just further support to help make these tiers more solid.

That's Yuji who didn't want to fight and Hakari's ce trait allows him to do more damage.

You took out the context that Kashimo was attacking Hakari while he was static. No he did not knock him out quickly. More importantly, Hakari launches him with a punch immediately after that, drawing blood. His striking strength is visibly heavy in this fight

I am not ignoring anything, we know Hakari isn't effected by the trait, this doesn't matter. And it was quick, he hit him then kneed him to the head and he started caving.

 

[Giannysmag]

Does anyone really believe Geto can hit as hard as Nanami?

Yes

 

[Sir_Marvulous]

Yuta was trying to kill Yuji, as he had to as per the orders of his binding vow. He doesn't need to hold back, nor does he ever say he's holding back. The only indication is that Yuta waits to summon Rika until after he loses his katana. But Rika doesn't boost his stats, just refuels his cursed energy and gives him access to his copied techinques so his stats should be relative still

He was holding back. Also, only partially manifested Rika came out, so nothing changed for Yuta

 

[M3X_2.0]

Yes

Then you and him are wrong.

 

[Giannysmag]

Then you and him are wrong.

Nah uh

 

[Arkenis]

Geto really has no reason to scale that high, please keep in mind Nanami's ss is on par with Yuji, the kid made to be physically strong even without ce.

 

[Sir_Marvulous]

He says maybe. And do we gotta talk about the Big three? the notable showings are Naobito and Naoya, two who couldn't do much with their output against their opponents like Dagon and Choso. Not to say Nanami is above them, just means the statement isn't all that important for my point which is about when Gojo was a teen not in the current story's time period.

That means Nanami's strength isn't narratively exceptional in that regard

I am not ignoring anything, we know Hakari isn't effected by the trait, this doesn't matter. And it was quick, he hit him then kneed him to the head and he started caving.

"Started caving"? He was busy enjoying the infinite CE bonus of his technique, and after being attacked he immediately responded with a punch that floored Kashimo

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

Right, those are small instances small nose bleeds and mouth bleeds aren't much when we don't know Kashimo's extent for reinforcement besides Hakari and Panda. Take Kashimo's first time engaging with Hakari, he knocked him out quickly, shows Hakari's reinforcement isn't all that impressive and when he does punches, he doesn't cause Kashimo to faint from it.

Saying JP Hakari got knocked out is wrong. Hakari didn't resisted Kashimo attack which is clearly mentioned in TCB (you being John werry translation fan is the big problem here). Hakari was enjoying the infinite CE bonus he got and didn't even tried to resists Kashimo's kick. So stop twisting what's written in the manga. If you have problems with even TCB check the raws.

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

That's Yuji who didn't want to fight and Hakari's ce trait allows him to do more damage.

I'm pretty sure @Duedate8898 is talking about inside fight where Yuji tried to headbutt him but it didn't even scratched Hakari he took it like nothing. Yuji also mentioned he was fighting back that time.

 

[Arkenis]

That means Nanami's strength isn't narratively exceptional in that regard

But it is? And again I am talking about the past not the present for my point overall.

"Started caving?" He immediately responded with a punch that floor Kashimo

Please read the fight. Kashimo says he's caving, we later see this again where Kashimo hits him a couple of times and Hakari's eyes go white and he staggers and gets amped which let him come back.

 

[Arkenis]

I'm pretty sure @Duedate8898 is talking about inside fight where Yuji tried to headbutt him but it didn't even scratched Hakari he took it like nothing. Yuji also mentioned he was fighting back that time.

Yeah no even then Yuji is still holding back. The entire reason is to recruit the guy, not to beat him.

 

[Sir_Marvulous]

But it is? And again I am talking about the past not the present for my point overall.

And I'm talking about the fact that Nanami's strength isn't comparatively exceptional. I don't understand where this is coming from

Please read the fight. Kashimo says he's caving, we later see this again where Kashimo hits him a couple of times and Hakari's eyes go white and he staggers and gets amped which let him come back.

You just switched to a different instance of the fight but okay. I feel like we should just agree to disagree because in the end, they both floor each other multiple times throughout their battle. None of this proves that Hakari's strength isn't up to par with his allies nor that he struggled to make Kashimo bleed

 

[Arkenis]

Saying JP Hakari got knocked out is wrong. Hakari didn't resisted Kashimo attack which is clearly mentioned in TCB (you being John werry translation fan is the big problem here). Hakari was enjoying the infinite CE bonus he got and didn't even tried to resists Kashimo's kick. So stop twisting what's written in the manga. If you have problems with even TCB check the raws.

What are you referring to? TCB and Viz say basically the same thing? TCB says he's ignoring the trait through output and quanity, Viz says his output is high enough he ignores it.

And he was being knocked out. Kashimo hits him and he starts caving.

 

[Arkenis]

And I'm talking about the fact that Nanami's strength isn't comparatively exceptional. I don't understand where this is coming from

Look, I honestly don't know what you're not understanding, my point is, overall Nanami is exceptional as a first grade. There are like three good first grades out of the families we know anything about and they themselves aren't far above Nanami in output. That is all.

You just switched to a different instance of the fight but okay. I feel like we should just agree to disagree because in the end, they both floor each other multiple times throughout their battle

I am showing you my point with it, its an exmaple of Hakari's amps from his domain allowing him to reawaken himself from getting knocked out by Kashimo, that is the point.

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

Please read the fight. Kashimo says he's caving, we later see this again where Kashimo hits him a couple of times and Hakari's eyes go white and he staggers and gets amped which let him come back.

This is base Hakari who can use his CT to wake himself up. But your first argument was regarding JP Hakari who doesn't have that feature.

Also you being wrong on your first claim. Back to back panels. It's clearly mentioned as Hakari lost the will to fight and in previous panel we see him just enjoying the bonus CE.

What are you referring to? TCB and Viz say basically the same thing? TCB says he's ignoring the trait through output and quanity, Viz says his output is high enough he ignores it.

And he was being knocked out. Kashimo hits him and he starts caving.

Check the above scan properly.

Kashimo knocked out Serious JP Hakari is just dishonesty when context says he didn't fought back.

Yeah no even then Yuji is still holding back. The entire reason is to recruit the guy, not to beat him.

Stop fanboying Jon Werr

Spoiler

TCB we see Yuji wanting Hakari to listen to him and he just remembered Megumi words. So inorder to make him cooperate with him he gives a serious headbutt. Yuji eyes gone blank and his head even covered with brushes. He was desperate there.

To support my claim Yuji was fighting back here is it. He clearly mentioned he was fighting back.

 

[Arkenis]

Just to restate so its not confused, all I'm saying is instead of scaling Hakari to Maki or Yuta off statements, we go by feats to see how he scales, he can be likely higher off statements since there aren't much for him.

 

[M3X_2.0]

I just want to know why the **** people think Geto can hit as hard as the guy whose main thing is hitting hard and is said to be exceptional at that

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

He was holding back. Also, only partially manifested Rika came out, so nothing changed for Yuta

It's the case for both of them. Yuji was also stated to be holding back. Dude was also not recovered. I don't think he scales to Yuta here. I'm just saying Yuji was weakened & holding back during this encounter

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

I just want to know why the **** people think Geto can hit as hard as the guy whose main thing is hitting hard and is said to be exceptional at that

Are we talking about Teen Geto or Adult Geto?

 

[M3X_2.0]

Are we talking about Teen Geto or Adult Geto?

Both

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

Both

I can see Adult Geto might having SS by scaling off from his fight against Rika & Yuta but not sure about Teen Geto. Dude just beats up a old guy & paper guy.

 

[Arkenis]

Okay I mean Adult Geto is special grade, his output should be higher than most Grade 1s lets not be too crazy.

 

[Duedate8898]

Are we talking about Teen Geto or Adult Geto?

I mean, yeah I can believe Adult Geto has better SS than nanami. He's fighting against Yuta and Rika and defending them just fine, utilizing a curse tool which is more effective based off of the physical reinforcement you give.

I don't think Nanami is hitting anywhere close to hard enough to be on Rika's level.

And Teen Geto even as a grade 1 showed he wasn't afraid of a physical fight, but I'd probably put him below Nanami.

 

[M3X_2.0]

My issue is Geto scaling directly to Nanami in SS rather than his own feats. He can have like 8-A SS and Nanami 8-B. Did Geto even exchange a word with Nanami?

Also, same goes for Teen Gojo.

 

[Sir_Marvulous]

Also, same goes for Teen Gojo.

His reinforcement did prevent Toji from doing further damage to him with his katana after he stabbed him off guard. Whatever his SS is, it sure as shit should not be unknown

 

[Duedate8898]

My issue is Geto scaling directly to Nanami in SS rather than his own feats. He can have like 8-A SS and Nanami 8-B. Did Geto even exchange a word with Nanami?

Also, same goes for Teen Gojo.

Yeah, when Habari died

 

[Arkenis]

And Teen Geto even as a grade 1 showed he wasn't afraid of a physical fight, but I'd probably put him below Nanami.

You saying this like he went against a notable sorcerer lmao, dude beat up an elderly man.

 

[Duedate8898]

No I say that like how Megumi generally isn't afraid to get physical regardless of who he's fighting. Most sorcerer's we see in the series, regardless of CT will enter CQC

 

[Sir_Marvulous]

Yeah, when Habari died

haibara

I was wondering who tf habari is

 

[M3X_2.0]

@Rosa how tf do you even argue back to guaca

 

[M3X_2.0]

Also need someone to do Meguna's stats because I'm biased towards Gojo (if this mf hit Gojo 4 times I'd be surprised)

 

[Nierre]

@M3X_2.0 When's your next big JJK revisions coming? And what's it covering?

 

[Arkenis]

Oh yeah, I'm not even disagreeing, but SS wise Sukuna probably shouldn't scale to Gojo as Meguna, only dismantle should?

 

[Duedate8898]

Also need someone to do Meguna's stats because I'm biased towards Gojo (if this mf hit Gojo 4 times I'd be surprised)

What does that even mean? He's relative to Gojo, that's so easy.

Oh yeah, I'm not even disagreeing, but SS wise Sukuna probably shouldn't scale to Gojo as Meguna, only dismantle should?

What are you on, Sukuna downscales. How we are about to argue anything but him downscaling from Gojo? He can hurt Gojo with Cleave and Dismantle, he's able to effectively block and counter hit from Gojo without Red, and straight up tanks several blue strikes. Output goes into Reinforcement and Attacks so he should be fine

 

[M3X_2.0]

@M3X_2.0 When's your next big JJK revisions coming? And what's it covering?

CG characters besides Itadori. I think it's safe to revise Gojo's profile now since he's dead for real, and since the thread won't be posted until like next month, I can add any few feat Yuta has with his body.

Same for Meguna.