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Immobile Tournament Match 15 (Dementia vs Wally)
- Thread starter DontTalkDT
- Start date
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Wally once absorbed a reality/plot altering virus. Would that be enough to affect Dementia?
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"Reality altering" is kind of vague, and there's no plot stuff in Anima to confirm that one. To interact Dementia one would need to be able to touch the essence of things, and then bypass its spiritual disturbance power (that may not be difficult to do if one is fast enough). In top of that, Dementia can't be perceived by Wally until he start to suffer the effects of madness (I believe Wally is a sentient being?)
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Yeah, he is sentient. Although, it doesn't matter a lot given that, as a black hole, he basically passively absorbs everything in range.
So Madness wouldn't negatively affect him much and there is no reason he needs to perceive Dementia.
What I mean with reality altering is... eh, I can just show what I mean.
So Madness wouldn't negatively affect him much and there is no reason he needs to perceive Dementia.
What I mean with reality altering is... eh, I can just show what I mean.
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Although madness wouldn't stop its powers, the moment it turns irreversibly mad he would have no way of damaging Dementia, and fall under its command as well. Although, several minutes to days may pass for the madness to take effect.
As for if the blackhole can absorb Dementia based in being able to absorb a plot altering virus, I can not confirm, it can go either way, I guess. If Wally works as the void (Lv 90) spell, then he may resist for few rounds until its destroyed; but void is high magic and pretty big compared to Wally, so that comparation is most likely not suitable.
As for if the blackhole can absorb Dementia based in being able to absorb a plot altering virus, I can not confirm, it can go either way, I guess. If Wally works as the void (Lv 90) spell, then he may resist for few rounds until its destroyed; but void is high magic and pretty big compared to Wally, so that comparation is most likely not suitable.
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I mean, depending on whether the absorption works Wally quite possible has no way to damage it to begin with.
Arguably, once Wally is mad, Dementia can't really affect him in any noticeable anymore either, or can it? Would both be incapacitated?
Arguably, once Wally is mad, Dementia can't really affect him in any noticeable anymore either, or can it? Would both be incapacitated?
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Once completely mad, Wally will fall under Dementia's control, but Dementia can't do anything to damage him by his own; one may argue that Dementia can manipulate it to go into suicide, but this is not Dementia's modus operandi (in verse, is speculated that Dementia's goal is to turn a great amount of people mad so it can gave the First Chaos to materialize), and even if it can made people suicide don't think is possible for a mini-black hole to self-terminate.
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I'm not sure, although Wally definitely can manipulate its hawking radiation somewhat (is stated to express feelings with hawking radiation in the comic)
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Insane people can be more emotional than others, right?
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yeah, but hawking radiation is so small that without a major radiation manip feat, it shouldn't matter for the fight.
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Yeah, we're talking 10-C hawking radiation here. The mass it passively absorbs from the atmosphere would make up for what it can lose in Hawking Radiation.
For all we know Wally is a nigh-eternal being, unable to end his own cursed existence and incapable of doing much of anything but forever observing his surroundings. Going mad might be the best that could happen to him.
But as for the fight: Would Wally going mad without any physically negative effect mean Dementia wins or would the fact that neither can significantly alter the behaviour and physical state of the other mean it's incon?
The specific SBA formulation is "putting him in a state in which he can not harm the other fighter(s) for over a day". Technically both end up in such a state. If one counts madness as harm, one could argue that Wally ends up in the state earlier, assuming Dementia's madness hax works more on the several minutes end than on the several days end against him. However, that is essentially random in my understanding. Although IIRC in the past the interpretation went that "putting in a state" means that just being unable to harm the opponent doesn't count, but that they must be made incapable of doing harm in principle. In which case, neither ends up in such a state.
For all we know Wally is a nigh-eternal being, unable to end his own cursed existence and incapable of doing much of anything but forever observing his surroundings. Going mad might be the best that could happen to him.
But as for the fight: Would Wally going mad without any physically negative effect mean Dementia wins or would the fact that neither can significantly alter the behaviour and physical state of the other mean it's incon?
The specific SBA formulation is "putting him in a state in which he can not harm the other fighter(s) for over a day". Technically both end up in such a state. If one counts madness as harm, one could argue that Wally ends up in the state earlier, assuming Dementia's madness hax works more on the several minutes end than on the several days end against him. However, that is essentially random in my understanding. Although IIRC in the past the interpretation went that "putting in a state" means that just being unable to harm the opponent doesn't count, but that they must be made incapable of doing harm in principle. In which case, neither ends up in such a state.
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I don't think insanity is a valid wincon here when it doesn't actually affect Wally's actions. I'm leaning towards incon here, unless Wally can affect dementia
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bump
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Well, if turning people mad and under your control does not count as wincon, and with Wally apparently having no way of damaging a spirit, then this match tends to count as inconclusive.
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I’ll go with inconclusive fra. Since I don’t think driving someone insane would be considered harm.
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That's 4 for inconclusive then, counting myself.
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I guess if Wally would gain too much mass to eventually disappear, even if his insanity-induced-emotionalness made him release more Hawking Radiation faster, then outliving isn't an option for Dementia, either.
Wally cannot self-determinate through insanity, seemingly, but has no means of defeating Dementia, nor does Dementia have any means of defeating Wally other than trying to abuse inducing an unhealthy mental state.
So if I understand all that correct, then I guess Inconclusive seems reasonable to me, too?
Wally cannot self-determinate through insanity, seemingly, but has no means of defeating Dementia, nor does Dementia have any means of defeating Wally other than trying to abuse inducing an unhealthy mental state.
So if I understand all that correct, then I guess Inconclusive seems reasonable to me, too?
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That seems more or less correct. 5 votes for incon then.
Assuming we all agree on this being inconclusive, can somebody do a coin toss in my stead?
Don't want to do it myself, if my character is involved in the match.
Assuming we all agree on this being inconclusive, can somebody do a coin toss in my stead?
Don't want to do it myself, if my character is involved in the match.
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Incon FRA. I suppose I can do the coin toss if no one else will
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Sounds good.
I'd do it like this: A third party assigns a number to each participant. Whoever's number comes up, wins.
So if say, we did Dementia is 1, & Wally is 2, & the coin flip turned out with a 1, Dementia advances in the tournament. If the coin flip turns out as a 2, Wally advances.
I'd assume by default that Heads = 1, Tails = 2. That sound good to everyone?
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Would SuperDino be the third party here, or would someone else assign the numbers?
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I have not thought of any reason to oppose SuperDino acting as that "third party". Thus, I'm fine with them doing so.
If it's agreed that 1 equals Dementia, 2 equals Wally (I'd use that because that's the order they're listed in the match title.) then I'm in favor of it.
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sounds good
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Willing to do the coin flip for us, then? 1/Heads = Dementia, 2/Tails = Wally.
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Looks like I flipped a 2, so looks like Wally will advance?
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I'll accept your claim on your honor; I have little to no reason to disbelieve, & I have little to no reason to oppose.
Presuming the voting doesn't drastically change by the time we reach 7 votes, I'll support this progression of the tournament so long as other folks are okay with it.
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