Ichigo vs Goku Debunked and 5B Goku is wrong.

[TheAbsoluteOne]

The 5b version of goku used is Downplayed. Kaio-ken x4 goku did not Stalemate and overpower Vegeta's Galick Gun. He was already more powerful than Vegeta when he was going to destroy the Earth.

We'll have to go by Power Levels to show how much more powerful Goku is compared to Vegeta. During the Saiyan Saga, power levels were still relevant and not inconsistent.

Vegeta with a level of 18,000 is capable of shaking the earth just by powering up, and destroying the earth. Making him Planet Level. http://*********.com/Manga/Dragon-Ball/Chapter-229?id=260815#4 http://*********.com/Manga/Dragon-Ball/Chapter-231?id=260817#4

Kaio-Kenx3 Goku with a level of 24,003+ is surperior to Vegeta in Power. This was confirmed by Vegeta Himself http://*********.com/Manga/Dragon-Ball/Chapter-230?id=260816#15

This basically show that Goku is High Planetary Level with Kaio-ken x3

Kaio-Ken x4 Goku has a level of 32,004+, over two times more powerful than Vegeta. Easily making him Planet level+

More Proof. Here Goku uses Kaio-ken x3 to stalemate, and then x4 to overpower.

http://*********.com/Manga/Dragon-Ball/Chapter-231?id=260817#6 http://*********.com/Manga/Dragon-Ball/Chapter-231?id=260817#13 http://*********.com/Manga/Dragon-Ball/Chapter-231?id=260817#14 http://*********.com/Manga/Dragon-Ball/Chapter-231?id=260817#15

I think the revisions should look like this.

Small Planet level (Casually matched and defeated Nappa) Near Planet Level with Kaio-Kenx2 (weaker then Vegeta but at least 2x stronger than Nappa) High Planet Level With Kaio-kenx3 (surpassed Vegeta even with the latter powered up and about about to destroy the Earth) Planet Level+ to Large Planet Level with Kaio-kenx4 (Became 2x more powerful than Vegeta)

Now the reason Goku only stalemated with Kaio-ken x3 was because it put tremendous pain on his body, and he couldn't maintain it for long.http://*********.com/Manga/Dragon-Ball/Chapter-231?id=260817#3 Goku lost in a discussion because they were using a downplayed version. I believe that lost should be taken off. Ichigo is planet level at full power. Goku with Kaio-kenx3 is High Planet level. Ichigo is nowhere near as durable as Vegeta, so goku (even with the strain) would take out ichigo with a couple of blows.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

.....only one question.

What does Ichigo have to do with this?

 

[TheJ-ManRequiem]

The Goku vs Ichigo thread that just passed that probably.

 

[TheJ-ManRequiem]

And does it matter? Goku in the next arc kicks his ass, if youre thaat troubled by it.

And a 2x boost wont go from planet to large planet. It would also still be planet.

 

[Huesito88]

/\

 

[Huesito88]

Ichigo is 3 times baseline at full power

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

I may be mistaken, but, I don't think we use power levels here.

 

[Peter1129]

Even if power lvl is used Ichigo is still stronger than Saiyan Saga Goku anyway.

 

[Huesito88]

We don't use power levels. Also the difference between baseline planet level and baseline large planet level is 45 right?

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

Yeah, 45.5x.

 

[Huesito88]

Ok just double checking

 

[TheAbsoluteOne]

I'm not mad that goku lost, I'm mad that they downplayed him. They said goku loses because he's only planetary level and ichigo is stronger than him. Both statements are wrong, because the 5B version of goku is wrong on his profile. On Goku's profile it says that he used Kaio-ken x4 to stalemate Vegeta which isn't true. He used x3 to stalemate and then x4 to Overpower. Meaning he's Planet Level with x3 and Planet Level+ or at least Higher than Planetary with x4. This means he's stronger than ichigo. The proof is all right here

 

[Kepekley23]

Power levels are not linear. King Piccolo has a power level of 260 and he was still capable of destroying a city. Then Piccolo, with a power level of 408, one-shots the moon with an uncharged, rapidly fired ki-blast. A difference of only ~1.6x. The energy required to destroy that city would be roughly 5 to 10 megatons. The energy required to destroy the moon is easily quadrillions of times above the Tsar Bomba, which could reduce a small mountain like Mt. Saint Helens to 1/5 of its height.

If we go by your logic, Goku wouldn't be Planet-level, he would be outright Star-level. Which is immensely stupid, because even Freeza would need his full-power to starbust.

 

[TheAbsoluteOne]

Power levels are not linear. King Piccolo has a power level of 260 and he was still capable of destroying a city. Then Piccolo, with a power level of 408, one-shots the moon with an uncharged, rapidly fired ki-blast. A difference of only ~1.6x. The energy required to destroy that city would be roughly 5 to 10 megatons. The energy required to destroy the moon is easily quadrillions of times above the Tsar Bomba, which could reduce a small mountain like Mt. Saint Helens to 1/5 of its height.
If we go by your logic, Goku wouldn't be Planet-level, he would be outright Star-level. Which is immensely stupid, because even Freeza would need his full-power to starbust.

Even without power levels, goku would still be High Planet level due to overpowering Vegeta's Galick Gun with Kaio-kenx4.

 

[TheAbsoluteOne]

Freiza destroyed Planet Vegeta with one finger in his first form, and it cannon because Toriyama made a panel for him in the manga. Vegeta Had 10x more gravity then Earth, making it a dwarf star level feat.

 

[Huesito88]

planet level plus requires being 9 times above baseline and even then you can only give a + rating if it was from a calculation that got a 9 times higher then base result

 

[Therefir]

If there was a Goku from namek saga (Pre-zenkai), he would be able to defeat Ichigo easily.

 

[TheJ-ManRequiem]

The Frueza feat was calced at low tier 4 though.

 

[Huesito88]

/\ yep

 

[Therefir]

Goku pre-zenkai can casually one shot characters that stomp characters that stomp characters that are baseline planet level, I don't know why Goku doesn't have a key pre-zenkai.

 

[TheAbsoluteOne]

planet level plus requires being 9 times above baseline and even then you can only give a + rating if it was from a calculation that got a 9 times higher then base result

He stalemated Vegeta's Galick Gun with Kaio-kenx3 (Making him exactly Planet level) and then boosted up his power with x4. Effectively overpowering Vegeta's Planetary Attack, making him still High Planet Level.

 

[Therefir]

That only make him 33% stronger than baseline planet level.

 

[Kepekley23]

Power levels are not linear. King Piccolo has a power level of 260 and he was still capable of destroying a city. Then Piccolo, with a power level of 408, one-shots the moon with an uncharged, rapidly fired ki-blast. A difference of only ~1.6x. The energy required to destroy that city would be roughly 5 to 10 megatons. The energy required to destroy the moon is easily quadrillions of times above the Tsar Bomba, which could reduce a small mountain like Mt. Saint Helens to 1/5 of its height.
If we go by your logic, Goku wouldn't be Planet-level, he would be outright Star-level. Which is immensely stupid, because even Freeza would need his full-power to starbust.

Even without power levels, goku would still be High Planet level due to overpowering Vegeta's Galick Gun with Kaio-kenx4.

That's not how the tiering system works. 2x planet level is still planet level.

 

[TheAbsoluteOne]

That only make him 33% stronger than baseline planet level.

The he's not just baseline planetary is he? Which makes him 33% stronger than ichigo.

 

[TheAbsoluteOne]

Power levels are not linear. King Piccolo has a power level of 260 and he was still capable of destroying a city. Then Piccolo, with a power level of 408, one-shots the moon with an uncharged, rapidly fired ki-blast. A difference of only ~1.6x. The energy required to destroy that city would be roughly 5 to 10 megatons. The energy required to destroy the moon is easily quadrillions of times above the Tsar Bomba, which could reduce a small mountain like Mt. Saint Helens to 1/5 of its height.
If we go by your logic, Goku wouldn't be Planet-level, he would be outright Star-level. Which is immensely stupid, because even Freeza would need his full-power to starbust.

Even without power levels, goku would still be High Planet level due to overpowering Vegeta's Galick Gun with Kaio-kenx4.

That's not how the tiering system works. 2x planet level is still planet level.

I said High Planet level. He can cleary destroy something bigger than Earth if he overpowered an attack that was intended to destroy the earth.

 

[Therefir]

Ichigo is at least x3 times stronger than baseline planet level, I make a thread about Goku is feats pre-zenkai in namek, when he is way about baseline planet level, but still planet level, here.

 

[TheAbsoluteOne]

How is he only baseline Planetary level if he overpowered an attack that actually baseline planetary level. His 5B form should say higher than planetary, but still not strong enough to be considered Planet level+

 

[TheAbsoluteOne]

Ichigo is at least x3 times stronger than baseline planet level, I make a thread about Goku is feats pre-zenkai in namek, when he is way about baseline planet level, but still planet level, here.

Proof that ichigo is 3x stronger than Baseline planet level?

 

[Omimi]

Ichigo is at least x3 times stronger than baseline planet level, I make a thread about Goku is feats pre-zenkai in namek, when he is way about baseline planet level, but still planet level, here.

he is planet level if u r talking about his bankai then it featless

 

[TheAbsoluteOne]

Ichigo is at least x3 times stronger than baseline planet level, I make a thread about Goku is feats pre-zenkai in namek, when he is way about baseline planet level, but still planet level, here.

he is planet level if u r talking about his bankai then it featless

People need to stop adding his bankai into the mix. It has no feats whatsoever.

 

[Random1201]

What's the point of this thread?

 

[TheAbsoluteOne]

What's the point of this thread?

The 5B version of Goku is wrong, so I want it to be revised. Also, the lose for Goku against Ichigo needs to be taken down. Nothing Ichigo has can actually beat goku. His strongest form is featless and got one shot, so it can't even be used. My main problem with Bleach is that no characters in the entire universe have any celestial body feats, so they are planetary based on assumptions, and character statements. The only versions of goku that Ichigo can beat is the Raditz saga, teen, and kid ones. Anyone other version stomps, including the version Unite my Rice used.

 

[Peter1129]

Nothing needs to be removed True Bankai Ichigo had the feat of bisecting Yhwach. Whose dead body according the sequel novel still had enough reiatsu to be able to hold up 3 worlds. The one that's featless is his Merged Hollow True Bankai which we know is far stronger than his True Bankai (which is at minimum 3x baseline planet lvl from what I've heard since he did that while weakened) but to an unknown extent.

 

[Amlad22]

Dude nothing is wrong with the fight. Goku is baseline planet level with Kaio-Ken x3, and 33% above baseline planet level with the x4

Ichigo on the other hand bisected Yhwach on two separate occasions (both when he wasn't at full power) which puts him at least 3x planetary. But he might even be higher.

Even if you said Kaioken x2 Goku was baseline planetary he still wouldn't match Ichigo 3x planetary level of power.

 

[TheAbsoluteOne]

Yhwach is planetary level, I don't know why you guys keep saying 3x planetary. Ichigo is at least Planetary level scaling off of Yhwach. You're basing your argument on character statements, and power scaling. Which is a problem since yhwach (based on actual feats) has never shown any planet busting capabilities.

Once again, bleach has the problem of not showing any actual celestial body feats. Also, the Soul King was there to hold balance and keep the worlds from falling apart. Nothing in the manga implies that he could actually attack with a force great enough to destroy a planet, so how does yhwach absorbing the Soul King make him 3x planetary? There's nothing to back up your argument except with vague character statements. Yhwach also says destroy a "world" which probably means all of life. He was probably just going to fuse all the dimensions and make them overlap, there by destroying "worlds." I highly doubt that he had an actual attack strong enough to destroy the soul society, earth, and hueco mundo all at the same time.

 

[Amlad22]

He's 3x planetary because after absorbing the soul King it was stated and backed up multiple times that Yhwach was going to destroy soul society, Hueco Mundo and Earth. That's three planets.

 

[Omimi]

He's 3x planetary

he is only planetary via cale so i dont know where did u got 3x planetary from

 

[Soldier_Blue]

Yhwach was going to destroy soul society, Hueco Mundo and Earth.

You forgot about hell. That's four realms.

 

[Soldier_Blue]

This has been explained time and again.

The Soul King is just a corpse whose remaining reiatsu is used to stabilize all the realms. Yhwach when alive had the same kind of power - to hold together the realms. His reiatsu is of that level. In fact, in a canon sequel light novel, they do gather up a deceased Yhwach's reiatsu and use it to stabilize the realms (essentially making him the new legitimate Soul King).

As Aizen said, battles in Bleach are just battles of reiatsu. And as Zaraki and the Arrancar have show us, reiatsu is also used for defence (channelling the reiatsu throughout one's body to boost your durability). This is why we rank AP and durability in this series as the exact same (ditto with most Dragon Ball characters).

So this would translate to Yhwach having planet level durability (which makes sense when you consider that he'd need to survive the destruction/merger of all the realms). And Ichigo cut him in half on two occasions. And in the canon light novel which was a sequel to the last arc, it was stated that Ichigo is a candidate for Soul King, further testifying to his reiatsu being as immense as that of Soul King Yhach.

Seriously, if it wasn't for all his hax, Ichigo would have destroyed Yhwach quickly.

 

[Homu_Sweet_Homu]

And Dangai....And whatever that dimension inside of the Garganta ovo