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Actually, here is a better image of numberous stars
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Honkai: Star Rail Discussion Thread
- Thread starter Giannysmag
- Start date
Actually, here is a better image of numberous stars
Kazuma_kuwabara
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This is literally Kingdom Hearts at this point with "every world is his own universe and there is galaxies of them" shenanigans
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Pretty much, but that's what the Data Bank is kinda telling us.
Kazuma_kuwabara
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One of the next 4 star characters called Luka has Asta's from Black Clover Seiyu
So this game has double Asta, which means I will change the voice to japanese
So this game has double Asta, which means I will change the voice to japanese
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So, if what @Furudo_Erika is truth, I will explain what I understand from all the information gathered until now, correct me if I am wrong, I am not very good about the Tier 2 and Tier 1 stuff
The Imaginary Tree and the Sea of Quanta are two multiverses, a single universe in these two multiverses is inifinite in size, I remember it was Welt or Himeko who stated that, and the universe has an infinite amount of galaxies due to the universe being infinite in size, Himeko or/and Welt stated that a galaxy is infinite in size too, and the galaxies are big enough to be universe sized and they had their own separated space-times, and a single galaxy has "countless worlds" or countless universes within itself?
So an Overlord is 2-A or Low 1-C due to destroying an entire universe in the Imaginary Tree?
The Imaginary Tree and the Sea of Quanta are two multiverses, a single universe in these two multiverses is inifinite in size, I remember it was Welt or Himeko who stated that, and the universe has an infinite amount of galaxies due to the universe being infinite in size, Himeko or/and Welt stated that a galaxy is infinite in size too, and the galaxies are big enough to be universe sized and they had their own separated space-times, and a single galaxy has "countless worlds" or countless universes within itself?
So an Overlord is 2-A or Low 1-C due to destroying an entire universe in the Imaginary Tree?
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I guess.
I'm moreso for Low 1-C, as the Chinese text mentions something used for uncountable sets, as:
"It cannot be "countless" in a finite sense, as the word for that is "无数“, which is basically used for a large amount of something which is too much, although still finite, to count. (So it cannot be 2-B) Nor can it be just be simply infinite...as that is 无限. (So, 2-A also doesn't match up).
In fact, "countably infinite" in Chinese is "可数无限", and "uncountably infinite" is "不可数无限"
So again, "不可数" explicitly refers to the uncountability of an uncountable set." (Which would be Low 1-C)
Also if it WAS countable, they would have used "可胜数的世界", NOT "不可胜数的世界"; as that then refers to a countable set.
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So that means an Overlord is really Low 1-C, right? So how many times above the baseline Low 1-C are they then?
Also, is my interpretation about the overall Hoyoverse's cosmology with the information you gave to us is correct is there something wrong?
Also, is my interpretation about the overall Hoyoverse's cosmology with the information you gave to us is correct is there something wrong?
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Probably baseline.
Doesn't seem to be anything wrong.
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So, the scaling would be something like that:
Aeons >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Emanators = Marshal and six generals (Jing Yuan, Yukong, Fu Xuan and others) = Lord Ravagers >> Overlords = Low 1-C?
Wow, this escalated very quickly
Aeons >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Emanators = Marshal and six generals (Jing Yuan, Yukong, Fu Xuan and others) = Lord Ravagers >> Overlords = Low 1-C?
Wow, this escalated very quickly
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Well, mark off Emanators as they do range in power...A LOT.
In fact, Lord Ravagers are the Emanators of Nanook.
The top in the Genius Society are Emanators of Nous; this would include Zandar, Elias, and Herta, among some others.
The History Fictionologists are Emanators of Mythus.
And I'm pretty sure I read Aha makes random ass people Emanators because..."lol". Literally, just for the fun of it.
Abstractly_a_Protagonist
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I have a feeling this is the case, which make the cosmology kinda weird.
Universe (contain) Infinite galaxy, which in turn each galaxy (contain) infinite universal construct that's probably 2-A.
Which mean, despite called a "Universe," it's actually a "Multiverse" that contain another "Multiverse"
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"Universe" here refers moreso to "reality", rather than a single spacetime structure.
In fact Hoyoverse makes a very clear distinction between "universe", "bubble universe", and "The Universe"; with a capital U.
With "The Universe" being akin to the entire Imaginary Tree.
"Universe (contain) Infinite galaxy, which in turn each galaxy (contain) infinite universal construct that's probably 2-A."
It's actually Low 1-C, as the Chinese text states there's an uncountable number of them; not a countable set (which then it WOULD be 2-A if it was countable. But it isn't)
This would make the "galaxy" have Aleph-1 leaves (Low 1-C), not just Aleph-0 (2-A)
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Abstractly_a_Protagonist
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There's also this piece from HI3, which likened the stars to entire universes.
It is also called "a galaxy of parallel universes", as all the "stars" make it look like a galaxy.
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Actually, that reminds me...Cosmic Juggernaut.
IS the Astral Express the Cosmic Juggernaut? Because some of the lore adds up to that.
1: The Cosmic Juggernaut is a train-type Divine Key used to traverse between universes:
Hell, it even looks VERY similar to the Express
Also note the line: "I have a hunch, that the 2nd Divine Key you've made will be recreated one day...by just the right person and for something we can't ever imagine yet..."
Is this taking about Himeko when she repaired the train in HSR?
2: The Cosmic Juggernaut was heavily damaged, but "wasn't beyond repair":
3: Himeko found the Express deserted and heavily damaged, and then repaired it.
I also found something VERY interesting:
Apparently Akivili walked among mortals; adventuring, fighting, and celebrating with them. And that they lived a similar life to mortals.
This...sounds nothing like any of the other Aeons. As "Aeons" don't have a physical form; as they are philosophical concepts.
But Akivili? It states that they basically lived among mortals.
Which begs the question...is Akivili an actual Aeon?
IS the Astral Express the Cosmic Juggernaut? Because some of the lore adds up to that.
1: The Cosmic Juggernaut is a train-type Divine Key used to traverse between universes:
Hell, it even looks VERY similar to the Express
Also note the line: "I have a hunch, that the 2nd Divine Key you've made will be recreated one day...by just the right person and for something we can't ever imagine yet..."
Is this taking about Himeko when she repaired the train in HSR?
2: The Cosmic Juggernaut was heavily damaged, but "wasn't beyond repair":
3: Himeko found the Express deserted and heavily damaged, and then repaired it.
I also found something VERY interesting:
Apparently Akivili walked among mortals; adventuring, fighting, and celebrating with them. And that they lived a similar life to mortals.
This...sounds nothing like any of the other Aeons. As "Aeons" don't have a physical form; as they are philosophical concepts.
But Akivili? It states that they basically lived among mortals.
Which begs the question...is Akivili an actual Aeon?
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Abstractly_a_Protagonist
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Well, I remember somewhere that Aeons was once mortals that ascended to become Aeon.
Most Aeon personality are dictated by their concept (I think?), except Akivili whom has interest on mortal.
Also, Nous was once a computer that "somehow" transcend to become Aeon. That's a point of interest.
A theory of mine...
Is it possible that Aether and Lumine is Akivili? They travel from one world to another, live and connect with mortal of the planet they visited, then move to another star.
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That's the thing though...Akivili went missing after an accident.Well, I remember somewhere that Aeons was once mortals that ascended to become Aeon.
Most Aeon personality are dictated by their concept (I think?), except Akivili whom has interest on mortal.
Also, Nous was once a computer that "somehow" transcend to become Aeon. That's a point of interest.
A theory of mine...
Is it possible that Aether and Lumine is Akivili? They travel from one world to another, live and connect with mortal of the planet they visited, then move to another star.
Whether they died or not is unknown.
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Also.
Himeko: "Upon ascending to Aeon-hood, that being gains power over the Paths, free to choose the allocation of imaginary energy however they wish, while suffering the restrictions of the "Primum Mobile."
Akivili was already restricted by Primum Mobile at this time, so they apparently already entered "Aeonhood".
So they weren't a mortal when walking among those who were.
Himeko: "Upon ascending to Aeon-hood, that being gains power over the Paths, free to choose the allocation of imaginary energy however they wish, while suffering the restrictions of the "Primum Mobile."
Akivili was already restricted by Primum Mobile at this time, so they apparently already entered "Aeonhood".
So they weren't a mortal when walking among those who were.
Abstractly_a_Protagonist
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Interesting.
Akivili could be Lumine and Aether, who went missing following an "incident" when they visited Teyvat.
But that just a theory, a Hoyoverse theory.
Akivili could be Lumine and Aether, who went missing following an "incident" when they visited Teyvat.
But that just a theory, a Hoyoverse theory.
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Damn. From 5-B to 4-A to 3-C to Low 2-C to Low 1-C. How higher can we get?
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That's insane, but knowing how strict our site are, we need more fuel to add furthermore for the tier 1 or otherwise the rejection are likely going to be happening
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Yes, I also know how strict this site is when about to Tier 1 stuff, but even if Low 1-C was somehow denied, I think 2-A has a very good chance of passing if that happens.
Since the Universe, an leaf of Imaginary Tree, contains infinite galaxies, and a single galaxy is infinite in size, and each galaxy contains infinite universes or an 2-A structure
I am talking like this if the Low 1-C is rejected, we could use it to be at least 2-A
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Could you add this to IX's AP section? It would be consistent with what your blog profiles' scaling is showing and be scaled to the other Aeons
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I mean...it kinda blatantly states that's there's an uncountable number of these in the galaxy.
You can't get much more explicit than literally likening it to an uncountable set.
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Also here I explained it cannot be "countless" in a finite sense (so 2-C to 2-B is out for damn sure), nor simply countably "infinite". (Which makes 2-A not really work either)It would actually be 2-A (or even Low 1-C, which I will get to why soon), as the characters used for "countless worlds" is "不可胜数的世界"
Or in English:
"The untamed imaginary energy surges endlessly through space-time vasculature, and forms at its tips "galaxies" that humans can understand — in other words, countless worlds."
As for why this may be Low 1-C...well.
"不可数" is what is use to describe how large "uncountable" is in an uncountable set. Hell, even the word for "uncountable set" is "不可数集".
Now you may ask "what about the "胜""? Well, that's a bit tricky to explain. But it may mean "able to do" in this context.
So: "不可胜" may mean "unable to do", as 不可 means "cannot".
数 means "to count/to number"
So in all, 不可胜数 may mean "unable to count/number"; uncountable.
Which again, 不可数 is what is used to describe the "uncountability" of an uncountable set. So, 不可胜数的世界 may mean "uncountable worlds".
Now it cannot be "countless" in a finite sense, as the word for that is "无数“, which is basically used for a large amount of something which is too much, although still finite, to count. Nor can it be just be simply infinite...as that is 无限.
In fact, "countably infinite" in Chinese is "可数无限", and "uncountably infinite" is "不可数无限"
So again, "不可数" explicitly refers to the uncountability of an uncountable set.
But uncountably infinite. (Which would be Low 1-C)
I mean, "不可数" is even used like this:
It is for uncountable sets, and uncountable nouns.
So "countless" here, does not refer to any actual numbers.
Instead, it means "countless" as in "you literally cannot apply a number to it"; this is also why it is used for uncountable nouns as you cannot apply a specific number to them.
And because cannot apply a number to it, 1-1 correspondence cannot be used for it.
Which 1-1 correspondence is a property of countable sets, but uncountable sets cannot be put into a 1-1 correspondence.
And because it is referring to a set of "世界", it would be referring an uncountable set of "世界"as 世界 is modified by 不可胜数.
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Abstractly_a_Protagonist
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Well, I leave this tier 1 shenanigans translation to those who fully understood it.
I'm more excited on the P&A section.
I'm more excited on the P&A section.
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So a leaf on the Imaginary Tree is a infinite sized Universe and in that Universe contains uncountable Galaxies which are infinite in size.
Did I get that right?
Edit: Actually, someone said the translation of "Galaxy" in CN is actually translated to a leaf of the Imaginary Tree.
So a leaf on the Imaginary Tree is a infinite sized Universe and in that infinite sized Universe contains uncountable leaves which are infinite in size.
So one leaf has an uncountable leaves stacked inside of it infinitely?
Did I get that right?
Edit: Actually, someone said the translation of "Galaxy" in CN is actually translated to a leaf of the Imaginary Tree.
So a leaf on the Imaginary Tree is a infinite sized Universe and in that infinite sized Universe contains uncountable leaves which are infinite in size.
So one leaf has an uncountable leaves stacked inside of it infinitely?
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No no, the "galaxy" is referred to uncountable leaves.
Each leaf is only Low 2-C itself.
Which from how it is described, each "world" you warp to on the Express is an entirely different spacetime; aka...another leaf.
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Check my edit.
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Yes, but in a way you may not expect.
Each "leaf" also functions as MWI, meaning there's infinite parallel timelines inside each leaf.
Each "leaf" also functions as MWI, meaning there's infinite parallel timelines inside each leaf.
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Which the site treats MWI as 2-B to 2-A typically (depending)
Though I personally disagree with that.
Since the irl theory of MWI would actually be Low 1-C at least as it IS uncountable according to physics. With Everett's MWI actually being High 1-B as it explicitly involves infinite-dimensional Hilbert space
Though I personally disagree with that.
Since the irl theory of MWI would actually be Low 1-C at least as it IS uncountable according to physics. With Everett's MWI actually being High 1-B as it explicitly involves infinite-dimensional Hilbert space
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Not sure what MWI means but I get it now.
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Unqver
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You are equivocating,This worldview does not have a multiverse at all. You have not seriously understood this worldview!
Why are galaxies infinite?
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The Imaginary Tree and the Sea of Quanta are two multiverses, a single universe in these two multiverses is inifinite in size, I remember it was Welt or Himeko who stated that, and the universe has an infinite amount of galaxies due to the universe being infinite in size, Himeko or/and Welt stated that a galaxy is infinite in size too, and the galaxies are big enough to be universe sized and they had their own separated space-times, and a single galaxy has "countless worlds" or countless universes within itself.
↑
Read here
Also the fact that "galaxies" here do NOT refer to an actual galaxy, but a collective group of leaves on the Imaginary Tree; aka universes.
This has been stated MULTIPLE times and confirmed through Chinese text as the English localization is full of mistranslations.
This is ALSO stated in the Data Bank under "Imaginary Tree (Theory)"
If a "galaxy" represents a collection of leaves on the Imaginary Tree, than each "star" in said "galaxy" is it's own universe.
And this isn't unique to Star Rail. Hoyoverse makes this analogy ALL THE TIME.
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Unqver
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Mate, I can't read Chinese.
Galaxies can be destroyed by stars, which is called infinity.
I only know the grammar and I am too lazy to look up those words for translation.
Also, you miss what I was saying.
Hoyoverse uses the same word for actual galaxies and these "galaxies". So it can be a bit hard to discern which form is being used without context...and in the context I am talking about, it's the latter of the two.
Which again, the Imaginary Tree in the Data Bank explains this.
Unqver
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In fact,inhonkaiThere are many descriptions that stars can destroy galaxies, if you want to say tree and seas.They have been identified in Chinese as only A single universe。
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Apparently you missed the entire thing on how the worlds in HSR are separated "like leaves are separated by air" (inferring each world in the "galaxy" is an entirely different leaf as they do have their own spacetime...which again, are both stated in the Imaginary Tree in the Data Bank)
But, I don't feel like repeating all that again.
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